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  1. #11
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    I have no doubt in my mind that they tie in...it's honestly really fascinating to look at my blood work with my psychiatrist and see how it all is explained through physical symptoms that i'd never imagine as being "related".

    high cortisol appears to be the biggest culprit. It is linked with the blockage of thyroid hormone and bipolar depression, as well as the fact that the thyroid hormone cannot be properly absorbed without normal levels of iron, Vitamin A and Vitamin D (all are supplements I must take). High cortisol levels are also linked to my poly-cystic ovarian syndrome and my pre-diabetes: central obesity (belly fat) is the physical symptom of both of these things. Additionally, less than regular periods appear to be my body's way of preserving the iron that I so desperately need.

    There's actually a lot more, and i could go on but I think you get my point. It's ALL inter-related. this way of thinking does not appear to be too common in the psychiatric field. When looking for hypothyroidism, many psychiatrists will not test for cortisol, T3 or T4 hormones; only TSH. to me this is a big problem because if so many different issues appear to be tied together and people are continuing to look at them as separate problems, it concerns me how many people are out there not being properly treated. I'd recommend reading the book "Kids in The Syndrome Mix". it's mostly concerning children, but it's a very good intro to the phenomenon of "co-morbid" disorders (bipolar, Asperger's, ADHD, Tourette's, etc.). This is not a simple issue.

    The weight thing has been always been a problem for me. Even as a very physically active kid/adolescent, weight loss was not easy for me. My first depressive episode, looking back, was at 16 in my junior year of high school. However, many of these other problems I can pinpoint as early as age 8; emotionally, I've never felt "normal", i never fit in and it was always pretty obvious that physically, mentally, emotionally, I was different from a lot of my peers.

    sorry for the long posts, but this is a very complex issue that greatly fascinates me, as well as one about which I am very passionate as someone who has to live in this body
    The way that things tie in in the body are always really interesting to me. I wonder if the higher rate of psychiatric diagnoses has to do with some physical/ evolutionary/ or simple environmental changes that we are exposed to. (That, and of course the fact that we know more about these diagnoses and notice them more.) You are right, we do not see a lot of people in the psych field trying to tie psychological and physical symptoms all together. In fact, it is hard to find anyone in the entire medical field who think this way.
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  2. #12
    THIS bitch stringstheory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    The way that things tie in in the body are always really interesting to me. I wonder if the higher rate of psychiatric diagnoses has to do with some physical/ evolutionary/ or simple environmental changes that we are exposed to. (That, and of course the fact that we know more about these diagnoses and notice them more.)
    I wonder this too, really. sometimes I do think capitalism comes into play here, too; it's easier to make money when everyone has something "wrong" with them.

    Also what I wonder sometimes is "higher in relation to what?". How long did we go before identifying disorders as such?

    You are right, we do not see a lot of people in the psych field trying to tie psychological and physical symptoms all together. In fact, it is hard to find anyone in the entire medical field who think this way.
    One thing my psychiatrist mentioned at my last meeting with him was that quite a lot of this stuff is not in texts used at medical schools. It disturbed me greatly to learn that this stuff isn't being taught, considering the complexity of the issue. it was even more disturbing to look at it in the context of pharmaceutical companies financial involvement in medical education programs and standards.
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  3. #13
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    I would say I'm pretty bright but I've never considered myself extraordinarly productive. As an example of my productiveness it is now 08:04 AM and I still haven't slept or studied for the compulsory discussion case about epilepsy at 12:15. It kind of worries me what might arise from my bad planning and sleeplessness plus expected high intake of coffein. I'm guessing wierd behaviour in front of my discussion group.:SaiyanSmilie_anim:

    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    One thing my psychiatrist mentioned at my last meeting with him was that quite a lot of this stuff is not in texts used at medical schools. It disturbed me greatly to learn that this stuff isn't being taught, considering the complexity of the issue.
    Will remember this when I'm through with my studies...

    No omg, seriously who would want me as their doctor..."" I'm going to research + do doctors without borders instead. But still, how do you find these sources ?^^
    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    it was even more disturbing to look at it in the context of pharmaceutical companies financial involvement in medical education programs and standards.
    This is just wrong. (As in, it shouldn't be like this.) But then again the moralic perspective tends to make our beautiful world very ugly if you fret about it too much. Change what you can and then for the rest of it be happy anyway, I guess.

    I'm not sure if I'm actually bipolar but it doesn't seem far-fetched. I skipped out the last entire course at university because I felt like a moron. Looking back a while things really don't look well but I get the feeling mental illness is so stigmatized in sweden people are willing to think just about anything to be able to disbelieve the fact that, actually, you really need help. (Perhaps things are not so different here, but there is the notion that anyone and everyone in the states have a shrink and a lawyer on speed dial. I don't know if we need the lawyer but why say no to the shrink if you do need him/her?)

    The last week that I've been in school was pretty nice though and I could act like a normal person the bigger part of the time. Half of this seems to be because I've learned the value of taking alot of deep breaths all of the time which helps but might seem a bit retarded. Also, practicing not showing any kind of emotion and trying to move as little as possible to practice unreactiveness seems to help. Anyhow, I found these videos about bipolar very interesting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db8AYSrs2kk
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    So apparently I might be epileptic. Thanks brain, keep malfunctioning. I didn't think it could be that bad seeing starfalls in bookshelves. I just thought I was psychotic.

  4. #14
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    I don't know if this is an ENFP thing or just a not knowing the norms thing, but where is the line to what kind of behaviour you cannot express on a website such as this one? I could talk about just about anything here but I don't know where people draw the line to things being to depressive (not for me but as how someone might interpret them), wierd, long winded or just generally not suitable for posting on the forum? Coming from the psychology part of a forum dubbing itself the most politically incorrect forum Sweden has to muster may make the transition more unsmooth.
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    So apparently I might be epileptic. Thanks brain, keep malfunctioning. I didn't think it could be that bad seeing starfalls in bookshelves. I just thought I was psychotic.

  5. #15
    Senior Member guesswho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stringstheory View Post
    I wonder this too, really. sometimes I do think capitalism comes into play here, too; it's easier to make money when everyone has something "wrong" with them.
    What's disturbing is the purpose of the pills. Cure or money.

    Suppose a 1 pill cure would be invented or researched. What would the pharmaceutical companies which have dominated the market do? They do seem to have a lot of money and influence...

    Or maybe I'm wrong and they want to fix people

    However this shouldn't be interpreted as "pills are bad"

  6. #16
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    It depends on type and severity of bipolar disorder. Some people become very "happy" when manic...and those people may destroy their lives by cleaning out their bank account, stealing cars, having promiscuous unprotected sex, et al in severe cases...so being happy-manic isn't all it's cracked up to be.

    Some people become easily angered and high strung when manic, yelling at people, possibly getting into fights, being triggered into rages by very small things, but also can become VERY PRODUCTIVE so they can sometimes look functional...but other times are just so unstable that they can't hardly keep a job.

    Some people experience depression by deadening or flattening effect, and other people can't stop crying.

    Then there are actually forms of bipolar (schizoaffective, for example) which actually involve major delusions and hallucinations.

    Exercise, sleep, rest, avoiding emotionally stressful environments, and proper nutrition go a long way in helping bipolar disorder, but some people really do need medication to function, so that they can live independent fulfilling lives.

    I don't like it when people demonize meds. Yes, some people could potentially be overmedicated, and it's always important to be cautious and well-informed, but mental illness is an illness, it's not going to go away just because you wish it would.

  7. #17
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Exercise, sleep, rest, avoiding emotionally stressful environments, and proper nutrition go a long way in helping bipolar disorder, but some people really do need medication to function, so that they can live independent fulfilling lives.

    I don't like it when people demonize meds. Yes, some people could potentially be overmedicated, and it's always important to be cautious and well-informed, but mental illness is an illness, it's not going to go away just because you wish it would.
    I've been both on meds and off meds over the course of the past 6 or so years... I HATED the meds because they left me feeling like there was no me left in a way, so I quit taking them (and then I lost health insurance so I had no other option ) and decided to stick with the "clean living" approach to countering craziness... I still have some ups and downs, but they are a lot less severe and I can keep them under control relatively well

    it all depends on the person really though, some react better than others to meds or to other approaches!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by King sns View Post
    I know about it on a very basic level. (The manic phases and the depressive phases.) But never really took the time to find out what these people actually go through. Can anyone tell me about the experiences of yourselves or your loved ones? Are there any non-pharmaceutical ways of managing? You can talk about the highest highs or the lowest lows, or anything in between, or about anything related to it. Anyone diagnosed with cyclothymia, and what's that like?
    I really have not the time to go into detail or to read all the posts- but I am expert- Marijuana and Bipolar is combination asking for mania or hallucinations. Marijuana is currently a schedule 1, along with lsd, heroin, and cocaine. (Cocaine can be used for some nasal treatments because of its numbing potential) Currently the AMA is pushing for marijuana to be reclassified as schedule two. No, intelligent doctor would ask that it be regulated such as Tobacco or Alcohol. Why? For starters, the mental health community is scared to death that it will wreak havoc on their patients, which it will. Another alarming factor is that Marijuana induced schizophrenia is at peak levels for known drugs. (reports coming from U.K.) We already spend 1 trillion dollars regulating the marijuana industry and when it gets lowered a level I expect costs to rise significantly. As a person in mental health, I cannot stress to you, how hazardous people with Cycothymia or Bipolar 1, or II is. Cycothymia was introduced to the DSM in 2012 I believe and will not catch on until it is further revised. In order to be diagnosed as an adult, it requires two years of careful observation. Bipolar disorder by comparison is over 100% more common than ccycothymia. True? Not really but it is hard to place people in this category. It is similar to being pre-diabetic, but with a much more fine tuned in specificity. 51% of people go misdiagnosed with Bipolar disorder each year.
    As far marijuana, we are not certain of all the benefits. Sadly, pain management will dole this drug out like it were advil. It is more useful in a more non-specific form (you can get a "high") for seizures. In fact, it is a profound development. Nevertheless, as part of the medical community, psychiatry, I hate the idea of it becoming mainstream. Understand that a large majority of crime is specifically related to marijuana usage. Of course, you have the theory, which came first, the chicken or the egg. Some people like to argue that but no doctor with a grain of sand would.

    Simply put, you do not Cycothmia, in all likelihood as characterized in the latest DSM. Surely, it will be revised, just takes time. However, we have an opposite problem here- instead of being ADD- transferred to ADHD- A hopeless attempt to narrow the field. The opposite needs to be done here.

    Marijuana lowers your i.q. by roughly 8 points, which is monumental, and it causes a good deal of inflammation making it bad choice for somebody who is pre-diabetic or has diabetes. FACT- it will become just as legal as alcohol or Tobacco... The federal government may be against it now, but things will alter. The South of America will progress the slowest.

    Go to Kindle book and look up World of Marijuana by M.T.B. I wrote an easy to read guide that will tell a wealth of information... however, forums like these.... *shakes head* (do not have time to edit)

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by King sns View Post
    I know about it on a very basic level. (The manic phases and the depressive phases.) But never really took the time to find out what these people actually go through. Can anyone tell me about the experiences of yourselves or your loved ones? Are there any non-pharmaceutical ways of managing? You can talk about the highest highs or the lowest lows, or anything in between, or about anything related to it. Anyone diagnosed with cyclothymia, and what's that like?
    I really have not the time to go into detail or to read all the posts- but I am expert- Marijuana and Bipolar is combination asking for mania or hallucinations. Marijuana is currently a schedule 1, along with lsd, heroin, and cocaine. (Cocaine can be used for some nasal treatments because of its numbing potential) Currently the AMA is pushing for marijuana to be reclassified as schedule two. No, intelligent doctor would ask that it be regulated such as Tobacco or Alcohol. Why? For starters, the mental health community is scared to death that it will wreak havoc on their patients, which it will. Another alarming factor is that Marijuana induced schizophrenia is at peak levels for known drugs. (reports coming from U.K.) We already spend 1 trillion dollars regulating the marijuana industry and when it gets lowered a level I expect costs to rise significantly. As a person in mental health, I cannot stress to you, how hazardous people with Cycothymia or Bipolar 1, or II is. Cycothymia was introduced to the DSM in 2012 I believe and will not catch on until it is further revised. In order to be diagnosed as an adult, it requires two years of careful observation. Bipolar disorder by comparison is over 100% more common than ccycothymia. True? Not really but it is hard to place people in this category. It is similar to being pre-diabetic, but with a much more fine tuned in specificity. 51% of people go misdiagnosed with Bipolar disorder each year.
    As far marijuana, we are not certain of all the benefits. Sadly, pain management will dole this drug out like it were advil. It is more useful in a more non-specific form (you can get a "high") for seizures. In fact, it is a profound development. Nevertheless, as part of the medical community, psychiatry, I hate the idea of it becoming mainstream. Understand that a large majority of crime is specifically related to marijuana usage. Of course, you have the theory, which came first, the chicken or the egg. Some people like to argue that but no doctor with a grain of sand would.

    Simply put, you do not Cycothmia, in all likelihood as characterized in the latest DSM. Surely, it will be revised, just takes time. However, we have an opposite problem here- instead of being ADD- transferred to ADHD- A hopeless attempt to narrow the field. The opposite needs to be done here.

    Marijuana lowers your i.q. by roughly 8 points, which is monumental, and it causes a good deal of inflammation making it bad choice for somebody who is pre-diabetic or has diabetes. FACT- it will become just as legal as alcohol or Tobacco... The federal government may be against it now, but things will alter. The South of America will progress the slowest.

    Go to Kindle book and look up World of Marijuana by M.T.B. I wrote an easy to read guide that will tell a wealth of information... however, forums like these.... *shakes head* (do not have time to edit)

  9. #19
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    ^^suspicious thing is suspicious
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  10. #20
    Senior Member Frosty's Avatar
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    My dad has bipolar, and his moods come sort of in blocks. He'll have periods, a few months, where he is almost constantly angry. He'll throw things, hit walls, name call, scream, and go out of his way to pick fights. These periods are generally mixed with a sort of overall hopeless sadness where he attempts to look outwardly for sources to pinpoint reasons for what he is feeling. "You ate the last brownie. You have no respect for me, you bitch. I'm just invisible in my own house, a piece of furniture, no one ever thinks about me or cares about me." Examples like that happen daily during those times. Anger comes out rooted from the depression. He can't get a handle on it, I suppose it is overpowering. Though, afterwards, apologies come flowing out, emotional self degrading ones-occasionally still tinted with hints of blame, as it must be difficult to shoulder something of that magnitude totally on yourself, have to parse it up.

    Generally though, during those periods, while anger is difficult for those around him to deal with, it seems so uncontrollable, that I would imagine it to be just as painful if not more so for him. It is like an infantile urge to be noticed, to exert himself, and it is difficult to remain angry. It is almost as if you have to take whatever is said with a grain of salt and an internal smile, just realizing that his opinion at the moment does not necessarily reflect reality-just his emotionally affected momentary poisoned interpretation. Anyways, during these periods he takes constant naps. Constant ones, skipping work, refusing to leave the house except on rare occasions, sort of hiding away from anything and everything and expecting the family to take the place of filling his entire world. Speeches, usually consisting of thoughts along the lines of "all you can hope for in life is to starve off the misery, be content with dying, and laugh at those around you who think that there is something more"(just made that up, but a fairly decent reflection on his oftentimes multiple hour long self soothing by way of expectation,~and concurrently self limiting)
    My mom takes the worst of everything, (well actually I generally do because I remain the calmest and am therefore the biggest 'challenge' and because I am the most similar to him), but she takes the most from the least. She is the most easily affected, and her emotions just usually end up escalating the situation. She gets all emotionally involved and tries to fix things that are just beyond her capacity to fix. She picks one way to approach a problem, and when that doesn't work she gets frusterated fast-which adds fuel to the fire. I can just smile and nod jump into another world, mutter a de-escalating word now and then, she can't, she is all in. Anyways, these periods do tend to coincide with winter.

    Then there are the times when he is incredibly active and caring and nice and smart. We can have some pretty awesome conversations, fast paced and usually pretty intense(at least for me). Almost a bit too active though. He will get into an activity and it will become his fix, his obsession, probably a bit of a vent for any frusteration. Right now~he is in one of these periods now~ it is running. He runs all of the time, but he has an issue with realizing when to stop. He'll come home after running 18 miles(not exaggerating, numbers like that), toes black and blue, back busted, just way more worn out then he really probably should be at his age, but whatever floats his boat at the end of the day. Life is too short, and if there is some emotional satisfaction derived from that then you just have to focus on the sweet and ignore the bitter. Always moving, always wanting to do things, extremely family oriented.

    He is bipolar 2 and probably an INTJ 9w8 (though it is difficult to tell, I would say ISTP with how he acts today, but I am going by how he says he was before diagnosis. The bipolar clouds things. Anyway the Se could just be becoming a focus with age, it is starting to emerge stronger as he is developing the inferior~possibly) by the way.

    Don't necessarily know what it is like having bipolar, but know what it is like living with it. I can imagine it like an emotionally variable storm though. Just when you think you have found a way to deal with the weather, it changes and not having the resources to deal with it yourself you blame what you consider the outside source~whatever you percieve to be your god or causing your problems, in this case the family.

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