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  1. #31
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by colmena View Post
    I was a very dominating child. My parents still call me "Boss".

    I'd like to better my ability at helping people learn for themselves. Show them the things I encountered that led to my values, rather than just saying mine are "right".

    I guess it stems from a lack of trust; that humanity can't think for themselves. And when you study psychology, the lack of independent thought is quite obvious. The Century of the Self is a good example.

    I guess political/business manipulation will topple on itself when education has been pushed far enough.
    Aha, so one of them finally outs self! Gotcha.

    Lack of trust. hmm . . . I can see that, but is it because you were given reason not to trust or is it just a general lack of faith in people?
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  2. #32
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    It's 'cause, some people are inconsiderate.
    They don't know that I'm after different things than they are. When I don't succeed in accomplishing what they thought I wanted to, they try to correct me.
    But what if you are after the same goal, yet the controlling intervenor cannot leave you to meet at the designated point, and instead disregards your boundaries to make sure you are there the way they want you to get there? why.the.hell?
    hoarding time and space
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  3. #33
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    That sounds more like a compulsion.
    But this thread sounds more like a gripe.

    Things are never what you think they are anymore.
    I'm getting confused.

  4. #34
    now! in shell form INA's Avatar
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    Yes, it does seem compulsive to me. If I did not have a habit of being late for our meet ups, but she has to make sure I'm up when she thinks I should be up, and must call, then I have to wonder if she's in control of her faculties. This reasoning is more convincing to me because she hung up when I picked up, suggesting that she's aware that this was boundary crossing, but went ahead and did it anyway.
    hoarding time and space
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    — Antoine de Saint-Exupery

  5. #35
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IF3157 View Post
    As someone who has been on the receiving end of tyranny exercised for the tyrants benefit (which is what I'm most interested in here), I can say that it's not a bunch of roses, either.

    It is somewhat related to that phenomenon of arguing with a brick wall. I tend to avoid it. If it is clear to me the point is not to discuss but simply to state and defend by any means one position and there will be no budging on it, I am not interested. They go their way and I go mine. Yet I've seen people who get into the same lengthy and fevered discussion with the same people over and over again and wonder why they do it if they don't have to.
    Yeah, I've had an intense experience of this over the past year or so with a certain INFJ priest... just absolutely no willingness to budge, to move, to alter anything at all on account of my views or anyone else's, as far as I can tell. Even when the majority of the congregation clearly is against him, is clearly in favour of some improvement I've suggested that's in everyone's interest... nope. This guy has his routine, his way of doing things, he likes everything *just so* and it's like that for a REASON dontcha know... (ha, yeah, the reason being it makes things easier for HIM), so don't even bother going there. :steam:

    I don't think this one is about type so much as just selfishness and stubbornness, which can infect any person of any type...
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  6. #36
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IF3157 View Post
    But what if you are after the same goal, yet the controlling intervenor cannot leave you to meet at the designated point, and instead disregards your boundaries to make sure you are there the way they want you to get there? why.the.hell?
    Who is this again?

    The motivation potential changes based on context.
    (A parent or boss might do this for different reasons than a friend.)

    My INTJ boss used to be a control freak, until he had heart issues.
    It taught him a BIG lesson on how to "let go."
    Now he's been the opposite (in the good ways) for five years or so.

    (Although occasionally anytime there is a problem he immediately tries to Te the problem and tell me exactly how to solve it... based on HIS style... and it comes across as a command. e.g., "Call so-and-so on the phone right now and ask them X, Y, and Z.")
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #37
    Senior Member Anja's Avatar
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    With some people I think it might be OCD. It certainly is a personal sense of security issue - manipulating "things" to calm one's self.
    "No ray of sunshine is ever lost, but the green which it awakes into existence needs time to sprout, and it is not always granted to the sower to see the harvest. All work that is worth anything is done in faith." - Albert Schweitzer

  8. #38
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    OCD is a myth.
    Jamie and Adam proved it.

  9. #39
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Who is this again?

    The motivation potential changes based on context.
    (A parent or boss might do this for different reasons than a friend.)

    My INTJ boss used to be a control freak, until he had heart issues.
    It taught him a BIG lesson on how to "let go."
    Now he's been the opposite (in the good ways) for five years or so.

    (Although occasionally anytime there is a problem he immediately tries to Te the problem and tell me exactly how to solve it... based on HIS style... and it comes across as a command. e.g., "Call so-and-so on the phone right now and ask them X, Y, and Z.")
    I always like to list conceit, a specific brand of it, as the cause.
    That is, to my controlling father, I mention how conceited he is for thinking that I wanted to do things his way, or that I had the same goals, and that his judgement is better etc.

    But that might be because I have some kind of odd obsession with conceit.

  10. #40
    seor member colmena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IF3157 View Post
    Aha, so one of them finally outs self! Gotcha.
    I've only just seen the thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by IF3157 View Post
    Lack of trust. hmm . . . I can see that, but is it because you were given reason not to trust or is it just a general lack of faith in people?
    I provided a handy semi-colon and part-explanation. Lack of independent thought, manipulation, lack of respect for nature etc.

    I can't think properly because people are making noise around me.
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    Ti Ne Fi Ni

    -How beautiful, this pale Endymion hour.
    -What are you talking about?
    -Endymion, my dear. A beautiful youth possessed by the moon.
    -Well, forget about him and get to bed.
    -Yes, my dear.

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