Controlling people

[INA]

I always like to list conceit, a specific brand of it, as the cause.
That is, to my controlling father, I mention how conceited he is for thinking that I wanted to do things his way, or that I had the same goals, and that his judgement is better etc.

But that might be because I have some kind of odd obsession with conceit.

Me too, a lil bit.
With this girl, she wasn't generally conceited, though. And her border crossing was sometimes to be really sweet.

I provided a handy semi-colon and part-explanation. Lack of independent thought, manipulation, lack of respect for nature etc.

I know - I was looking for more information on the distrust you mentioned as applied to individuals (generic v. particularized), but no worries. Noisy people throw me off, too.

 

[Nocapszy]

Me too, a lil bit.
With this girl, she wasn't generally conceited, though. And her border crossing was sometimes to be really sweet.

True enough.

I am conceited, usually appropriately, and I'm the least controlling person I know.

 

[colmena]

I know - I was looking for more information on the distrust you mentioned as applied to individuals (generic v. particularized), but no worries. Noisy people throw me off, too.

I don't really distrust individuals, and I don't control them. I show them what I'm into, if they identify, that's cool. If they don't, that's cool.

I'm patient and respectful of people I'm fond of, and I expect the same in return. But this is more relationships than psychology.

What sort of dynamic are you inquiring about? I've mentioned individuals and the masses, I haven't really dipped into other circles.

 

[Totenkindly]

I always like to list conceit, a specific brand of it, as the cause. That is, to my controlling father, I mention how conceited he is for thinking that I wanted to do things his way, or that I had the same goals, and that his judgement is better etc.

My dad's the same way.

Then again, he grew up in a social environment (40's/50's) where the father was "God," and he was expected to be unflappable, not be wrong, make decisions for the family, discipline the children ("bad cop"), etc.

And his dad was an anal ISTJ engineer. Yeah.

But that might be because I have some kind of odd obsession with conceit.

I'd say my dad's pretty conceited too. He's always right... because his ego is so weak he can't afford to be wrong, and he doesn't have enough discipline to deprive himself so as to indulge reasonable compromises with others.

 

[Giggly]

It sounds bad but some people are better off being controlled. *hides*

 

[INA]

I'm patient and respectful of people I'm fond of, and I expect the same in return. But this is more relationships than psychology.

Hmm . . . you're probably less able to shed light on this type of controlling behavior then.

What sort of dynamic are you inquiring about? I've mentioned individuals and the masses, I haven't really dipped into other circles.

Ok.
This kind, which I've seen in people before and after the girl described:

I had a friend in college, who, if I agreed to do early breakfast the next morning, would not leave it to me to get up and meet in time. She would give me an unsolicited wake up call to make sure (but hang up as soon as I picked up).

Yes, it does seem compulsive to me. This reasoning is more convincing to me because she hung up when I picked up, suggesting that she's aware that this was boundary crossing, but went ahead and did it anyway.

It sounds bad but some people are better off being controlled. *hides*

Another one emerges!
Please say more.

 

[Totenkindly]

It sounds bad but some people are better off being controlled. *hides*

*gets out handcuffs*

Hey, get back here, you!

.. you're probably right.
But I realize I do have a few values.
One is that I believe possession of another (i.e., domination) is evil personified.
(Probably because it negates choice and thus negates love.)

 

[Kora]

I used to think that life was to control others or being controlled. Now... I don't know anymore.

 

[Giggly]

*gets out handcuffs*

Hey, get back here, you!

.. you're probably right.
But I realize I do have a few values.
One is that I believe possession of another (i.e., domination) is evil personified.
(Probably because it negates choice and thus negates love.)

On the contrary, you have to trust someone to allow them to possess you. And trust breeds love.

 

[Anja]

OCD is a myth.
Jamie and Adam proved it.

Oopsie. Must've missed it.

I reverse my stance.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Since I am T 90% J 90% with very strong Te I have invited myself into this thread.

What exactly do you want to know?

(I will not run away)

 

[Anja]

On the contrary, you have to trust someone to allow them to possess you. And trust breeds love.

Or fear them. . .

 

[INA]

Since I am T 90% J 90% with very strong Te I have invited myself into this thread.

What exactly do you want to know?

(I will not run away)

Read the thread. The behavior I mean is summarised here:
http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...opics/8838-controlling-people.html#post331008

On the contrary, you have to trust someone to allow them to possess you. And trust breeds love.

 

[Totenkindly]

On the contrary, you have to trust someone to allow them to possess you. And trust breeds love.

No, that is not "possession" as I refer to it.
You cannot "own" another person.
Existentially, the truth is we're all completely separate and solely responsible for our own choices.
(although sometimes we lie to ourselves so as to avoid responsibility for our decisions and/or to avoid the loneliness of being inherently separate)

Even with what you describe, you are still in charge of yourself because you CHOOSE to place yourself in the care of another. That can still be part of "love" -- both in that you trust someone that much AND in that they are willing to care for you.

The sort of possession I describe is when someone dominates someone else who is either naive or unwilling.

 

[colmena]

Ok.
This kind, which I've seen in people before and after the girl described:

I'd more likely be on the receiving end of that.

 

[Giggly]

It helps to see the good in people.

No, that is not "possession" as I refer to it.
You cannot "own" another person.
Existentially, the truth is we're all completely separate and solely responsible for our own choices.
(although sometimes we lie to ourselves so as to avoid responsibility for our decisions and/or to avoid the loneliness of being inherently separate)

Even with what you describe, you are still in charge of yourself because you CHOOSE to place yourself in the care of another. That can still be part of "love" -- both in that you trust someone that much AND in that they are willing to care for you.

The sort of possession I describe is when someone dominates someone else who is either naive or unwilling.

Meh. Sounds boring.

 

[Enjamin]

I don't sit well with people telling me what to do, tends to annoy me and I tend to ignore them....and then manipulate them to do what I want.

 

[Virtual ghost]

Read the thread. The behavior I mean is summarised here:
http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...opics/8838-controlling-people.html#post331008

I was thinking that you are actualy intersted in some deeper details.

I will talk from my own experiance.

This is in short.

It is not lack of self controle at all it is exactly the contrariwise.
You are totally in control over yourself. What means that it is very likely to be ambitious or want to achieve some goal(s).

People usualy are not so (let say TJ) so you will have to push them to achieve the goal.(what is usually in their interest too)

Since I am also strong in N I can see things before they happen.
In that case I need to push things in the direction that looks like the right way.

In some cases people are irresponsible so you will again have to create pressure.

Many times I have seen how Ps organize things and many times they can't stay out of the harms way. Or do the right thing so your intervention is needed.
I know how all of this sounds so egoistic but that is how I see it.

 

[INA]

It is very egotistical. Being able to foresee and plan, why don't you have contingencies for if they fuck up- control your options? Absent reason (e.g. prior acts) that they will fuck up, why meddle?
In short, where do you get off?

 

[Giggly]

IF3157, do controlling people try to control you personally?