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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    Is it considered being in a shell if one speaks, but nobody listens?
    Uh no, not really... I think everyone gets that feeling cos I think people, generally, don't fucking listen no matter how outgoing you are lol
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
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  2. #52
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    Uh no, not really... I think everyone gets that feeling cos I think people, generally, don't fucking listen no matter how outgoing you are lol
    Then what's the POINT of getting out of a shell and saying what fucking needs to be said if it doesn't do a damn thing?!
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Condor View Post
    The more people try to "bring someone out of their shell" (no matter what the shell is) the more those same people seem to need someone else who is just like them.
    I concur with this. This is also my experience.
    When I've had a friend whom I've noticed is quite shy, my first thought is to figure out whether he's happy that way, first off. Then, if it transpires that maybe he is a bit on the lonely side and would like to be a bit more confident socially, the LAST thing I do is say to him "you should come out of your shell" or "just get out there and MEET PEOPLE and it'll come naturally" and that sorta crap.
    If someone lacks confidence it's often because they haven't had a big enough sample of people responding to them positively. Accepting them
    So my thing that I do is I just accept them. I don't say "I'm accepting you as a PROJECT" but "I accept you as a human being, sane, reasonably intelligent and able to make your own decisions".
    Often by simply just having someone around who accepts them for who they are, doesn't judge them, likes to hang out with them and doesn't try to change them, this can cause a person to change from the inside of their own accord, change in the sense of become more confident in themselves, and I've noticed most of the people I've known like this have gradually become more outgoing or at least less anxious.
    And many of them have said to me subsequently that it was me simply accepting them as they were that gave them the vote of confidence in their worth as a person being something others could perceive or appreciate.

    FFS, just let the guy hang out, let him do what he likes doing. Don't drag him out and try to convert him into a mini-you. If you're doing it for him, rather than for your own gratification, this should make all the difference.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  4. #54
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Yeah, I always try to gage how much people are actually listening to what I'm saying and shut off if the listening does not happen. Why waste breath on those who don't care...
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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    I accept no responsibility, what so ever, for the fact that I exist; I do, however, accept full responsibility for what I do while I exist.

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  5. #55
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    yeah, and why drag someone out if they're not ready?
    I reckon if someone lacks confidence in their own social judgement, telling them that you don't even trust their judgement of their own mental/emotional state of readiness to 'get out there', it only undermines their self-confidence even more... perhaps... lol
    If you're gonna challenge someone's self-image you've got to do better than just saying "oh no I think everyone loves you, no don't put yourself down, you're a great person", that's just generic BS that nobody buys. You've got to give them some evidence and a vote of genuine confidence like "well, I thought you handled Bob pretty well earlier today" and give reasons or "Sue said to me she always likes it when you're around, she finds you relaxing because you're not as loudmouthed as me", but it's gotta be genuine, gotta be true.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  6. #56
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    yeah, and why drag someone out if they're not ready?
    I reckon if someone lacks confidence in their own social judgement, telling them that you don't even trust their judgement of their own mental/emotional state of readiness to 'get out there', it only undermines their self-confidence even more... perhaps... lol
    If you're gonna challenge someone's self-image you've got to do better than just saying "oh no I think everyone loves you, no don't put yourself down, you're a great person", that's just generic BS that nobody buys. You've got to give them some evidence and a vote of genuine confidence like "well, I thought you handled Bob pretty well earlier today" and give reasons or "Sue said to me she always likes it when you're around, she finds you relaxing because you're not as loudmouthed as me", but it's gotta be genuine, gotta be true.
    ...what?
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  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    ...what?
    LOL I'm talking about better ways to achieve the end result of someone coming out of their shell, or should I say, of helping them achieve it themselves than the "throw into deep water" techniques discussed earlier. And basically saying that peppering someone with generic buzzwords, empty compliments (i.e. things you have no proof for and are just saying to make them feel better) doesn't help boost people's confidence IME. But raising specific points of specific things they did that contradict their "I'm useless with people" self-image can help more...
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  8. #58
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by substitute View Post
    LOL I'm talking about better ways to achieve the end result of someone coming out of their shell, or should I say, of helping them achieve it themselves than the "throw into deep water" techniques discussed earlier. And basically saying that peppering someone with generic buzzwords, empty compliments (i.e. things you have no proof for and are just saying to make them feel better) doesn't help boost people's confidence IME. But raising specific points of specific things they did that contradict their "I'm useless with people" self-image can help more...
    Deep water does not work. In fact, with a lot of people, even shallow water does not work. Remember, people can drown in two inches of bathwater. I almost did, and now I'm too afraid to wash my face.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    Deep water does not work. In fact, with a lot of people, even shallow water does not work. Remember, people can drown in two inches of bathwater. I almost did, and now I'm too afraid to wash my face.
    Totally. That was... deep, maaaan.

    That's what I mean about letting a person make their own decisions about when they're ready and not insulting their intelligence. They're just shy ffs, they're not retards, they're not fucking stupid. Don't talk to shy people like they're morons. Just cos I might not have the right experience to know certain social conventions doesn't mean you should talk to me like I'm ten years old and treat me like some mental patient who isn't fit to decide things for themselves.
    Ils se d�merdent, les mecs: trop bon, trop con..................................MY BLOG!

    "When it all comes down to dust
    I will kill you if I must
    I will help you if I can" - Leonard Cohen

  10. #60
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    Deep water does not work. In fact, with a lot of people, even shallow water does not work. Remember, people can drown in two inches of bathwater. I almost did, and now I'm too afraid to wash my face.
    Probably would help if you had access to better water; sewage is not fun swimming in.
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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