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  1. #21
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I don't know its funny
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadOctopus View Post
    Holden Caulfield is the whiniest, most insufferable little bitch in the history of literature. He calls everyone "phonies", and yet fails to realize that everything about him is an affectation: his superiority, his disdain for others, and even his fashion statement with his trademark red hunting cap. It's all a facade to hide the fact that he's just a very insecure little boy.

    If Mole really regards Holden Caulfield as a character worth emulating, he might want to look harder.
    His flaws are his appeal. He's a reminder to all his readers that not everyone in the world is a mindless, colorless dick who serves no purpose but to shovel carcasses into the murder machine. He feels pain. That's the mark of a living thing.

    And, he didn't just complain, he critically analyzed the things he hated and what needed to be changed about them.


    My literacy class told me his depressive issues were completely because of his brother's death and nothing else.

  3. #23
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    It's actually a moral issue. The false self has failed to integrate itself and so has no integrity. And without integrity, there is no morality.

  4. #24
    Suave y Fuerte BadOctopus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nihilogen View Post
    His flaws are his appeal. He's a reminder to all his readers that not everyone in the world is a mindless, colorless dick who serves no purpose but to shovel carcasses into the murder machine. He feels pain. That's the mark of a living thing.

    And, he didn't just complain, he critically analyzed the things he hated and what needed to be changed about them.


    My literacy class told me his depressive issues were completely because of his brother's death and nothing else.
    Don't get me wrong; I felt for Holden. I really did. His sense of alienation, his grief for his brother, all of it. But his attitude throughout the whole book is that of a spoiled, self-entitled brat who thinks everyone who doesn't share his views of the world must be a "phony". He's not a philosopher; he's an elitist. By looking down on everyone, he's guilty of possessing the same snobbery that he attributes to others. He's a champion of innocence, and yet admits to being a compulsive liar. He's the ultimate hypocrite.

    Sorry, rant over. I just hate that book so much. lol
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  5. #25
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadOctopus View Post
    Don't get me wrong; I felt for Holden. I really did. His sense of alienation, his grief for his brother, all of it. But his attitude throughout the whole book is that of a spoiled, self-entitled brat who thinks everyone who doesn't share his views of the world must be a "phony". He's not a philosopher; he's an elitist. By looking down on everyone, he's guilty of possessing the same snobbery that he attributes to others. He's a champion of innocence, and yet admits to being a compulsive liar. He's the ultimate hypocrite.

    Sorry, rant over. I just hate that book so much. lol
    I have not read the book but I have had multiple explain this and express this sort of view. From what's been explained to me about his behavior, I've come to the conclusion that I would DESPISE his character with a burning passion. I can not stand people like that, at ALL. I'm glad I didn't have to read this book in high school because I would have just been a ball of rage in class discussing it, and I'd very likely be unable to finish it. If I can't like the main character in a book, I am unable to read it.

    He really does sound like the epitome of a shitty person.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
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  6. #26
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    I have noticed in life that intuitives are especially capable of having self-concepts that don't jive with reality. They can have a completely constructed abstract self that is consistent in word and ideas, but when applied to the concrete world, they can be completely different. It's also possible to have a negative, abstract self that doesn't coincide with reality. Hypocrisy runs deep with people, and perhaps in some cases can save their sanity, but it definitely gets out of hand and can make life more difficult when people keep getting results based on their behavior and feel confused about those outcomes based on their self-concept. Coherency between the ideal and the real is terribly important for long-term happiness and well being for individuals and for everyone around them.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

    I want to be just like my mother, even if she is bat-shit crazy.
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