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  1. #11
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Of course enticing the enemy to harm themselves is age-old.

    Sun Tzu, in his Art of War, an ancient Chinese text, recommends psychological warfare as invisible and effective.

    Psychological warfare has been carried out by the military for millenia, after all, the first casualty of war is truth.
    But your form of psychological warfare is neither effective nor invisible. Instead of trolling, let's call it Molling.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  2. #12
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I've been recently gas lighted. because recently people will tell me i had these lengthy conversations with them and insist that I said something that I did not. and I have absolutley no memory of the conversation what so ever. like I doubt those conversations have even happened.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  3. #13
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Sometimes people try to get under my skin or act passive-aggressively towards me. There is a consistent enough pattern of certain behaviors for me to believe that it is actually taking place. In person, it will manifest itself in muttered under breath comments. If I confront them about it, they will deny it. Therefore, I can either ignore it, and go ahead and do it right back. I'll admit that I get more satisfactions out of the latter. It's not saintly behavior, but I do have little patience for passive-aggression from people who consider themselves to be morally superior to me, because of, say, strong religious, political convictions (or really any thing that links them to some kind of "tribe", like for instance, a country). The very fact that they are engaging in this behavior casts doubt on their moral superiority, so it seems fair to remind them of that.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

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  4. #14
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Default Doublethink and Psychological Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    Gaslighting becomes a complicated concept when applied broadly. There are people who use it in the "classical" sense of deliberately falsifying information, but is all dismissal gas lighting?

    Where it becomes more complex is when two subjective, likely distorted, perspectives interact and begin to dismiss each other on grounds of not being reasoned. It's very much like the issue of passive-aggression which becomes similarly complex when applied broadly into all its possible manifestations.

    I doubt my own memory, assumptions, perceptions, and some of this second-guessing is a lack of confidence that has resulted from dismissal, and some is a healthy attempt to grow towards thinking more clearly with experience. In the same way that some of my own questioning is self-gaslighting and some is an attempt to apply reason, the same can be said of interactions between myself and others.
    Gaslighting is a form of mental abuse in which false information is presented with the intent of making a victim doubt his or her own memory, perception and sanity.

    So one would wonder why you would want to deny gaslighting is a form of mental abuse?

    Is this hiding mental abuse through doublethink?

    Doublethink is the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.

    Doublethink is the power to tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies—all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth.

    The emotional abuse of gaslighting can only be defended by the lies of doublethink.

    And doublethink is part of Newspeak, a form of psychological warfare.

  5. #15
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    But your form of psychological warfare is neither effective nor invisible. Instead of trolling, let's call it Molling.
    While I am elucidating psychological warfare from the ancient Chinese The Art of War by Sun Tzu, to the modern Nineteen Eighty-Four by George Orwell, you accuse me of waging psychologal warfare, while at the same time deliberately insulting me personally.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Gaslighting is a form of mental abuse in which false information is presented with the intent of making a victim doubt his or her own memory, perception and sanity.

    So one would wonder why you would want to deny gaslighting is a form of mental abuse?

    Is this hiding mental abuse through doublethink?

    Doublethink is the power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them.

    Doublethink is the power to tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies—all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth.

    The emotional abuse of gaslighting can only be defended by the lies of doublethink.

    And doublethink is part of Newspeak, a form of psychological warfare.
    Did you just gaslight Fia with that post?

  7. #17
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    While I am elucidating psychological warfare from the ancient Chinese The Art of War by Sun Tzu, to the modern Nineteen Eighty-Four by George Orwell, you accuse me of waging psychologal warfare, while at the same time deliberately insulting me personally.
    Out of curiosity, would it be considered psychological warfare to make somebody believe that they are the aggressors attacking a victim? Food for thought.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forever_Jung View Post
    Did you just gaslight Fia with that post?
    It's interesting that two of you think it is funny to accuse me of gaslighting and psychlogical warfare when I have just elucidated these concepts.

    It seems you think it is smart and clever and funny to accuse me of the very things I am critiquing.

    You have found another way of insulting me in company.

    Imagine if you made a contribution of your own - you would have no need to boost your ego by insulting anyone.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    Out of curiosity, would it be considered psychological warfare to make somebody believe that they are the aggressors attacking a victim? Food for thought.
    Here we have members deliberately and continually personally insulting another member.

    Those who deliberately and continually insult another member are aggressors.

    And it is psychological warfare to blame the victim.

    But I think the real problem here is that we have people who are incapable of making a contribution of their own and so try to be smart and clever and funny and insult those who do make a contribution.

    The solution is very simple: make a contribution of your own, and stop insulting others.

  10. #20
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    It's interesting that two of you think it is funny to accuse me of gaslighting and psychlogical warfare when I have just elucidated these concepts.

    It seems you think it is smart and clever and funny to accuse me of the very things I am critiquing.

    You have found another way of insulting me in company.

    Imagine if you made a contribution of your own - you would have no need to boost your ego by insulting anyone.
    I don't think it's funny. I dislike the way you framed her post. I felt you were insulting her, actually. Therefore, I pointed out the irony that you were dismissing/twisting what she said in a thread about gaslighting. I'm being perfectly honest, when I say I see YOU as the aggressor here, I'm not trying to insult you, Mole.

    Maybe you're not doing it on purpose, heck, maybe you're not doing it at all, but I had to ask. Are you gaslighting ME, now?

    You do make me feel very unsure of my perceptions and grasps of the facts by framing what I say in a manner I had not intended. What do you call that?

    Edit: And maybe I'm not the smartest or most insightful member on the board, but I DO try to contribute in my own way. I also try my best to be respectful of others, even when I feel they are not showing me the same respect.

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