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  1. #51
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Carl Jung himself wrote that his book, "Psychological Types", the origin of mbti, is based on no empirical evidence.

    So the fount and origin of mbti says it is made up.

    You didn't address the second part of that, which is really important. I see you get in these kinds of arguments with NTPs, and I think some FJs too. I can't remember if I've seen you do it with NTJs.

    It's just funny how people say, no, I'm not any type! I'm an individual! And then they have lots of things in common with the other people who like to say that.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

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  2. #52
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    I don't even know how to recognize this disorder. I suspect a few of my clients of having it. I've heard other counsellors mention its not worth counselling them because they are bad for business.
    Are these mental health counselors? or career counselors?

    I have a music student I was describing to my counselor whom I've been teaching for about three years now. She has been through 3-4 mental health counselors during that time. She is unable to maintain relationships because of having an extreme conflict oriented personality. She has several, severe mental issues, but they align in her behavior to act out a lot like BPD, which she could also have. She is diagnosed with Aspbergers, trauma, brain injury, and she has mentioned to me different hard drugs she has taken. She told me at her recent lesson that her counselor became very mean to her, so she tried a new one who acted like a "Nazi" about her being late. He said if she was even a few minutes late he would not hold her session.

    I think she is an extremely interesting lady, and if I were a mental health professional, it would make sense to me to be even more interested. What a great opportunity to better understand the human mind and exercise your helping profession? I don't understand a mindset from a mental health professional that would refuse people who have severe issues unless you didn't have the skill and training to help.

    Edit: I guess that phrase "not worth it" really stung.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  3. #53
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    It was suggested that I have BPD as a child, but never followed up on.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  4. #54
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    that phrase "not worth it" really stung.
    These are the words of a commercial manipulator and predator, not the words of qualified, well trained and professional counsellor.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    Are these mental health counselors? or career counselors?

    I have a music student I was describing to my counselor whom I've been teaching for about three years now. She has been through 3-4 mental health counselors during that time. She is unable to maintain relationships because of having an extreme conflict oriented personality. She has several, severe mental issues, but they align in her behavior to act out a lot like BPD, which she could also have. She is diagnosed with Aspbergers, trauma, brain injury, and she has mentioned to me different hard drugs she has taken. She told me at her recent lesson that her counselor became very mean to her, so she tried a new one who acted like a "Nazi" about her being late. He said if she was even a few minutes late he would not hold her session.

    I think she is an extremely interesting lady, and if I were a mental health professional, it would make sense to me to be even more interested. What a great opportunity to better understand the human mind and exercise your helping profession? I don't understand a mindset from a mental health professional that would refuse people who have severe issues unless you didn't have the skill and training to help.

    Edit: I guess that phrase "not worth it" really stung.
    Why did it sting? Are you borderline?

    They're not worth it because they take your advice, go use it, screw it up, then blame you for all their problems that ultimately will never be fixed.

    They also cling to you and become dependant and want to follow you everywhere in real life. What's that movie with billy crystal?

    Your girlfriend is mad at you, you get fired from every job for being a douche, you're a lost soul and not sure what to do with your life, people act a certain way around you and you don't know why, you're not sure what career you should take...

    Regular people problems. Those are what I fix. Anything more than that requires chemicals and support groups, neither of which counsellors or life coaches provide. It is difficult when clients come to me looking for help in general, and don't even know what the issue is. You listen for hours in the hopes that it will eventually surface, but it never does, and then they get angry because they are spending money by the hour and neither of you has figured out what their problem is.

    Even those who simply want someone to listen to them... I feel guilty doing that, because you are paying me to be your friend, which puts me in an awkward position as well.

    (speaking of which I'm overdue to set up a referral with a psychiatrist and some support groups).

  6. #56
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    Borderline Personality Disorder is experienced in individuals in many different ways. Often, people with this disorder will find it more difficult to distinguish between reality from their own misperceptions of the world and their surrounding environment. While this may seem like a type of delusion disorder to some, it is actually related to their emotions overwhelming regular cognitive functioning.

    People with this disorder often see others in “black-and-white” terms. Depending upon the circumstances and situation, for instance, a therapist can be seen as being very helpful and caring toward the client. But if some sort of difficulty arises in the therapy, or in the patient’s life, the person might then begin characterizing the therapist as “bad” and not caring about the client at all. Clinicians should always be aware of this “all-or-nothing” lability most often found in individuals with this disorder and be careful not to validate it.

    Therapists and doctors should learn to be like a rock when dealing with a person who has this disorder. That is, the doctor should offer his or her stability to contrast the client’s lability of emotion and thinking. Many professionals are turned-off by working with people with this disorder, because it draws on many negative feelings from the clinician. These occur because of the client’s constant demands on a clinician, the constant suicidal gestures, thoughts, and behaviors, and the possibility of self-mutiliating behavior. These are sometimes very difficult items for a therapist to understand and work with.

    Psychotherapy is nearly always the treatment of choice for this disorder; medications may be used to help stabilize mood swings. Controversy surrounds overmedicating people with this disorder.
    http://psychcentral.com/lib/borderli...atment/0001065

    I've had someone lash out at me and tell me horrible things because I told them I couldn't help them. Visually speaking, it looks like I'm performing an exorcism.

  7. #57
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    Back to the original topic,

    I'm a firm believer that there are many cognitive "disorders" out there that can be attributed to personality type. For example, aspbergers with INTJ's, Schizophrenia with INTP's, ADHD with ExxP's, anti-social personality disorder with ENTJ and ESTP. I wonder how far of a stretch it is to say that BPD is just another word for "unhealthy INFP." I know for myself, anti-social personality disorder is always there and ready for when I want to hop in on the fun, lol, I simply choose not to.

    I've only seen BPD in INFP's, but my experience is limited with this disorder. The overwhelming subjective emotional world they live in resonates with my grievances for Fi. Whenever people play music, they are playing it FOR that person. Whenever someone says something that is percieved as critical, they take offense, etc. Essentially they are lost in an ego-centralized world where everything has something to do with them.

  8. #58
    Junior Member Rennamix's Avatar
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    For those of you that have actual diagnosed BPD in their life, there is a wonderful book I've owned since finding out at 15 that my mother had it. Incidentally enough, in the OP's statement, something along the lines was said "I have to walk on eggshells - That's part of the books title, "Stop Walking On Eggshells" by Paul T. Mason & Randi Kreger. It's a wonderful book and if you do in fact hve someone who has been diagnosed with it in your life, I suggest checking this out. It's been a life saver for me to deal with the bewildering mood shifts and unpredictable behavior!

  9. #59
    Senior Member AzulEyes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    Back to the original topic,

    I'm a firm believer that there are many cognitive "disorders" out there that can be attributed to personality type. For example, aspbergers with INTJ's, Schizophrenia with INTP's, ADHD with ExxP's, anti-social personality disorder with ENTJ and ESTP. I wonder how far of a stretch it is to say that BPD is just another word for "unhealthy INFP." I know for myself, anti-social personality disorder is always there and ready for when I want to hop in on the fun, lol, I simply choose not to.

    I've only seen BPD in INFP's, but my experience is limited with this disorder. The overwhelming subjective emotional world they live in resonates with my grievances for Fi. Whenever people play music, they are playing it FOR that person. Whenever someone says something that is percieved as critical, they take offense, etc. Essentially they are lost in an ego-centralized world where everything has something to do with them.
    I befriended a very lovely, unusual, deep girl who I said right to her, "You are an INFP." She was like, "Waaa?" I sent her the test and asked her to tell me the results. She emailed me back, "I'm INFP."

    You described it above! We were trying to volunteer together (she with 3 of us on staff) and she completely alienated the other 2. I was the only one who "got" her and could be gentle with her. She had this expectation that whatever she was doing (in a huge- very busy undertaking involving tons of volunteers) could be analyzed, scrutinized, rewarded etc. when really- we just needed all hands on deck to get a job done. She would write pages and pages of expository email expressing all this emotion seemingly out of left field about the situation and my comrades were absolutely befuddled. She finally just quit because she couldn't take it. Poor kid- she had the heart to do it but then TOO much heart to do it. SO intense- never met someone so deeply introspective and emotional and taking the weight of the world not on her shoulders- but into her soul.
    It takes courage to grow up and become who you really are. ~e.e. cummings

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  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    Are these mental health counselors? or career counselors?

    I have a music student I was describing to my counselor whom I've been teaching for about three years now. She has been through 3-4 mental health counselors during that time. She is unable to maintain relationships because of having an extreme conflict oriented personality. She has several, severe mental issues, but they align in her behavior to act out a lot like BPD, which she could also have. She is diagnosed with Aspbergers, trauma, brain injury, and she has mentioned to me different hard drugs she has taken. She told me at her recent lesson that her counselor became very mean to her, so she tried a new one who acted like a "Nazi" about her being late. He said if she was even a few minutes late he would not hold her session.

    I think she is an extremely interesting lady, and if I were a mental health professional, it would make sense to me to be even more interested. What a great opportunity to better understand the human mind and exercise your helping profession? I don't understand a mindset from a mental health professional that would refuse people who have severe issues unless you didn't have the skill and training to help.

    Edit: I guess that phrase "not worth it" really stung.
    Because they often don't get better because they don't want to get better, and blame every one else. I mean put yourself in the string of therapists your student dumps on a whim because she doesn't like what they say. It's extremely difficult to work with a patient who doesn't really want help.

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