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  1. #81

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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Honest stuff here..

    I know what this girl is and all, but to be completely honest her eyes don't scare me and neither does anything about the way she acts, really. She strikes me as a badass, in a sense that I actually admire. All sociopaths do, actually. Sometimes I wish I were a sociopath, does that make me fucked up?

    They lack something that normal people have, something that I see as pathetic. It's hard to put a finger on and define it exactly. Sociopaths are believers. If they believe in pure hatred and malice, at least they believe in something. Normal people are afraid to believe in anything so wholeheartedly. Maybe that's it. And you can see it in their confidence. When I look at that girl in the video, I think she is amazing.. thrilling.. powerful.. even godlike. And I love her eyes, and her unabashedness. I find her desire for existential revenge and desecration totally relatable. She is a product of the nightmare world she was born into, and there is a kind of beauty in nightmares. I honestly think she is a lovely child and hope god has mercy on her.

    Now... don't get me wrong, when I hear about someone being a sociopath or suspect it IRL, I immediately stay as far away from that person as possible, because I know what's good for me. It would be incredibly ignorant to voluntarily try to "help" a sociopath. It is indeed tragic that others will become victims of this sort of thing. That girl's brother? I can't imagine how horrible it must be for him. I dunno why this sort of shit happens. Then again, I've never been exposed to it, it is totally alien to me. Things I don't know...
    No, I dont think you're fucked up, I just think that you've been influenced by a media construct of what a sociopath is.

    There's also a lot of people who are troubled by being conscientious to the point of being nuerotic about it, they can get caught up by the social machinery which is meant to arrest the behaviour of lazy or selfish individuals easily and resent it, sometimes they get caught up in it when they know of other more deserving candidates for it are breezing by it all or they may even know that the people administering it are the people its meant to catch.

    Sociopaths are not any more admirable or commendable than someone who is a savant or autistic or on the aspergers spectrum or who has ADHD. I think there's less of them than there are imitators of them, sadists usually, or people who've "hardened their hearts", ie repressed emotions and emotional responses, and have to continually do so because they're trying very hard not to feel difficult or painful emotional states, different sorts of narcissistic states are associated with the neurotic conscientiousness and apparent lack of conscience, its called being highly deployed, being very highly defensive and false and phony in order to avoid the shattering of personal illusions and a confrontation with reality, including the reality of the self.

    The majority of people I know who exhibit these sorts of things are pathetic individuals, with completed or incomplete schemes to hurt others, constantly playing games with others and very, very responsive to any suggestion from others or their environment, like watching TV shows and wanting to act on their content in ways that are compulsive. None of them can simply shrug or deal with being hurt and they'll hurt others to see the hurt in them and pride themselves on not feeling that way themselves. The fear of being victimised is so great that they'll victimise others in the belief they're safe from the roles ever being reversed that way, that's an awful thing to behold when you know that its deep seated and they're just going to carry on hurting people repeatedly to provide that false security to themselves. The reaction from them when they cant evoke the expected or hoped for emotional response is something else.

    Those kinds of desperate strategies of relating to others are all about a kind of neediness, its pathetic and the abnormal side of being properly related to the world and being capable of independence.

  2. #82

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    This case is an interesting one because the child is pretty articulate, verbal, engaged in the process and, apparently, reflective but perhaps all the non-verbal, behavioural, resistant and destructive side preceeded these interviews.

    I've known adults with the benefits of years who're not able or willing to engage as the kid does in the first seven minutes of the video. I've not watched it all but I plan to.

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    Worst case scenario, she may not have a conscience, but it seems pretty clear that her sadistic desires have been managed.

    Functional sociopaths aren't stupid - even though they wouldn't feel remorse about torturing/killing a person, they are able to learn that the consequences aren't worth it.
    That's the important point.

    I also think there's a big difference between sadism and sociopathy, for instance are sociopaths going to interested what compells sadists? Sadists, some theorists have suggested, are really all sadomasochists because their compulsive natures involve a masochistic dependency upon the individuals they have objectified.

    There's also sociological and structural explanations for these kinds of behaviours, there's good theories about how managerialism and middle management require the adoption of sadomasochistic traits, revering superiors, despising subordinates, and I've seen that a lot. Although that is not the exact same as a pathological sadomasochist and its different again from sociopathy.

    The whole philosophical dimension, what people find admirable about either sort of behaviour or individual is another question and pretty poor reflection of the world as it is.

  4. #84
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Well, I think sociopaths are interesting because they are like predatory animals who can talk. You can't ask a lion what's going through his head when he maims and kills his prey. It would be interesting as hell if you could, though.

  5. #85
    Temporal Mechanic. Lexicon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Well, I think sociopaths are interesting because they are like predatory animals who can talk. You can't ask a lion what's going through his head when he maims and kills his prey. It would be interesting as hell if you could, though.
    I'm assuming the answer would be this (kind of):



    ::edit::

    here we go

    03/23 06:06:58 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:06:59 EcK: lex
    03/23 06:21:34 Nancynobullets: LEXXX *sacrifices a first born*
    03/23 06:21:53 Nancynobullets: We summon yooouuu
    03/23 06:29:07 Lexicon: I was sleeping!



    04/25 04:20:35 Patches: Don't listen to lex. She wants to birth a litter of kittens. She doesnt get to decide whats creepy

    02/16 23:49:38 ygolo: Lex is afk
    02/16 23:49:45 Cimarron: she's doing drugs with Jack

    03/05 19:27:41 Time: You can't make chat morbid. Lex does it naturally.

  6. #86
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HelenOfTroy View Post
    She's Black?
    Oh dear. The plot thickens!!
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #87
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    i think they made a tv movie based on this story, i never saw it except for this very disturbing but hilarious clip
    I know they made a TV movie of this....srsly?? This is so bad!!!!

    I need to get me a sweet daddy bear!!
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  8. #88

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    I think this thread has been the most interesting thing in months.
    @zago

    Is anything they say worthwhile though? Its likely to be lies or game playing but I take your point if you're going to investigate predatory behaviour beyond instinct perhaps that's the place to look.

  9. #89
    Let me count the ways Betty Blue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Here's a pic of my boy, who has autism. He's very unusual but there's not an evil or dishonest bone in his body. When I posted this pic on Facebook I got a note in my inbox about his "scary" eyes.

    Attachment 9676
    How bizarre, he has beautiful eyes! My daughter (also autistic) has huge abyss eyes too... i actually think it's a common characteristic, but to me they are more 'look after my physical needs' eyes than anything else.... similar to the bush baby effect. So much going on behind them though and so much misinterpretation and misinformation about the autistic mind esp re:intelligence.
    Last edited by Betty Blue; 06-26-2013 at 07:44 AM. Reason: clarity, grammer in your face
    "We knew he was someone who had a tragic flaw, that's where his greatness came from"

  10. #90
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    yes. I mean, it's not a lot different in some ways than having your own bio kid -- you never know what you'll get, and then you deal with it or not. (For example, my younger son was born with cystic fibrosis -- totally caught us off-guard.) There are things you just rise to the occasion for because you are a parent and you are connected to your child. However, different people deal better or worse with different ailments; for example, if my son had needed full-time care or had been intellectually disabled in some way, that would have been much harder for me than a physical ailment. Still... it's your child.

    maybe an adopted child has different dynamics, when there are unexpected problems.



    That seems a pretty bold claim, considering there could be a silent crowd out there who just doesn't talk about it to maintain privacy, and people tend to be far more public about things they do not like vs things they do. (Just work in customer service for a day.) I don't know.

    I did watch all the video. What Beth undertook was very very strenuous -- they basically took away all her freedom, until she learned she could trust the people in charge of her life and built a connection with them, and then they slowly gave her control back as she proved trustworthy. That sounds horribly drastic; then again, she was killing animals, beating up her little brother constantly to the point of hospital visits, and had taken knives and was talking about stabbing her family to death while she slept, which is also pretty drastic. Maybe if things are bad enough, you essentially have to start over at the point where kids normally develop attachment and go from there. But it does mean the adults involved have to be beyond reproach and have an immense responsibility, with the role they are forcing themselves to play in the child's life.

    Also, I think Attachment Therapy/Parenting covers a lot of ground -- it's an umbrella term and could involve a range of techniques -- so I don't know if criticism of one type is indicative of another. Or am I misunderstanding AT?
    Yes. I'd be worried about this sort of therapy being applied to any child that happens to be troublesome, but Beth's case was so severe that one wonders what the alternative would be. I suppose she was going to be in jail or a ward anyhow, possibly only after doing something terrible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Hooray, now from her mere picture we've figured out she's (1) an ESFJ and (2) the spawn of Satan's seed.

    Anyone want to volunteer the third side of this sordid triangle?
    She must be a Republican.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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