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  1. #31
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Im INFJ in MBTI and an Ni-EIE in socionics. I find that MBTI INFJs are often socionics EIEs, EIIs, or IEIs, but not IEEs.

    I hesitate alot when it comes to deciding whether Im EIE or IEI though, but Im pretty sure EIE fits better. IEIs I know are girly, mawkish and overly meldodramtic, and seem to hate any expression of anything opposite of that in themselves since they have Te polr. Te doesnt bother me, but Si does, I cant stand talking about health, the body, nutrition etc, whereas IEIs dont seem to mind. So I say I have Si and not Te polr. Also take a look at the sixth (Hidden agenda) function. EIEs have Se, and IEIs have Ti. The Hidden Agenda(HA) manifests itself as desperate and pathetic in the eyes of others. I do not come pathetic in my need to have approval of my intellectual capacities(Ti), Id say I have more to prove to others in terms of my power, authority, success, status, appearance etc.

  2. #32
    Senior Member _eric_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeaT View Post
    What is Se like to you anyway?
    Well I am really not good at physically involving myself in what's going on around me. It's something I normally do not find very enjoyable at all, and when I do have to do it, I am awkward and unsure of myself, as well as often being stiff and uncoordinated (I have had large motor skills difficulties my whole life; I have asperger's disorder, and the two are very closely related, having a high rate of co-morbidity.). I am not good at being physically assertive and it takes a great deal of effort to push through that even momentarily. Being around a lot of people and ongoing events is very draining for me. I get little to no positive mental feedback from doing very physically active things like working out. I also do not get any sort of adrenaline rush from things like riding a roller coaster; I end up feeling nothing at all, it's completely dull. It's very rare that I ever follow any sort of impulse; I'm very non-spontaneous.

    The only part of any Se description I have read that I am good at is in the passive sense, being able to quickly take in large amounts of data from the environment, noticing very small details and changes (finding something out of place without even actively trying to, for instance), aesthetics and noticing if something is even slightly out of alignment or uneven, noticing obscure details in music such as ghost notes in drumming. It is to the point where if there is a lot going on around me, it is very overwhelming because for the most part, this intake is not something I consciously do, and then that makes even more difficult for me to take any sort of physical action myself as it ties up too much of my mental resources. For instance, if I'm in a group where there are several conversations going on that are discernable enough to follow (like not so many that it becomes white noise), then my brain automatically hones in on every one of them at once, and effectively hogs my brain's bandwidth, pushing out my own thoughts and thus making it difficult for me to contribute to any conversation, so I end up keeping to myself more.

    I have almost every HSP trait to varying degrees, minus the caffeine sensitivity (it does nothing to me).

    So, I guess you could say that I am both terrible and excellent at it, though in cognitive function tests (and typology tests in general), they mostly ask questions about the active sense of Se, hence why I score very low there.

    (Feel free to correct me if I'm confused on any of this.)
    Do you identify more with vortical-synergetic (IEI) or dialectical-algorithmic (EIE)?
    Dialectical-algorithmic.
    So essentially, to identify the PoLR, you could simply ask yourself, what behavior (function) tends to annoy/frustrate me the most with other people? For an EIE it would be Si, for an IEI it would be Te respectively.
    That would definitely be Si for me. I get along very well with Te-dom/aux users, but nowhere near as much with Si-dom/aux users. I have the most problems with them by far compared with all other types.
    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    Im INFJ in MBTI and an Ni-EIE in socionics. I find that MBTI INFJs are often socionics EIEs, EIIs, or IEIs, but not IEEs.

    I hesitate alot when it comes to deciding whether Im EIE or IEI though, but Im pretty sure EIE fits better. IEIs I know are girly, mawkish and overly meldodramtic, and seem to hate any expression of anything opposite of that in themselves since they have Te polr. Te doesnt bother me, but Si does, I cant stand talking about health, the body, nutrition etc, whereas IEIs dont seem to mind. So I say I have Si and not Te polr. Also take a look at the sixth (Hidden agenda) function. EIEs have Se, and IEIs have Ti. The Hidden Agenda(HA) manifests itself as desperate and pathetic in the eyes of others. I do not come pathetic in my need to have approval of my intellectual capacities(Ti), Id say I have more to prove to others in terms of my power, authority, success, status, appearance etc.
    I am the same way about both of those, especially with not needing approval of my Ti. From an outside perspective, I do indeed have much more to prove with my success, appearance, etc. in comparison, but that is something I don't personally concern myself with. It's a non-issue to me.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Entropic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by _eric_ View Post
    Well I am really not good at physically involving myself in what's going on around me. It's something I normally do not find very enjoyable at all, and when I do have to do it, I am awkward and unsure of myself, as well as often being stiff and uncoordinated (I have had large motor skills difficulties my whole life; I have asperger's disorder, and the two are very closely related, having a high rate of co-morbidity.). I am not good at being physically assertive and it takes a great deal of effort to push through that even momentarily. Being around a lot of people and ongoing events is very draining for me. I get little to no positive mental feedback from doing very physically active things like working out. I also do not get any sort of adrenaline rush from things like riding a roller coaster; I end up feeling nothing at all, it's completely dull. It's very rare that I ever follow any sort of impulse; I'm very non-spontaneous.

    The only part of any Se description I have read that I am good at is in the passive sense, being able to quickly take in large amounts of data from the environment, noticing very small details and changes (finding something out of place without even actively trying to, for instance), aesthetics and noticing if something is even slightly out of alignment or uneven, noticing obscure details in music such as ghost notes in drumming. It is to the point where if there is a lot going on around me, it is very overwhelming because for the most part, this intake is not something I consciously do, and then that makes even more difficult for me to take any sort of physical action myself as it ties up too much of my mental resources. For instance, if I'm in a group where there are several conversations going on that are discernable enough to follow (like not so many that it becomes white noise), then my brain automatically hones in on every one of them at once, and effectively hogs my brain's bandwidth, pushing out my own thoughts and thus making it difficult for me to contribute to any conversation, so I end up keeping to myself more.

    I have almost every HSP trait to varying degrees, minus the caffeine sensitivity (it does nothing to me).

    So, I guess you could say that I am both terrible and excellent at it, though in cognitive function tests (and typology tests in general), they mostly ask questions about the active sense of Se, hence why I score very low there.

    (Feel free to correct me if I'm confused on any of this.)
    Yeah, that's interesting. I identify as inferior Se now and I'm also HSP and I definitely see a connection between the two. When I get over-stimulated I am really over-stimulated and if I keep getting stimulated and can't shut things out which I can't when I'm over-stimulated (kind of like being over-tired in a sense of wanting to sleep but you can't sleep because you're too tired to sleep), I can throw a tantrum have a breakdown of sorts.

    I also score extremely low on Se on any cognitive test which is why I completely dismissed the fact I could be an Se type at first when I typed myself based on cognitive test scores. Nardi's test insists that I'm an NP type because I identify with his definitions of Ne over Ni.

    But when it comes to my own personal experiences with Se, I do appreciate Se once you actually drag my sorry ass there and get me to do it. I might be extremely resistant at first and I can throw Fi tantrums if I absolutely do not want to and you push me, but once I'm in the actual mindset it really isn't that bad and I can enjoy and seek it out myself at many occasions. I for example love playing action-paced video games for this reason, especially violent ones. It also happens I can do something more action-oriented like playing paint ball with my friends or riding on my dad's scooter. When I do find myself doing these things, I can really enjoy that. I just need to be in the right mood. Contrary to you I get a lot of adrenaline rushes and I seek out those rushes. It could part be an enneagram difference though. I see that you type as sp/so and I'm sx/sp. I'm also 8-fixed and my inner child is 8. I need a bit of a thrill in my life to make it interesting.

    As for my motor skills, I'd say they are pretty non-existent. I'm extremely clumsy and things just tend to fall into pieces when I'm around. Since I began working at my new job in early Feburary, I've killed one keyboard after successfully spilling coffee over it, and I've crashed 3 glasses and spilled out 2 water glasses and one coffee mug.

    I also identify that a big problem with my life is definitely my overall inertia. I don't get anything done, really, if I'm left to my own devices. It takes a lot of effort for me to do something but once I'm actually doing it it's fine. It's just moving from the "I should do it" to "I'm doing it" that's so extremely difficult. That's why I'm very clearly an introvert in socionics. What I need is energy to live life at all. On the contrary, it does seem like you actually seek more introverted stimuli so EIE-Ni definitely makes sense. Ti is an introverted element.

    The hidden agenda can be tricky that way because we can manage it better than the suggestive function, but we don't need too much stimulation in this area since we don't experience the deficit as severe as with the suggestive function. It is very possible to become inert and "forget" about the hidden agenda. I think subtype affects this as well but I am not sure to what degree. I'm for example extremely easily attracted to Fi types, in a way almost visibly more so than Se. Se was never something I could see myself being attracted to although in retrospect yes, I think Se and Fi as a type combination is attractive in other individuals and I envy their ability to control the environment in accordance to their inner ethics. It is a skill I wished I possessed but clearly do not. So perhaps being a contact subtype my dual-seeking also moves away from Se and more towards Fi, which makes sense to me considering how the metabolism flow works. If your metabolism is less focused on introversion, then you would perhaps naturally also be less inclined to seek more extroversion to couple your introversion. For example, if I had to choose between an SEE-Se and SEE-Fi dual, then SEE-Fi easily. I'd need that additional Fi kick but still provided with the energy from Se base.

    Dialectical-algorithmic.
    Agreed. You don't seem like a VS type to me.

    That would definitely be Si for me. I get along very well with Te-dom/aux users, but nowhere near as much with Si-dom/aux users. I have the most problems with them by far compared with all other types.
    Yeah, I feel that too. I'm not sure if it's because I'm a contact subtype, but EIE-Ni doesn't annoy me nearly as much as IEI-Ni or IEI-Fe do, especially Fe. I think it's because Fe being creative makes the IEI more inclined to utilize Fe in order to establish contact with you, and that disturbs me pretty much right away as Fe PoLR. I can't speak how this works IRL though since I tend to predominantly hang out with Fi-Te types IRL.

    I was waiting for the day you and I would meet.

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  4. #34
    Senior Member _eric_'s Avatar
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    @LeaT

    Thanks for all that, EIE-Ni it is, then!

    Once again, I relate very much to almost all of what you just said, minus the stuff pertaining to you being a contact subtype (What is the opposite called, btw?). I always find myself quite attracted to Fi users as well, and not Se users; they are too much for me. Actually, both relationships I've been in so far were with INFP's, and every girl I've ever liked before them is one as well, haha. The first one I believe is a 4w3 sp/sx, and that relationship lasted 3 years. We never talked about socionics, only MBTI and Enneagram, but if I had to guess, I would say she's EII-Fi. My second/current girlfriend is 4w5 sp/sx, and we also figured together that she is IEE-Fi in Socionics. I think she is a far better match for me than my ex, and that is saying a lot because my ex and I were an amazing match too. The biggest difference I've noticed, and am quite thankful for, is that she's much less sensitive and also not averse to Te, and logic in general. She is not naturally good with using Te herself, but she has gotten much better at it over time, and she is certainly comfortable being around it, since all but one of her immediate family members are Te users; the one who isn't is an INTP.

  5. #35
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    Here I am posting a video made by myself.


  6. #36
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    I'm going to make my usual comment here, and perhaps someone will give me something useful...

    I find socionics INFj (FiNe) to sound like an e9 and socionics INFp (NiFe) to sound like an e4. I relate much more to the demeanor & general personality described for the INFp, but the functions don't fit, OR I am too attached to Jung's descriptions. Fi in socionics just doesn't ring true for me & the INFj demeanor is wrong for me (too....IDK, "mumsy" is the word I use), but Ni+Fe still does not fit like Jungian Fi+Ne.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  7. #37
    Senior Member Entropic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by _eric_ View Post
    @LeaT

    Thanks for all that, EIE-Ni it is, then!

    Once again, I relate very much to almost all of what you just said, minus the stuff pertaining to you being a contact subtype (What is the opposite called, btw?). I always find myself quite attracted to Fi users as well, and not Se users; they are too much for me. Actually, both relationships I've been in so far were with INFP's, and every girl I've ever liked before them is one as well, haha. The first one I believe is a 4w3 sp/sx, and that relationship lasted 3 years. We never talked about socionics, only MBTI and Enneagram, but if I had to guess, I would say she's EII-Fi. My second/current girlfriend is 4w5 sp/sx, and we also figured together that she is IEE-Fi in Socionics. I think she is a far better match for me than my ex, and that is saying a lot because my ex and I were an amazing match too. The biggest difference I've noticed, and am quite thankful for, is that she's much less sensitive and also not averse to Te, and logic in general. She is not naturally good with using Te herself, but she has gotten much better at it over time, and she is certainly comfortable being around it, since all but one of her immediate family members are Te users; the one who isn't is an INTP.
    No problem! The opposite of contact is inert. You'd be contact though if you're an EIE-Ni since Ni is the creative element for EIE, so that's contact. Inert would be EIE-Fe. The tl;dr version of contact/inert is that contact = creative subtype and inert = base subtype. So Inert is always base type + base function element e.g. ESE + Fe because it is the base function and contact always ESE + Si because Si is the creative function and so on. Really simple math.

    Another possibility for you is that you're in fact an ILI of sorts, maybe ILI-Ni, especially if you actually find Fi to be that attractive to you. ILI and EII (INTJ and INFP) are of benefit relationship where the EII is the beneficiary because their inferior element (Te) is what the ILI provides as creative function. IEE and ILI is also a common combination because the intertype is mirage. You can read about ILI-EII as benefit here: http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...le=Beneficiary and mirage here: http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=Mirage

    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    Here I am posting a video made by myself.

    Uhm... I was watching a little bit, jumped around. Your explanation is just... confusing. Yes, for example, an LSI is primarily going to engage the world through Ti, then Se, but it is not so much out of a need per se as much as it is how the LSI checks and validates their systems, takes in new information and data or, simply put, how they engage the world externally.

    I was waiting for the day you and I would meet.

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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    Im INFJ in MBTI and an Ni-EIE in socionics. I find that MBTI INFJs are often socionics EIEs, EIIs, or IEIs, but not IEEs.

    I hesitate alot when it comes to deciding whether Im EIE or IEI though, but Im pretty sure EIE fits better. IEIs I know are girly, mawkish and overly meldodramtic, and seem to hate any expression of anything opposite of that in themselves since they have Te polr. Te doesnt bother me, but Si does, I cant stand talking about health, the body, nutrition etc, whereas IEIs dont seem to mind. So I say I have Si and not Te polr. Also take a look at the sixth (Hidden agenda) function. EIEs have Se, and IEIs have Ti. The Hidden Agenda(HA) manifests itself as desperate and pathetic in the eyes of others. I do not come pathetic in my need to have approval of my intellectual capacities(Ti), Id say I have more to prove to others in terms of my power, authority, success, status, appearance etc.
    Do you have any celebrities who you think are very similar to yourself? I'd like to know more about EIE-Ni's, what they look like, how they come off, etc, so I can differentiate them from IEI-Fe's.

    Back in my mbti days when I thought I was ISTP, I used to think ENFJ was my best match. I suspect there are some IEI's who look very much like ENFJ's, and I'd like to learn more about them. There's a very specific type of girl that I can identify almost immediately whenever I see her, and she usually types as mbti ENFJ, but I'm unsure what socionics she types as.

  9. #39
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    Do you have any celebrities who you think are very similar to yourself? I'd like to know more about EIE-Ni's, what they look like, how they come off, etc, so I can differentiate them from IEI-Fe's.

    Back in my mbti days when I thought I was ISTP, I used to think ENFJ was my best match. I suspect there are some IEI's who look very much like ENFJ's, and I'd like to learn more about them. There's a very specific type of girl that I can identify almost immediately whenever I see her, and she usually types as mbti ENFJ, but I'm unsure what socionics she types as.
    Im think there are some mbti ENFJs whos are Fe-IEI like MLK for example. I used to work on typing celebs and I just went through my old list and wow...almost none of those people I had as EIE do I see as EIEs anymore! Some celebs who I think are similar to myself personality wise: Arthur Schopenhauer(INFJ, Ni beta NF) Tim Burton(INFP, ?) Voltaire(?, Fe-EIE) Marilyn Manson (INFJ, Ni-EIE) Nietzsche(INTJ Ni-IEI) Hitler (INFJ or ENFJ, Ni-EIE). I identify with Adolph personality wise, not with respect to his ideals or anything. I know thats a bit sketchy, but I picked people who I could relate to not necessarily of my type...

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    Im think there are some mbti ENFJs whos are Fe-IEI like MLK for example. I used to work on typing celebs and I just went through my old list and wow...almost none of those people I had as EIE do I see as EIEs anymore! Some celebs who I think are similar to myself personality wise: Arthur Schopenhauer(INFJ, Ni beta NF) Tim Burton(INFP, ?) Voltaire(?, Fe-EIE) Marilyn Manson (INFJ, Ni-EIE) Nietzsche(INTJ Ni-IEI) Hitler (INFJ or ENFJ, Ni-EIE). I identify with Adolph personality wise, not with respect to his ideals or anything. I know thats a bit sketchy, but I picked people who I could relate to not necessarily of my type...
    I have 4 actresses in mind so far for this mystery ENFJ personality.

    Jennifer Love hewitt (I've heard ENFP but I disagree, she's too colorful to be Ne/Si)
    Summer Glau
    Jenny Agutter
    Zoey Deschanel

    I'm very certain they're the same personality. They're flirty and have a very characteristic energetic and loud laugh that involves their whole body recoiling with laughter.

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