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Thread: Radio and IQ

  1. #41
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    @EcK

    Yes we are evolving and that is part of nature. We will kill off the smaller societies, and maybe one day ourselves entirely. I'm not even saying that we can or even should prevent that.

    I'm just saying don't feel big about it.

  2. #42
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    Yes, and yet there are ancient tribes who have maintained their solidarity and culture for thousands of years. Competition happens. Raids happen. They some times kill each other. But rarely do they break homeostasis because they integrate all aspects of living, including illness and death.

    No species does this quite like the modern human - not even other humans.
    Okey, then I can say the same thing about viruses Sprinkles. They live in harmony etc. They live in harmony with our immune system etc. etc.

    But take the immune system out and you'd be dead in days. The fact that the two are able to live together does not change the fact that they are in a struggle for resources. mixing cooperation with competition is just, human nature. It's how we compete against the environment with heightened in-species/in-group cooperation. competition is still there however.

    These people are, on average, probably not deep thinkers about the long ranging consequences of each action (and even that is just delayed self interest, with the self identifying itself with its in-group to a point and common interests etc.) their system evolved to a certain degree of stability because they wouldnt be here otherwise. but it did not set itself free of its limitations, they are like these bacteria in our bodies which have their perks and their cons.

    You know what happens when you give guns to primitive societies? They shoot the hell out of each other. The world is beautiful enough as it is without needing to defend lost causes. It's not progress for the sake of progress, it's what made you and me, it's the systematical adaptation of life to its environment. Most small isolated cultures are still there because they are isolated. It is also why they havent changed much in hundreds or thousands of years, lack of competition or interest from the competition.

    They are the societal equivalent of a kid taught about life by hippies in a farm somewhere and then facing the rest of the world, where people are more educated, more connected, more effective and productive as a group.

    We can argue subjectivity all day, fair enough. That's why I like statistics. If smaller societies with groups the size of what humanity's brains pretty much evolved to empathize with and relate to have higher homicid rate (much, higher) on average than even the homicidal maniacs amongst the developed countries (ie: USA) where individuals are so numerous there is a thousand ways to consider people living next door as 'out of your in group' and cut them off from your empathy lifelink. it kind of says it all. doesnt it.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
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    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  3. #43
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    @EcK

    Yes we are evolving and that is part of nature. We will kill off the smaller societies, and maybe one day ourselves entirely. I'm not even saying that we can or even should prevent that.

    I'm just saying don't feel big about it.
    Feel big about it?
    What do you mean

    It's a conversation, I do not hold any personal pride or am particularly emotionally polarized towards one or another model.

    The fact that i'm an egotistical prick has nothing to do with what we're discussing but thanks for noticing
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  4. #44
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Feel big about it?
    What do you mean

    It's a conversation, I do not hold any personal pride or am particularly emotionally polarized towards one or another model.

    The fact that i'm an egotistical prick has nothing to do with what we're discussing but thanks for noticing
    I didn't mean you specifically. I mean the propensity for people in general to think that we are so awesome with all our advances.

    If we lose respect for things then we truly will become a virus.

    The vast majority of all species that have ever lived on this planet are extinct. Nature kind of has its own 'immune system' and if the 'virus' gets out of hand, we will be no exception.

  5. #45
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    You know what happens when you give guns to primitive societies? They shoot the hell out of each other.
    Look at islamic countries. Say something wrong about their "god" (Mohammed), you'll get beaten up or worse.

  6. #46
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Infperson View Post
    Look at islamic countries. Say something wrong about their "god" (Mohammed), you'll get beaten up or worse.
    They aren't primitive and haven't been for a long time.

    Edit: also Islam and Christianity itself are relatively modern and arose from interaction of large civilizations. Let's not confuse pejoratives for things we don't like with primitive. Let's also not confuse being poor with being primitive either. Most of this crap arose from big civilizations with big cities and armies.

    Primitive people are even older and are typically animists or pagans, if anything.

  7. #47
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    They aren't primitive and haven't been for a long time.
    Yeah, they're pretty similar to USA.

  8. #48
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    I didn't mean you specifically. I mean the propensity for people in general to think that we are so awesome with all our advances.

    If we lose respect for things then we truly will become a virus.

    The vast majority of all species that have ever lived on this planet are extinct. Nature kind of has its own 'immune system' and if the 'virus' gets out of hand, we will be no exception.
    Well, or we'll end nature (through ubiquitous control or total extinction of life on the planet). That would be a solution to that particular equation too.
    Though regular massive exctinctions havent quite managed that yet, but hey, if something can do it it's humanity (or a bigger rock, or the sun going nova, or a change in the law of physics or ...)

    Define respect.
    I can for example respect you as a human being by not making 'extra rules' that only apply to myself in my ethical system. However that just means that if i want to fuck you over i also accept that other people (you included) have that right and that i wont complain if i lose at that game.

    No I dont want to fuck you over. You can drop the knife.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  9. #49
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    To get back to the topic, I've found something on Wikipedia. If we can trust Dr. Richard Lynn and Dr. Tatu Vanhanen IQ is racist.

    National_IQ_Lynn_Vanhanen_2006_IQ_and_Global_Inequality.jpg

    Purple = high
    Red = low

    I'm very skeptical to such information, you can make statistics to prove anything.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_...lth_of_Nations

  10. #50
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Well, or we'll end nature (through ubiquitous control or total extinction of life on the planet). That would be a solution to that particular equation too.
    Though regular massive exctinctions havent quite managed that yet, but hey, if something can do it it's humanity (or a bigger rock, or the sun going nova, or a change in the law of physics or ...)

    Define respect.
    I can for example respect you as a human being by not making 'extra rules' that only apply to myself in my ethical system. However that just means that if i want to fuck you over i also accept that other people (you included) have that right and that i wont complain if i lose at that game.

    No I dont want to fuck you over. You can drop the knife.
    It's pretty simple - just realize that all things have repercussions, even seemingly good things. Every cause has an effect and every effect is a cause of something else.

    You're right, it's a competition for resources, but it's a competition for diminishing returns. Competing has a cost, as do all things, even down to the level of physics.

    We could say that it costs you energy to compete, and the more fierce the competition is, the more energy it costs you, and there's inevitably a point of no return where it costs you more than the prize you're competing over.

    It's just like being in a survival situation by yourself. You must expend energy to gather food and water, but if you don't get enough food or water with that spent energy, you never recover it, and you keep spending more energy than you take in and eventually die.

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