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  1. #21
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    A question, HelenOfTroy.
    Is language communication, interaction or imagination?

  2. #22
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Is communication about language??

  3. #23
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Most autists do not learn to speak.
    Autists who learn to speak do not reply to simple questions.
    It is not a problem of language.

    You have an autist child or parent who can speak.
    Does she ask you questions?
    If she does, do you answer them?

    They say autists broadcast, they do not communicate.
    And you do not broadcast?

  4. #24
    Let me count the ways Betty Blue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Most autists do not learn to speak.
    Autists who learn to speak do not reply to simple questions.
    It is not a problem of language.

    You have an autist child or parent who can speak.
    Does she ask you questions?
    If she does, do you answer them?

    They say autists broadcast, they do not communicate.
    And you do not broadcast?
    This is not strictly true, it is a spectrum hence the term ASD.
    The further you go along the spectrum the more severe the cases are considered (the more life affecting) and the less verbal communication/interaction.

    To only consider verbal communication as language/communication is an error imo, think Amanda baggs.
    "We knew he was someone who had a tragic flaw, that's where his greatness came from"

  5. #25
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Is communication about language??
    It's interpersonal connection, and has a lot to do with relating to others, and intuiting intents and feelings. Language doesn't mean much without interpretation.

    Communication is more than language. For example, on the more extreme end of the spectrum with autism, pointing at an object doesn't mean anything. With extreme autistic people, if you point at something, they will look at your finger and not what you're pointing to, because the connection of intent is not made. These same people also don't know how to point to an object to bring another's attention to it.

    Another example in more extreme cases is pronoun reversal. One might say "You are hungry" when they are actually referring to themselves, because other people say 'you'. Or if one person asks "how are you today?" the autistic will say "you are fine" when they actually mean "I am fine"

    This is also related to echolalia, where they simply repeat phrases. e.g. "are you thirsty?" will be replied to with the echo "are you thirsty?" rather than seeing it as a question and answering it.

  6. #26
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Most autists do not learn to speak.
    Autists who learn to speak do not reply to simple questions.
    It is not a problem of language.

    You have an autist child or parent who can speak.
    Does she ask you questions?
    If she does, do you answer them?

    They say autists broadcast, they do not communicate.
    And you do not broadcast?
    Hey Wildcat, old friend. Wanted to weigh in as my instinct is telling me this is a particularly important issue to you, spanning beyond the courtyard of TC.

    I don't want to reveal too much, so I'll try to speak in code. Hope this makes sense.

    Your barriers aren't your fault. Not now. Not then.

    Language takes time. To learn and to speak.

    Missing the target isn't always a question of aim. Or effort. Love makes our aim firm. So firm sometimes we have a hard time finding alternatives.

    Your child becomes you. Words aren't needed. Maturity is experience.

    Being a parent means wanting your child to become better. Not better than them, better than you.


    Keep fighting the good fight.

  7. #27
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Most autists do not learn to speak.
    Autists who learn to speak do not reply to simple questions.
    It is not a problem of language.

    You have an autist child or parent who can speak.
    Does she ask you questions?
    If she does, do you answer them?

    They say autists broadcast, they do not communicate.
    And you do not broadcast?
    Hey Wildcat, old friend. Wanted to weigh in as my instinct is telling me this is a particularly important issue to you, spanning beyond the courtyard of TC.

    I don't want to reveal too much, so I'll try to speak in code. Hope this makes sense.

    Your barriers aren't your fault. Not now. Not then.
    Language takes time. To learn and to speak.
    Missing the target isn't always a question of aim. Or effort. Love makes our aim firm. So firm sometimes we have a hard time finding alternatives.

    Your child becomes you. Words aren't needed. Maturity is experience.
    Being a parent means wanting your child to become better. Not better than them, better than you.

    Keep fighting the good fight.

  8. #28
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Night View Post
    Hey Wildcat, old friend. Wanted to weigh in as my instinct is telling me this is a particularly important issue to you, spanning beyond the courtyard of TC.

    I don't want to reveal too much, so I'll try to speak in code. Hope this makes sense.

    Your barriers aren't your fault. Not now. Not then.
    Language takes time. To learn and to speak.
    Missing the target isn't always a question of aim. Or effort. Love makes our aim firm. So firm sometimes we have a hard time finding alternatives.

    Your child becomes you. Words aren't needed. Maturity is experience.
    Being a parent means wanting your child to become better. Not better than them, better than you.

    Keep fighting the good fight.
    Hey Night. It is a long time hence.

    You see the bottom line, as always. It is a rare talent.
    It is not as if we did not know. It is how to convey the message to the authorities and to the public.

    Autism is not about intelligence, or language. You know it.
    Every autist child can learn to speak.
    Communication is a two way street.

  9. #29
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Night View Post
    Hey Wildcat, old friend. Wanted to weigh in as my instinct is telling me this is a particularly important issue to you, spanning beyond the courtyard of TC.

    I don't want to reveal too much, so I'll try to speak in code. Hope this makes sense.

    Your barriers aren't your fault. Not now. Not then.
    Language takes time. To learn and to speak.
    Missing the target isn't always a question of aim. Or effort. Love makes our aim firm. So firm sometimes we have a hard time finding alternatives.

    Your child becomes you. Words aren't needed. Maturity is experience.
    Being a parent means wanting your child to become better. Not better than them, better than you.

    Keep fighting the good fight.
    Hey Night. It is a long time hence.

    You see the bottom line, as always. It is a rare talent.
    It is not as if we did not know. It is how to convey the message to the authorities and to the public.

    Autism is not about intelligence, or language. You know it.
    Every autist child can learn to speak.
    Communication is a two way street.

  10. #30
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    It's interpersonal connection, and has a lot to do with relating to others, and intuiting intents and feelings. Language doesn't mean much without interpretation.

    Communication is more than language. For example, on the more extreme end of the spectrum with autism, pointing at an object doesn't mean anything. With extreme autistic people, if you point at something, they will look at your finger and not what you're pointing to, because the connection of intent is not made. These same people also don't know how to point to an object to bring another's attention to it.

    Another example in more extreme cases is pronoun reversal. One might say "You are hungry" when they are actually referring to themselves, because other people say 'you'. Or if one person asks "how are you today?" the autistic will say "you are fine" when they actually mean "I am fine"

    This is also related to echolalia, where they simply repeat phrases. e.g. "are you thirsty?" will be replied to with the echo "are you thirsty?" rather than seeing it as a question and answering it.
    Good points.

    A history of an airplane accident. An analogy.
    An airplane is about to land. The person who directs the traffic at the airport says to the pilot:
    - Turn right.
    The pilot turns left. The airplane crashes.
    Did the pilot follow the order?
    He did.
    His 'left' corresponded the 'right' of the director of the traffic.

    Someone takes your picture. The final picture is the mirror picture in the original negative, of course.
    The positive is the negative of the negative.
    1 - ( - 1) = 2

    Does the autist turn 'you' to 'I' and 'I' to 'you'?
    No.
    You turn.

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