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Thread: F---ing logics

  1. #21
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    It does matter whether a feeling is justified (not necessarily logically) or not, though. Feelings that are not justified should not be valued. Does that make sense?
    Yes.

    I'm just trying to say that feelings may be illogical but that doesn't mean that they don't deserve attention. That's it.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  2. #22
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    The point is that humans are not inanimate objects. There are a lot of things affecting humans at any given time and because you all are human (an assumption, I know), you've had to deal with it too. Feelings can be considered the logical result of responses to stimuli and brain chemistry, but the feelings themselves may not be logical. So no, feelings are not logical. But that does it matter? No.
    You say it does not matter... but when dealing with people it does. Somehow being logical has been associated with being a desirable thing to have. To the extend in misuse of the word. (Feelings being logical for one...)

    Another example is multiple intelligence... emotional intelligence. What is emotional intelligence? A misnomer. Any time the issue of intelligence is raised in this forum, some people get defensive and bring up other forms of "intelligence".

    Must we all be perfect in having all the desirable traits? It seems like the attitude the western society is willing to coddle. Why can't people just accept that not all of us can have everything instead of deluding ourselves that we have which we do not?

  3. #23
    Don't Judge Me! Haphazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    You say it does not matter... but when dealing with people it does. Somehow being logical has been associated with being a desirable thing to have. To the extend in misuse of the word. (Feelings being logical for one...)

    Another example is multiple intelligence... emotional intelligence. What is emotional intelligence? A misnomer. Any time the issue of intelligence is raised in this forum, some people get defensive and bring up other forms of "intelligence".

    Must we all be perfect in having all the desirable traits? It seems like the attitude the western society is willing to coddle. Why can't people just accept that not all of us can have everything instead of deluding ourselves that we have which we do not?
    It all depends on definition. What is 'intelligence'? Is it strictly working with facts and things, or can it be applied to handling emotions and other people? 'Emotional intelligence' is a good thing to have, whether the term be a misnomer or not. Why not just leave the label? Somebody who understands the theory will know that 'emotional intelligence' is not the same as 'intelligence' by its usual definition, but it gets the point across just the same. It just refers to the aptitude of a different set of skills than typical 'intelligence.'

    People have to work with the terms that are given to them. People might be bringing up multiple intelligences because they feel like the word 'intelligence' is being misused as 'superiority,' even though that might not be the intent.

    I don't see this as people 'must have all the desirable traits,' I just see this as a confusion of terms. Language is imperfect and tricky, created by irrational human minds. We've just got to figure out how to deal with the limits.
    -Carefully taking sips from the Fire Hose of Knowledge

  4. #24
    Large Member Ender's Avatar
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    We make decisions emotionally and justify them rationally.
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    I don't want it, I just need it, to breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

    Never take life to seriously.. No one gets out alive in the end anyway.

  5. #25
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Owl View Post
    What is irrational is to let feeling override rational interpretation. If our rational interpretation is incorrect, our feelings will not be well suited to the situation. (e.g., it there really were a bear and you continued walking toward it, that could end very badly.) I.e., our feelings can be misleading, but sound arguments are never misleading.
    Yes feelings (emotions) have a functional role in our survival. The R complex, the limbic system... there are needs for "base" emotions. Feelings are at best subconscious though... To react immediately without thinking and therefore they just are... and not inherently logical.

    Quote Originally Posted by Haphazard View Post
    It all depends on definition. What is 'intelligence'? Is it strictly working with facts and things, or can it be applied to handling emotions and other people?
    That's another can of worms. It has been discussed in previous threads, but we can start a new one again.

    'Emotional intelligence' is a good thing to have, whether the term be a misnomer or not. Why not just leave the label? Somebody who understands the theory will know that 'emotional intelligence' is not the same as 'intelligence' by its usual definition, but it gets the point across just the same. It just refers to the aptitude of a different set of skills than typical 'intelligence.'
    I'm not suggesting EQ is of no importance. Which it does, immensely in social interactions. It's just that the typical person does not truly know what "intelligence" means yet they brandish the term as a means of justifying their believes. Much like how "social darwinism" came into existence.

    I don't see this as people 'must have all the desirable traits,' I just see this as a confusion of terms. Language is imperfect and tricky, created by irrational human minds. We've just got to figure out how to deal with the limits.
    You might not see it, but people unconsciously feels inferior whenever a "desirable trait" is mentioned that they do not have. Some then proceed to arguing for that which they do not have.


    Fixed!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    We make decisions emotionally and attempts justify them rationally.
    The term for that in psychology is confabulation.

    So you agree that feelings (and your Fi) are illogical?

  6. #26
    Large Member Ender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    We make decisions emotionally and attempts attempt to justify them rationally.
    Fixed!
    Yes it is..

    adds another word to his bitening to English dictionary

    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    The term for that in psychology is confabulation.

    So you agree that feelings (and your Fi) are illogical?
    Hell no my feelings are completely logical. Unless I was faking them.. Only then would they be illogical in truth or a confabulation of sorts.
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    I don't want it, I just need it, to breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

    Never take life to seriously.. No one gets out alive in the end anyway.

  7. #27
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    Playing with an idea:

    Feelings occur naturally, by which I mean, one cannot control one's feelings.
    Nature is composed of cause and effect--in other words, logical.
    Thus, feelings are logical.

  8. #28
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Yes it is..

    adds another word to his bitening to English dictionary
    You know well enough that was a typo! :steam:

    Hell no my feelings are completely logical. Unless I was faking them.. Only then would they be illogical in truth or a confabulation of sorts.
    How are they logical? Feelings are never logical. They're just there! You believe it's right because it makes you feel good, so you do it. Where's the logic in how feelings come about?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dana View Post
    Playing with an idea:

    Feelings occur naturally, by which I mean, one cannot control one's feelings.
    Nature is composed of cause and effect--in other words, logical.
    Thus, feelings are logical.
    Exactly!

  9. #29
    Large Member Ender's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    You know well enough that was a typo! :steam:


    Quote Originally Posted by nightning View Post
    How are they logical? Feelings are never logical. They're just there! You believe it's right because it makes you feel good, so you do it. Where's the logic in how feelings come about?


    Exactly!
    So you tell me that feelings are never logical.. Then agree with Dana that they are?

    Where's the logic in that?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    I don't want it, I just need it, to breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.

    Never take life to seriously.. No one gets out alive in the end anyway.

  10. #30
    ish red no longer *sad* nightning's Avatar
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    I agreed with her first part... that's all...

    Feelings are natural and thus uncontrollable.
    The second part is a non sequitur though...

    In fact that's a perfect example for illogic.

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