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    Default This has to be stopped.


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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    How is that not considered as child abuse and what qualifies that as a therapy?
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  3. #3
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Wow, that's fucked up. That's child abuse to be sure. Coersion and double-binds can create severe mental illness in children. Disgusting.

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I've got to say that I'm a residential social worker and a lot of my practice is informed by attachment theory, I dont recognise what is being talked about here, if you would like to be informed about what attachment theory is and how it can inform therapeautic practices, the majority of which involve talking, then there are far better places to get informed than following these links.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attachment_theory

    While I've never heard of this woman Welch, I'm acquainted with John Bowlby and Donald Winnicott, psychoanalysts and child psychologists in the UK who developed their practice through study of evacuees in the UK and children being looked after by families and in residential/group living situations during and after the war, this was a pretty unique opportunity to study and assess the impact of attachment, loss and bonding between children and carers:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Winnicott

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Bowlby

    Attachment disorders are real. They arent disputed like other childhood behaviourial diagnosis, such as attention deficit hyperactive disorders, some of which are actually considered associated with attachment problems and developmental deficits resulting from that.

    Treatments and treatment plans for this kind of disorder are diverse and variated, they can include pharmocological treatments, usually if there's an ADHD diagnosis, and talk therapies. The talk therapies can include therapeutic crisis intervention, which will involve discerning triggers to escalation from a baseline to agitation and outburst, using a variety of behaviour management ideas, although mainly active listening, open questions, reflecting back and when crisis has past discussion of the crisis to identify the interplay of feelings and behaviour, the consequences and rehearsing different, more appropriate behaviour.

    The use of physical restraints within residential and childcare settings are sometimes necessary, in those instances where I would consider it warranted it is not just the physical safety interventions which critics should be attacking but the behaviour which mandates it in the first place. We're not talking about verbal abuse, adults losing it and wrestling kids with a excuse rolled out by academia here.

    Serious questions should be asked by both professionals in that setting and their public critics, in the abscence of any approved restraint what happens? Is it a question of allowing any kind of response which can be grouped under the heading of "self-defence"? Should it be allowed to escalate to a physical struggle or violence and is it more or less likely to if there's no approved physical restraints?

    The original website seems to be vague, to regurgitate a number of popular urban myths, such as the whole satanic ritual scandals and to be created by a number of aggrieved individuals with bad experiences, I would question its objectivity and usefulness in improving childcare facilities or practice. It is only likely to feed the imagination of a naive or hostile public.

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    How is that not considered as child abuse and what qualifies that as a therapy?
    The original link doesnt tell you anything about attachment theory, attachment disorder, reactive attachment disorder or therapy, other than questioning the validity in a vague fashion, the sort that I'd associate with the anti-psychiatry movement in the US, lets be honest here people the whole world has moved on from the time when One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest was closer to documentary than drama.

    The use of physical restraints is unfortunately necessary when vulnerable children are going to hurt themselves, hurt other children or adults, its analogous to a child running into traffic, you would stop them wouldnt you? Now wouldnt it be a good idea to know that if you grab a child by a particular part of the arm if you can you're minimising the risk of them breaking their arm or being injured in the process of preventing them running in front of car?

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    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    Yeah. It's terrible that happened to children. But I'm pretty sure that's just illegal and people in general need to research the "professionals" they seek..... Especially when it comes to their offspring. I can't find any info about the people that actually performed this "therapy" and whether or not they even went to college. Credentials or none, they clearly belong in jail.....
    I didn't watch the youtube videos.
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  7. #7
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Lark, can you outline what is an effective form of therapy for a child who is unable to attach, say, to a step-parent?

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortnsweet View Post
    Yeah. It's terrible that happened to children. But I'm pretty sure that's just illegal and people in general need to research the "professionals" they seek..... Especially when it comes to their offspring. I can't find any info about the people that actually performed this "therapy" and whether or not they even went to college. Credentials or none, they clearly belong in jail.....
    I didn't watch the youtube videos.
    I'm sorry, did you follow the same links as me?

    I followed the first one and like I said it wasnt clear at all what was being discussed, I think I've seen some content similar to that in the first YouTube video on training as an example of what is not an appropriate way to restrain a child, for a number of reasons, constriction, speaking to the child during the restraint etc.

    Credentialism and expertise are contentious issues maybe and they do not place people above suspiscion or question automatically, I'd hate to operate in a world where it where so easy to fool people, on the other hand maternal deprivation, neglect, emotional abuse and cruelty occasioning trauma are all terrible things with real consequences, usually challenging behaviour which can escalate easily towards violence and bullying. Often these sorts of interventions are needed by professionals working in local authority care facilities when the children have been made wards of the state or court orders are in place.

    The alternative would be to leave a child who is acting out violently with parents who may have little recourse to any means of managing it other than violence themselves, maybe escalating to a level where peoples welfare is seriously jeopardised, for instance they could be killed.

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    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    The original link doesnt tell you anything about attachment theory, attachment disorder, reactive attachment disorder or therapy, other than questioning the validity in a vague fashion, the sort that I'd associate with the anti-psychiatry movement in the US, lets be honest here people the whole world has moved on from the time when One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest was closer to documentary than drama.

    The use of physical restraints is unfortunately necessary when vulnerable children are going to hurt themselves, hurt other children or adults, its analogous to a child running into traffic, you would stop them wouldnt you? Now wouldnt it be a good idea to know that if you grab a child by a particular part of the arm if you can you're minimising the risk of them breaking their arm or being injured in the process of preventing them running in front of car?
    I know about attachment theory etc and have taken a course of developmental psychology where we went through these things, how misbehaving children should be handled, how different attachment styles are formed etc.

    What happens there is child abuse and will most likely just harm the child, even if you could get bit more control over the kids..
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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    I know about attachment theory etc and have taken a course of developmental psychology where we went through these things, how misbehaving children should be handled, how different attachment styles are formed etc.

    What happens there is child abuse and will most likely just harm the child, even if you could get bit more control over the kids..
    Care to elaborate? What are the main attachment styles? What are the main attachment disorders? What're the consequences for either for an individual?

    What happens? I'm not exactly clear, what is it that's happening which is resulting in harm and permitting someone to "get bit more control over the kids"?

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