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  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Given the general reaction I think I gave the wrong impression of what I am referring to. I'm talking about the rapid increase in the consumption of violence in the general media, meaning shows, movies and so forth. Violence as entertainment. Ask yourself a different set of questions to see where I am coming from; why does the news bother people while we consume billions of dollars of (violent ladden) movies that entertain us? Would you say the people in today's time are significantly different than those that enjoyed gladiator sports, too? We have a natural empathy, and various social masks, but it needs to be triggered.
    There is a lot to say on this. I view it, as I view a lot of things, from the Zizek/Lacan point of view of The Imaginary, The Symbolic and The Real.

    He analyzes the way in which intense experiences such as sex or violence, which our mind fantasizes as it cannot deal with them directly, are expressed, as fantasy, in movies. I recommend The Pervert's guide to Cinema which you can view free on Vimeo.

    It was easy to misunderstand you as saying that people "deep down" enjoy violence in all contexts, even on the news when you see someone defenseless getting victimized. I wouldn't approach the question from that point of view at all as I don't think it's true.

    If we are looking for the "grain of truth" that lies in all points of view, then here goes: Somebody who is in a very dangerous situation, can be taken over by adrenaline. Likewise someone witnessing violence might in some or many cases get a lesser but similar reaction. Adrenaline could, by someone wanting to make a very eye-catching and controversial point, be described as "enjoyment", but I think it would be more of a mystification than a clarification.

  2. #92
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Il Morto Che Parla View Post
    It was easy to misunderstand you as saying that people "deep down" enjoy violence in all contexts, even on the news when you see someone defenseless getting victimized.
    I don't believe I said all contexts! Context is what makes exceptions to the general behavior of violence as entertainment. Moral and social filters are the contextual filters.

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I don't believe I said all contexts! Context is what makes exceptions to the general behavior of violence as entertainment. Moral and social filters are the contextual filters.
    By saying you could be misunderstood, I was implying that you did not say it.

    In fact I suspected what you meant, but my point is that it was very unclear.

    Violence I guess can be like anything else in fiction, works well within a certain contex to serve a certain purpose. I don't think Goodfellas would be very effective without violence for example.

    Regarding GTA style games, I like them, but I wouldn't universalize it to everyone. My mother for example, cannot view any kind of violence on TV, she covers her eyes. I'm not talking Saw, I mean like literally any kind of beating or shooting where you see the victim up close, etc.

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    I meant that I see you as normal and have no reason to assume otherwise.
    That conflicts with your putting me "at a higher rate" than the general population.
    At this point, I'm inclined to think you're just talking out of your ass and rapidly back-peddling..

    I don't consider a lack of empathy to be normal. I consider it to be pathological and at the root of all those things we call evil.
    It's not enough to assume "everyone does it" ergo, it's "normal". There are strong links between consumption of violent sadistic material and real-life acts of violence. Even if violence is in some sense "normal" it's not something we should encourage or tolerate.

    The Academy of Pediatrics says “More than one thousand scientific studies and reviews conclude that significant exposure to media violence increases the risk of aggressive behavior in certain children, desensitizes them to violence and makes them believe that the world is a ‘meaner and scarier’ place than it is.” If children begin to think that this type of violence is normal behavior these thoughts are often said to be difficult to change later on in life. This is similar to the studies of domestic violence where children who are exposed to violence either become offenders or victims because they believe that what they are exposed to is the norm. One instance that brought the worry of violence in media is the Columbine incident. The two young men that committed this act of violence were said to have played numerous hours of violent video games. Their exposure to violence is said to have been the cause since the children involved in Columbine came from secure home environments with active parental influence. As with Michael Carneal, from Kentucky, who in 1997 shot and killed three of his classmates. He too was also said to have been a video game fanatic. Michael Breen an attorney in the case against Michael Carneal stated in court; “Michael Carneal clipped off nine shots in a 10-second period. Eight of those shots were hits. Three were head and neck shots and were kills. That is way beyond the military standard for expert marksmanship. This was a kid who had never fired a pistol in his life, but because of his obsession with computer games he had turned himself into an expert marksman” (Ivory, 2003), (Hanson, 1999, p. 15). These two instances in a whole may be small evidence however, proves that violent media play a role in such violence.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  5. #95
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Violence is embraced in all forms of media.. It terrifies me that there are so many people who can consume and excrete violence without flinching.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  6. #96
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    That conflicts with your putting me "at a higher rate" than the general population.
    At this point, I'm inclined to think you're just talking out of your ass and rapidly back-peddling..
    Oh probably. Call it half-assed responses. Gotcha's don't interest me much.

    In any case, I originally didn't mean that I thought you were a sadist, unlike your projection of it to me. It was pointed out that it came across that way, so I obviously wasn't very clear - apologies for that. If you care, I'd say that you fall within the "normal" range; higher than average probably, but still normal. I simply view the consumption of violence as normal.

    (The weirdest thing about this, for me, is that I am on the far curve of not consuming violence. Well, maybe Minecraft zombies.)

  7. #97
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    I've watched the entire Saw series. Plus the whole Spartacus tv show.

    Does that make a psycho? An INTP psycho!

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Maybe because you look to OKCupid as an authority?
    Certainly, the last thing you quoted supports my statement.
    also this:
    Not OKCupid. It's passage from a book on psychopaths written by Dr. Kevin Dutton, Ph.D., which happens to mention OkCupid.

    The last passage supports the second part of your statement, a part I do not contest. I take issue with:

    There are not "degrees of psychopathy" it's a binary state.
    As to what Glycerine said, it doesn't support your argument against my postulates.


    I'm tired of this tangent. The issues you're raising with what I've said are, in my opinion, trivial and silly. Also, a few of your statements have made me sad because, to quote you: "At this point, I'm inclined to think you're just talking out of your ass." I made a mistake when I posted about something that wasn't explicitly requested in the OP; I injected my ideas and analysis in a thread you created to discuss experiences.

    So, to start over:

    No, I haven't ever experienced a psychopath online, at least to my knowledge. I'd be interested to hear about the experiences of others.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    I'm tired of this tangent.
    Well, that makes two of us.
    The issues you're raising with what I've said are, in my opinion, trivial and silly.
    And your equating psychopathy with trolling is, imo, trivial, silly and a demostration of your ignorance of the topic. It's quite important to define terms. Otherwise, every troll would be a psychopath. Including you. And me, (according to some estimations).

    Of course, according to the Daily Mail & Mark Zuckerberg, I am a psychopath.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...uspicious.html

    That's what I call chilling.
    No, I haven't ever experienced a psychopath online, at least to my knowledge. I'd be interested to hear about the experiences of others.
    I've only once felt like I was genuinely in the presence of evil with someone on this forum. I tell a lie. Maybe twice. Once was with Noir, who was probably trying too hard to be evil to actually be evil.
    The other was with someone who reminded me of Gacy, with his similar fascination for creepy clowns.



    As is my wont, I dismissed those premonitions of evil at the time. But when they are shared by several others, you start to think you might be on to something. Hence this thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

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