Light/L Lawliet/Michael Westen/Lelouch

[Illmatic]

Their ability to manipulate.
Their ability to improvise and come up with plans in a split second.
Their ability stay ahead of the enemy
Their ability to know what the opponent is thinking and be like 'if i do that, they will do this so i have to do this' kinda thing.

Deductive Reasoning? Inductive Reasoning? Lateral thinking?
What is the name to describe each of these characteristics?

 

[Elfboy]

Ni/Te

 

[Savage Idealist]

Their ability to manipulate.

Rationally using the connection between their source of power and the environment to acheive maximum benefit; not sure if there's a name for it; Te, and to a lesser extent Fe.

Their ability to improvise and come up with plans in a split second.

Quick and adaptable thinking, 'thinking on your feet'; Ti, Se, or Te I suppose.

Their ability stay ahead of the enemy

Long term conceptual thinking; Ni.

Their ability to know what the opponent is thinking and be like 'if i do that, they will do this so i have to do this' kinda thing.

Conceptual thought + Deductive reasoning; Ni/Te.

 

[Rasofy]

Many functions can be assigned for these tasks. I think these ones would perform better:

Their ability to manipulate.

Fe. Te might convince, but the finest persuasion is done with Fe, no doubt. Te is authoritarian and tends to trigger resistance, OTOH, Fe is subtle and catches people off guard.

Their ability to improvise and come up with plans in a split second.

Se for optimal in-the-moment awareness and Ti to quickly analyze the viability of the plan.

Their ability stay ahead of the enemy

Ni. I don't know how to explain, it's a bit vague.

Their ability to know what the opponent is thinking and be like 'if i do that, they will do this so i have to do this' kinda thing.

Ne to project multiple scenarios and solutions and Ti to filter everything. Te+Ni may do it faster but Ne+Ti is more likely to get the all possibilities covered.

 

[Illmatic]

Ni. I don't know how to explain, it's a bit vague.

You know when an enemy makes a plan and everything looks bad for the hero, but in actuality it's all according to the hero's plan.

 

[Rasofy]

It is hard to properly type Light and Michael Westen, their abilities are too vast to be true.
I could make a case for Light being both INFJ and INTJ and for Michael Westen being both ISTJ and ISTP.

 

[Hive]

Light is nothing but an INTJ. He's all Fi. Yes, he wants to create a better world for everyone, but he's still the sole judge of who's good and who's evil, according to his own moral standards. The reformation of society is an enneagram 1 thing.

 

[Rasofy]

You know when an enemy makes a plan and everything looks bad for the hero, but in actuality it's all according to the hero's plan.

The explanation was actually good, I just don't know how to justify it properly.

Light is nothing but an INTJ. He's all Fi. Yes, he wants to create a better world for everyone, but he's still the sole judge of who's good and who's evil, according to his own moral standards. The reformation of society is an enneagram 1 thing.

I can see an INFJ gone bad doing the same thing easily.
His emotions are used in a very deliberated way. He is hardly ever blunt. Plus he uses a lot of Fe in his manipulations, whereas Fi and Te would be much weaker tools. Imo, ''Light'' is more F-oriented and ''Kira'' is more T-oriented, but they both use Fe/Te.

 

[Hive]

The explanation was actually good, I just don't know how to justify it properly.

I can see an INFJ gone bad doing the same thing easily.
His emotions are used in a very deliberated way. He is hardly ever blunt. Plus he uses a lot of Fe in his manipulations, whereas Fi and Te would be much weaker tools. Imo, ''Light'' is more F-oriented and ''Kira'' is more T-oriented, but they both use Fe/Te.

Light's moral values are not chosen from an external standard; he's not aspiring to create a "community" where everyone shares the values, it's not an "us against them"-mentality Fe-manipulators such as Hitler used. He is imposing HIS rules on everyone else according to HIS standards and HE is the judge of who's good and who's not. And manipulation is not solely a Fe thing you know.

 

[Rasofy]

Light's moral values are not chosen from an external standard;he's not aspiring to create a "community" where everyone shares the values. He is imposing HIS rules on everyone else according to HIS standards and HE is the judge of who's good and who's not.

Most people agreed that he was making the world a better place. That's what really makes him proud of his actions. In the end, he has an external standard.
You are taking a healthy Fe as parameter, whereas Fe combined with narcissism is tricky. The means may cease to be a concern.

And manipulation is not solely a Fe thing you know.

Right, can also be Te, but the effectiveness of a logical persuasion is weak. Fi isn't meant to influence, and therefore it performs poorly.

 

[Hive]

Most people agreed that he was making the world a better place. That's what really makes him proud of his actions. In the end, he has an external standard.
You are taking a healthy Fe as parameter, whereas Fe combined with narcissism is tricky. The means may cease to be a concern.

Right, can also be Te, but the effectiveness of a logical persuasion is weak. Fi isn't meant to influence, and therefore it performs poorly.

He was thinking "Great, now noone dares to commit a crime, what a wonderful world we live in" while in actuality everyone lived in fear. He doesn't consider anybody else, he's just disgusted by the way some people behave and acts as supreme moral authority.

I'm also curious to see examples of him using Fe as a means to manipulate. I'm thinking for instance the whole thing with Raye Penber; how he got him to show his ID and made him kill all the FBI agents. A meticulously crafted plan perfectly executed. Te.

 

[Rasofy]

He was thinking "Great, now noone dares to commit a crime, what a wonderful world we live in" while in actuality everyone lived in fear. He doesn't consider anybody else, he's just disgusted by the way some people behave and acts as supreme moral authority.

He thinks he is being good for the mankind. His narcissism won't allow him to acknowledge that people are living in fear, though.

I'm also curious to see examples of him using Fe as a means to manipulate. I'm thinking for instance the whole thing with Raye Penber; how he got him to show his ID and made him kill all the FBI agents. A meticulously crafted plan perfectly executed. Te.

He masterfully used Fe on Ray penbar's wife when he needed her name. No INTJ on Earth could have pulled that.

 

[Hive]

He thinks he is being good for the mankind. His narcissism won't allow him to acknowledge that people are living in fear, though.

He masterfully used Fe on Ray penbar's wife when he needed her name. No INTJ on Earth could have pulled that.

I can't say for sure if it was Fe or not because it was a long time ago I watched the show, but I do remember that his behaviour was above all insincere. Even Ryuk said something like "Who's this cheerful guy?". He clearly doesn't have a preference for Fe; he just pulls out the charm when he needs it (and manipulating by charm isn't even exclusively Fe: ENFP's for example can easily do this as well). Also I think the rest of the show display his crazy awesome Te quite perfectly.

 

[Rasofy]

I can't say for sure if it was Fe or not because it was a long time ago I watched the show, but I do remember that his behaviour was above all insincere. Even Ryuk said something like "Who's this cheerful guy?". He clearly doesn't have a preference for Fe; he just pulls out the charm when he needs it (and manipulating by charm isn't even exclusively Fe: ENFP's for example can easily do this as well). Also I think the rest of the show display his crazy awesome Te quite perfectly.

You have good points. Enneagram Type 1 is a great guess, and seems common among INTJs. OTOH, I'm yet to met an ENFP or INTJ that could manipulate that well. I guess we should agree to disagree and move on.

 

[Hive]

But I want to be right!

 

[Elfboy]

But I want to be right!

you are right. Light is the epitome of Fi over Fe. he cares everything for values and absolutely nothing for people (one reason why he's so awesome ) his thinking is Te (pragmatic, efficient, results oriented) and he is definitely an I. being an S is kinda out of the question, he's INTJ

 

[Hive]

you are right. Light is the epitome of Fi over Fe. he cares everything for values and absolutely nothing for people (one reason why he's so awesome ) his thinking is Te (pragmatic, efficient, results oriented) and he is definitely an I. being an S is kinda out of the question, he's INTJ

Yes, but I want my opponent to admit it too

 

[Rasofy]

Yes, but I want my opponent to admit it too

LOL. I admit he is more of an INTJ, but I still think he is in a grey zone.