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  1. #41
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    When I was younger, I was much like the OP. I really resented being interrupted and asked what I was thinking about or why I looked sad, or being prompted to smile.

    Nowadays, I've resolved that problem by treating the situation as an opportunity for a brain dump: I tell the other person what I was thinking about right at that moment. Sometimes I have to clean it up or be general so as not to shock or be socially inappropriate, but in general I really do tell them what was on my mind, sort of as an anecdote. Even to total strangers.

    And usually people are interested. It reassures them that I'm not in a foul mood because of them; and it makes me seem more transparent (and therefore non-threatening) because they see me opening up easily to them on demand. And personally I kind of have fun with it. It's kind of a surprise to me what comes out sometimes.

    But that's how I've resolved that situation as I've gotten older. Furthermore, it suggests to me an answer as to why that situation was such a problem when I was younger. It was because I imagined some kind of high barrier or wall between "me" and "them" that I felt shouldn't be breached. Now that I've gotten in the habit of breaching it, I find it's kind of fun to let people in on my thought processes. I think it gets back to the "self-monitoring" thread, and perhaps concerns the issue of what we consider our "true self" (and how zealously we guard it from the outside world).

    Just my two cents, of course. Oh well, off to bed.:zzz:
    Good thoughts! I can relate to what you're saying...I do get annoyed, feeling like people are being invasive and forcing their views/attitudes/moods on me, but at the same time, I do feel like I sometimes put up an antisocial wall. When I'm at my least neurotic and most self-confident, things like that don't bother me as much, and I start to realize that the "barrier" is often self-imposed. I'm most protective of myself and more a staunch defender of my right to be different when I don't feel balanced or completely confident.

    I'm not saying it's the same for everyone, but it does come into play with me. I imagine the level of one's introversion also is a factor. I am mostly introverted, but I have bursts of extraversion, and when I do, sometimes I'll FEEL like being a "yay" person, but it's still my choice. It's okay if you don't want to "yay," but deliberately choosing not to out of principle, just to be different, is not necessarily more "real." It might feel more real, but can also be a way to distance yourself from your humanity. I struggle with this idea a lot, and I don't know if it's an INTP thing? I feel isolated, so I make an effort to understand people better and my chameleon skills go to work. But then I feel uncomfortable after a while, b/c it feels inauthentic. Then I go back to being ultra-independent, which is a lot of the time just going against the grain to feel different/individualist. It's something I've struggled with my whole life, and I don't know if I've ever really come up with an answer for it.

    I guess the closest I've come is to realize that there are a small group of people with whom I feel authentic, and I don't ever have to think about issues like this around them. These are the friendships that matter to me. It's only among acquaintances/work colleagues/etc. that the "fakeness" issue comes into play.

  2. #42
    Senior Member Grayscale's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    Of course I don't mean losing all tact or sensitivity, I just mean letting go of the joy addict type stuff, all the smiling depressives running around, smiling all day and crying inside, alone and trapped.
    an important distinction. all too often i hear people ask for "honesty", but based on my perceptions of them i can say resolutely that they would not like hearing it. the times i have ignored those perceptions have reinforced them as correct.

    my plight has often been that, internally, the most biting realities exist harmoniously through a greater attitude or understanding, and although i can convey the former if i choose, the latter is not something i can teach someone

    the issue of sincerity and "integrity to internal self" is a difficult one for me. if being sensitive to others' feelings means altering how you say things, wouldn't that require a certain level of insincerity?

  3. #43
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainChick View Post
    Great post!!!

    I think part of the reason why I happen to be such a great "people person", is the fact that I am very cognizant, understanding, and accepting of myself, and all of my myriad issues. For some reason, as you mentioned above, this directly correlates with one's ability to be compassionate with others.

    Coolness!!!
    I dated someone like this a while ago. She was able to laugh at all of her insane quirky habits. It was kind of endearing, even though sometimes I wished she would look into them and do some introspection. She introspected from a distance. Extrospected?

  4. #44
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    When I was younger, I was much like the OP. I really resented being interrupted and asked what I was thinking about or why I looked sad, or being prompted to smile.

    Nowadays, I've resolved that problem by treating the situation as an opportunity for a brain dump: I tell the other person what I was thinking about right at that moment. Sometimes I have to clean it up or be general so as not to shock or be socially inappropriate, but in general I really do tell them what was on my mind, sort of as an anecdote. Even to total strangers.

    And usually people are interested. It reassures them that I'm not in a foul mood because of them; and it makes me seem more transparent (and therefore non-threatening) because they see me opening up easily to them on demand. And personally I kind of have fun with it. It's kind of a surprise to me what comes out sometimes.

    But that's how I've resolved that situation as I've gotten older. Furthermore, it suggests to me an answer as to why that situation was such a problem when I was younger. It was because I imagined some kind of high barrier or wall between "me" and "them" that I felt shouldn't be breached. Now that I've gotten in the habit of breaching it, I find it's kind of fun to let people in on my thought processes. I think it gets back to the "self-monitoring" thread, and perhaps concerns the issue of what we consider our "true self" (and how zealously we guard it from the outside world).
    How dare I not mention that this is an awesome and insightful post, also, it would seem that most "strangers" I happen to engage, share your sentiments... and I love it!!!!

    I love *truly* getting to know people, even when those persons happen to be people you'll never see or meet again, crap, my heart is swelling from thinking about this. I'm suddenly overcome with Maverick's illness, dear me, I love people!!!!
    `
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    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grayscale View Post
    an important distinction. all too often i hear people ask for "honesty", but based on my perceptions of them i can say resolutely that they would not like hearing it. the times i have ignored those perceptions have reinforced them as correct.

    my plight has often been that, internally, the most biting realities exist harmoniously through a greater attitude or understanding, and although i can convey the former if i choose, the latter is not something i can teach someone

    the issue of sincerity and "integrity to internal self" is a difficult one for me. if being sensitive to others' feelings means altering how you say things, wouldn't that require a certain level of insincerity?
    It is a fineline and depends on when and where one is and how deep to go with that person. I can come up with some pretty scary Fi type refelections that I usually have to keep to myself because it scares/disturbs other people to hear it because they don't like to think about the more unpleasant aspects of life. It isn't that I am fake with others, it is just that I am selective with whom I share the deeper reflections I have about life and the darker side of life.

  6. #46
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    You know, people aren't really as strict about that as you think. People do ask me questions like that, but I never inferred that it was because they expected something and were irritated that I wasn't giving it to them. I always assumed it was because I was quiet/subdued, and they're usually only that way when they're tired or sad.

    I just say that I'm fine, and thank them for asking. They usually seem to accept that response and don't pursue further. I occasionally manage to casually mention in conversation that I read a lot, and that I'm somewhat nervous in public. They generally get the idea at that point and accept my typical behavior.

    Finally, if the people I usually work/sit close like to talk to me, I usually wave to them, say hello, ask them how they're doing, tell them one thing that happened to me recently, and then proceed to mention what I'm working on and lay it out to start working (so I always bring something important-looking to work on when I'm going to be around people). This usually results in them remembering something they forgot to do, and trying to do some work themselves. You can keep this pattern up for over a year, in my experience, and people never start to expect more.

    So basically, people are easily appeased.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by athenian200 View Post
    So basically, people are easily appeased.
    You must hang with vastly different people than I seem to run into!

  8. #48
    Senior Member Grayscale's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post
    I dated someone like this a while ago. She was able to laugh at all of her insane quirky habits. It was kind of endearing, even though sometimes I wished she would look into them and do some introspection. She introspected from a distance. Extrospected?
    laughter is often something people use to distancing themselves from things they cant/havent come to terms with, as is a detached point of view. sounds like an interesting person...

    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    It is a fineline and depends on when and where one is and how deep to go with that person. I can come up with some pretty scary Fi type refelections that I usually have to keep to myself because it scares/disturbs other people to hear it because they don't like to think about the more unpleasant aspects of life. It isn't that I am fake with others, it is just that I am selective with whom I share the deeper reflections I have about life and the darker side of life.
    a common approach... i am driven to jump into the raw, unfriendly reality of anything because experience tells me i will come out on the other side a stronger, more balanced person. it is one of my goals with people is to help them not only see things as they are, but to overcome the challenges involved... i earnestly believe most people can do it, and they will be better off for doing so! unfortunately i rarely get a chance to get to the second half :sad:

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grayscale View Post
    a common approach... i am driven to jump into the raw, unfriendly reality of anything because experience tells me i will come out on the other side a stronger, more balanced person. it is one of my goals with people is to help them not only see things as they are, but to overcome the challenges involved. i rarely get a chance to get to the second half of that :sad:
    Maybe it is the difference between Fi and Ti, but for the most part I see other people's facing the world as it is as something they must do for themselves. I certainly will try to help someone if they ask, but I am more apt to try and help them uncover what they want to do or how they really feel.

    The only time this is different is when I sense that someone is projecting a fake persona to the world and I want to probe deeper into that and uncover the real person.

    When I say fake, I don't mean merely not showing all their cards, but presenting fake cards to the world. It is fair to not show all that one is, but not so pleasing or flattering to show other than one is.

    I am not altogether comfortable with this desire in myself either, I feel like maybe it is none of my business to try and uncover the real person underneath.

  10. #50
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by athenian200 View Post
    So basically, people are easily appeased.
    I deal with it by ignoring it, but even if it's easy to dismiss, I still find it imposing.

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