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  1. #1
    Senior Member Thisica's Avatar
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    Unhappy Self-hate and self-berating

    For the past few weeks, I have dived down this rather sad route of self-blame and ridiculous self-defeating thoughts. Hence a question: have you experienced something like this? And how did you get yourself out of this self-looping behaviour?
    “To explain all nature is too difficult a task for any one man or even for any one age. 'Tis much better to do a little with certainty, & leave the rest for others that come after you, than to explain all things by conjecture without making sure of any thing.”—Statement from unpublished notes for the Preface to the Opticks (1704) by Newton.

    What do you think about me? And for the darker side, here.

  2. #2
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Yup I have. And it's extremely debilitating, I've found.

    I got myself out of it by realizing that if I saw someone else in the same situation, the very situation I'm berating myself for, I'd feel compassion towards them and want to help them. Or, depending on the situation, I wouldn't even notice that they did something that deserves berating. Or, I'd be way more forgiving of their misstep, especially if I was given insight into their motivations. This is especially true if their intent was meant well, and they somehow fumbled up the execution due to...well...being human.


    Errare humanum est.

    Put it in your sig, plaster it on your wall, use it as your daily mantra. Curse at being human if you must, but realize that you *are* human and you *will* mistakes, as much as it annoys the crap out of you. And to think you won't, believe that you shouldn't or couldn't is..well...sheer pride

    Fun thing about humans is: they bounce back. They're a hardy breed that's insanely resilient.

    So..WHEN you make a mistake...make sure you learn from it and get back on that horse. Nothing worse than keeping yourself down due to fear.

    I know. Easier said than done
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  3. #3
    Uniqueorn William K's Avatar
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    Well, I would say that recognizing that it is a problem is a major first step. My brain still reacts by going "You're an idiot, William!" when she thinks that I've made a mistake, but I can ignore her more often now

    I'd echo Vala's suggestion of reminding yourself that nobody is perfect and to err is indeed human. And realize that no matter how bad things are for you, there are probably many people in the same boat or in even worse situations. Learn to appreciate your strengths and recognize your weaknesses to achieve a healthy balance. Not easy of course but it's your life and you can control it.

    Edit : Oh yeah, and the Bertrand Russell quote in my sig
    4w5, Fi>Ne>Ti>Si>Ni>Fe>Te>Se, sp > so > sx

    appreciates being appreciated, conflicted over conflicts, afraid of being afraid, bad at being bad, predictably unpredictable, consistently inconsistent, remarkably unremarkable...

    I may not agree with what you are feeling, but I will defend to death your right to have a good cry over it

    The whole problem with the world is that fools & fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. ~ Bertrand Russell

  4. #4
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    This has popped up.... occasionally for me. My guess is that you are holding yourself up to a much higher standard than other people. Sometimes its easier to forgive the same thing in others, but not in ourselves. Quite frankly, I consider it an "over-active conscience" and bad people do not have this. period.

    The best thing to do is realize your over-active conscience makes you subjective. You need to objectively take a step back.. and focus on what good came from whatever mistake. (Yes, there is good in everything.)

    It could be as simple as
    *you learned something about yourself
    *you've grown in a way that you probably couldn't have, if this didn't happen.
    *when a similar situation arises in the future, you will know how to handle this better
    *you have new found appreciation for something, etc.

    Take special note in how you respond to yourself when mistakes happen. Again, this requires you to take a step back and see it as objectively as possible. If you are saying "I'm so stupid, bad" etc.. you are hurting yourself, and its a waste of time. When we hurt ourselves like this, we can not clear our minds to see the truth of the situation. We can not move past it, and we can not learn from it. You must teach yourself to think "This is okay. I am okay. I am a human and capeable of mistakes. All people make mistakes. I will grow from this. I will do better."

    Remember that the way you chose to react to something comes from your understanding of the facts, at that time. You might come accross different facts at a later time that alter how you originally thought or reacted. This is perfectly normal, and it is growth. Any growth that takes place rappidly, tends to be painful. It is the human condition.

    Also remember that replaying a scenario over and over in your head is normal. The more conscionce you have, the more this will happen when you feel you've done something wrong or innapropriate. It is your minds way of figuring it out, resolving it. Help your mind understand that there is no "wrong" or "right". Expectation tells us there is a wrong or right, that it is black and white.. but it most definately is not. So try not to look at things this way. Seek to be the truth of yourself. Not your ideal, but your truth. Being the truth is the best anyone can be. When people accept the truth of themselves and quit holding to expectations.. contentment is found. Never ask if you were right or wrong, always ask if you were honest.
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  5. #5
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    For the past few weeks, I have dived down this rather sad route of self-blame and ridiculous self-defeating thoughts. Hence a question: have you experienced something like this?
    Yes.

    And how did you get yourself out of this self-looping behaviour?
    I know most here probably think I'm crazy, a troll, or a narcissist, but the following is quite genuine.

    After extensive analyzing of the reasons why people do things, I came to the understanding that people that rationalize people away in absolutists statements, like "He is narrow-minded" or "He is too emotional" or "She is irrational" or "This is not good enough work" only due so because they have had the fortune of success from that (hard work is irrelevant); they then end up projecting their own standards on other people because of this and then believe 'they don't influence people' or that they 'have no obligation to consider how this effects others', but yet expect others to consider whatever they think is 'reasonable' or 'moral' because they found one way that works primarily for them at the exclusion of many others. The damn pricks. And the only become willing to listen or consider you when you are capable of shattering their little most-beneficial-to-themselves order they've formed of everything.

    And it's ironic too because by the nature of our existence we learn about the world by making assumptions about it and then applying those assumptions to see if we are right or not. So we make a lot of mistakes to learn. But some people that have had the luxury of another person helping them make as little mistakes as possible think that they also have reason to pass judgment on others that don't have that luxury because they ended up more successful.

    Really everyone is essentially full of self-serving shit and so by this alone I really don't care much about the rationalizations people try to apply to me anymore, for the most part.

    But, for me, when people push these things on me and I become aware of it I disconnect from the morals and expectations of those around me and only do whatever I think is best for myself, becoming essentially amoral like the Joker from Dark Knight, but not as psychopathic or psychotic. It works well enough. Only problem is I can't take much for granted in order to always give myself the mental outlet to do that. It's a little isolating to always be formulating a plan to separate myself from people when they become toxic, but very freeing when it is used. The only problem is to do this I have to reject all any currently built Fi that suddenly becomes toxic. So I guess it hurts anyway, but not as much as taking shit from people.

    Well, I don't know. This post might be useful somehow.

    sincerely,
    the world's greatest ESFP

  6. #6
    Senior Member knight's Avatar
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    oooooooo I have been looping as well. I was asked a question, it was a complicated question simplified and to be answered as either Yes or No. I felt embarrassed b/c it was something i never considered and i was not able to articulate my thoughts as prompt an gave an incomplete fragmented answer. after my answer left my mouth, I realized how many ways my answer could have been read and what may have been drawn about the situation and myself. *sigh* anyway, I felt better though when i was able to move out of the the place and take a quick nap and think about it later. having something that draws you in, a creative outlet helps. when i fall into a zen like trance i can mediate over how things as they really are.

  7. #7
    Let me count the ways Betty Blue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thisica View Post
    For the past few weeks, I have dived down this rather sad route of self-blame and ridiculous self-defeating thoughts. Hence a question: have you experienced something like this? And how did you get yourself out of this self-looping behaviour?
    Yes i have and the singular thing that really helped me was a bit of self analysis.
    Oh and self help, quite like counselling yourself.
    Basically it goes back to the inner child in you. Were you criticized a lot as a child, think about it...for what reasons? How old were you. Try to find a link with what you are feeling now.
    The next step is to ask yourself if you would, knowing what you know now, criticize another child the same way.
    Then go back to yourself and connect with the child inside yourself, why are you giving your inner child a hard time, go easy.
    Also remember that everyone is only ever doing the best they know how at the time, otherwise they would do better.
    Don't berate the child inside you.
    I know a great book, weather it would benefit you depends on weather you are ready.
    Also i don't know what kind of person you are but when i did this for the first time i realised i was berating this little kid (inside me) who really didn't deserve it. It made me cry a hell of a lot but after i came to a realisation and it released a lot of guilt and self hatrid i had stored up inside for a long long time.
    Anyway i'm putting myself out there a bit with saying all of this, i hope it is of some help to you, if not no worries.
    "We knew he was someone who had a tragic flaw, that's where his greatness came from"

  8. #8
    Superwoman Red Herring's Avatar
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    If you ask around in your environment, you might see that quite a lot of people suffer from something similar, though to different degrees.

    A good start is realizing that what you do is irrational (i.e. you expect the impossible and then become frustrated when it doesn't happen) and to then look into the causes. Do you feel that you have to be perfect/better to earn your place in the world? Do you feel like you have to be perfect/better to be loved or to be accept other people's affection for you?

    I know all too well that emotional introspection isn't excactly an NT's forte (if you tell me important news and want a reaction, you might have to wait till the next day or so before I can tell you how I truely feel about it; before that, there isn't much to draw on, I just block it out), so here is the Te version, especially for you:

    What is the worst that could happen?
    What are the chances of that?
    What can you actively do to prevent it?
    Take preventive action or at least put down a plan to get you back in control of things!

    That being said, I am very glad I got a professional on board to show me how ridiculous some of those fears are and how I was constantly putting myself down and my own interests last without even noticing it (false expectations and interpretations of situations, also speech patterns, little gestures, etc).
    The good life is one inspired by love and guided by knowledge. Neither love without knowledge, nor knowledge without love can produce a good life. - Bertrand Russell
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  9. #9
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Quote Originally Posted by GemPOPGem View Post
    Yes i have and the singular thing that really helped me was a bit of self analysis.
    Oh and self help, quite like counselling yourself.
    Basically it goes back to the inner child in you. Were you criticized a lot as a child, think about it...for what reasons? How old were you. Try to find a link with what you are feeling now.
    The next step is to ask yourself if you would, knowing what you know now, criticize another child the same way.
    Then go back to yourself and connect with the child inside yourself, why are you giving your inner child a hard time, go easy.
    Also remember that everyone is only ever doing the best they know how at the time, otherwise they would do better.
    Don't berate the child inside you.
    I know a great book, weather it would benefit you depends on weather you are ready.
    Also i don't know what kind of person you are but when i did this for the first time i realised i was berating this little kid (inside me) who really didn't deserve it. It made me cry a hell of a lot but after i came to a realisation and it released a lot of guilt and self hatrid i had stored up inside for a long long time.
    Anyway i'm putting myself out there a bit with saying all of this, i hope it is of some help to you, if not no worries.
    This is really good advice. Thank you for sharing it with all of us.

  10. #10
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    are you an INTJ?

    heard of Ni/Fi loops? basically, when one introverts (or extroverts) too much without the balance of the extroversion (or introversion) functions, our introverted functions basically start tearing away at our ego's. for an INTJ, the looping is between the first and tertiary functions of Ni and Fi. emphasis on your Te should help.

    ...but how does one exercise Te?

    i've gone through several bouts of depression in my life, and they are no fun. doing things like, tapping into my creative nature, or going out on hikes and walks, helped a lot. journaling, writing out my thoughts. talking with a friend. etc.
    "I don't know a perfect person.
    I only know flawed people who are still worth loving."
    -John Green

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