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  1. #21
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquarelle99 View Post
    Those who can spell "basically" and those who can't? (Sorry sorry sorry, that was mean! but I had to go there...)
    I was accused of "trolling" when I brought up spelling.

  2. #22
    Starcrossed Seafarer Aquarelle's Avatar
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    Everyone makes spelling errors, and I can ignore it when it's within a post, but this thread title has been staring me in the face for days and driving me slowly mad.
    Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting.

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  3. #23
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munchies View Post
    I gave a speculationi never said i fully coincide with this theory, and since you don't even counter any of my ideas and just splur out bs countering the main idea of this thread, the title... without actually fully understanding my concepts...

    if you did read the article, maybe you should try addressing the ideas within it next time . All your motive seems to be is to bash this theory and to not understand, if that's the case why are you even here?

    and before you decide to post against this, take a deep breath and let your negative emotions pass so i don't end up having to read more bs.
    Wether you gave just a speculation or not. It's still obvious that the concept drawn by the theory is one that bears no fruit or profit, not to mention the fact that it is contradictive, inaccurate and incomplete on so many points that I believe the theory is mostly a waste of time.

    But ok, I'll spare a few and indulge you with my thoughts on the subject.

    You make a distinction between those that draw incomplete conclusions (That may or may not be biased, faulty or innaccurate), and those that do not. And you say that pretty much all the evil in this world comes from those incomplete conclusions. Whilest in itself this seems like a proper idealistic explanation of such things, it overlooks the fact that people have free will. And even though that free will can be manipulated and molded into collective groups all over the world, the core of it is still that these people chose this path themselves. They have weighed the pro's and cons with whatever cognative function they feel comfortable with, and the result of it all is groups forming. Nations, churches, political parties, tupperware cliques and so one and so forth.

    How would you go to someone like that and tell them they should forget about their ideals and beliefs and have an open mind instead? You can't, because if they believed you to be right, they wouldn't have ended up the way they were in the first place. And that's without going into the semantics of what is right for a person. Where the concept in your post goes out for is a collective similar style of life that everyone should adapt to live in a better world, in reality the masses wouldn't be able to conform to such thinking and the result of it all would argueably be far worse then the current situation.

    If there is anything we could learn about this subject. It is that open mindedness should perhaps be more open to close mindedness and accept close mindedness as part of the collective that are us all. But other than that I just don't see how making such a distinction has any merit. As it is adding in some propaganda, depicting the 'believers' negatively, and the open-mindedness as positively, while the very notion of believers being negative or open mindedness being positive is in itself a biased conclusion drawn by the writer of the concept. And the arguements for as well as against that notion show promise.

    Realizing that, one should probably draw the conclusion that people should be left to drawing their conclusions by themselves, as this is obviously the only way for people to be themselves, and thus create a balanced and livable environment for us all.
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  4. #24
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munchies View Post
    i mentioned a spectrum didn't i? There are two distinct types of people to the core, but of course there can be people more towards the center of that spectrum.

    Since you were so quick to judge and used absolutely used no logic to counter my very well thought out insight., id say that your statement was just emotionally charged with no intellectual backup.
    and i'd say that you have no idea what my line of thinking was, just because i didn't write paragraphs and paragraphs in response to you, or is that an emotional reaction on my part too?

    you see what you want to see. including twin tower conspiracy.

    look. for as much thought as you may have put into it, your theory is really... well, it's so subjective. and look at your replies. are any of them actually serious? that should probably give you a sense of what people think of it...

    but, if you really want an intellectual argument - okay, so one, you're hypothesizing that emotion and logic can be equated in the thinking process, which... (a) belief and emotion are not necessarily the same; beliefs involve the frontal cortex but emotion is limbic - you could have a non-emotional belief driving your logic, and you can be emotional without it fueling how much you are open or closed to new things, (b) you didn't specify which emotions - while i would tend to agree that someone who is angry or fearful is more closed-minded, people who are feeling curious, happy, and adventuresome would probably be more likely to be open-minded. hence my earlier post - emotion is not the same as reasoning. it can be utilized to think without drawing a conclusion. i don't know how much you know about MBTI, but my type - ENFP, extraverted intuiting and introverted feeling - is actually all about that, which is why i was so quick to respond. i process emotion often but do not always come to decisions with it.

    so then you go from there to saying that all people who make fast decisions are easy to convince, which i can't say i have really seen played out IRL; many of the people i would term most "closed-minded" are really very stubborn, they choose certain beliefs and stick to them, and then build their other reasoning on those beliefs. then the alternative, according to you, is thinking without emotion or logic (since you've said the two are the same), except what that says to me is either that person is really indecisive, or they jump to irrational beliefs. which is not necessarily open-minded either way - one can easily be indecisive and closed off to new information. but i'm not sure also how you could think without drawing any emotional or logical conclusions. you would have to perceive only. even if you kept your mind open that more than one line of reasoning could be correct, you would still have to make some emotional or logical conclusions somewhere along the lines to be able to reasonably function in life.

    you're basically breaking people down into fast and slow decision-makers. you say that the fast decision makers are easily swayed - but then that makes them rather open-minded, if they're willing to listen to others and change their ideas, doesn't it? i mean, in MBTI speak, it sounds like what you're saying is that Judgers are more closed-minded than Perceivers because their Perceiving is influenced by their Judgments - but then the idea that they're easy to convince sort of goes against that. unless you're saying that they're more easily swayed in their own direction, which may be true, but then how do you necessarily end up with a whole group of people believing the same thing? it would seem that, if your theory is correct, some emotional/logic thinking people should be inherently biased to look at things in a different way than other emotional/logic thinking people, and to not accept the others' conclusion because they are closed off to it... unless they are somehow all programmed to think the same thing - whereas the open-minded people aren't going to be choosing conclusions at all, so how is the vast majority of people going to reach the same conclusion and stick to it? i'd be much faster to attribute those sorts of beliefs to fear, groupthink, and lack of education, as opposed to the way some people's minds inherently work.

    anyway, there's my line of thinking. i'm not saying you're wrong, necessarily, i'm saying this way of thinking about things is unnecessarily complex and doesn't line up with other patterns in life well enough to be of much use. we can split humans into all the irrelevant dichotomies that we want, but what good is it going to do us? you knew even before you started typing this the sort of beliefs you found repelling. i guess you're explaining why the thinking leading to those beliefs is wrong, but i'm not sure that you're really being entirely objective about it. you've made conclusions of your own... emotional/logical conclusions of your own. you needed an answer to why people believed in really idiotic things, right? hence your post? judging that making judgment calls is bad is ironically a judgment call in and of itself...

  5. #25
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
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    Phew! I saw this absolute title, and I thought RedScorpion was back.

  6. #26
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munchies View Post
    There are two distinct types of people to the core, but of course there can be people more towards the center of that spectrum.
    the problem isnt your distinction between these two types of people that you are talking about, its that you can make this kind of distinction on pretty much any physical or psychological difference and many of those distinctions make at least as big difference between people than your two types. for example i could say that there are basically introverted and extroverted people or that there are basically highly neurotic and chill people etc etc.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  7. #27
    Senior Member Mephistopheles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    the problem isnt your distinction between these two types of people that you are talking about, its that you can make this kind of distinction on pretty much any physical or psychological difference and many of those distinctions make at least as big difference between people than your two types. for example i could say that there are basically introverted and extroverted people or that there are basically highly neurotic and chill people etc etc.
    Yeah... He simply chose one dichotomy ......and declared it to be the only one that matters.^^
    They say I only think in form of crunching numbers.....
    -Fall Out Boy

  8. #28
    Senior Member Munchies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    the problem isnt your distinction between these two types of people that you are talking about, its that you can make this kind of distinction on pretty much any physical or psychological difference and many of those distinctions make at least as big difference between people than your two types. for example i could say that there are basically introverted and extroverted people or that there are basically highly neurotic and chill people etc etc.
    There is more reasoning than what you are saying. It's not just two things i compare. There are actually reasons and an argument but this forum doesn't like to inquire much, so everyone just quickly looks at it, judges it, walks away to the next thing.

    and now im stuck arguing on everything else but the reasons for my conclusionl, and everyone is just busy looking at my conclusion and not the things backing it up.. It's fine:P i don't care if nobody wants to talk about it but fk lol at least make an inquiry .. actually try to understand the concepts rather than judge :P if you cant do that i don't really care what u have to say.
    1+1=3 OMFG

  9. #29
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munchies View Post
    There is more reasoning than what you are saying. It's not just two things i compare. There are actually reasons and an argument but this forum doesn't like to inquire much, so everyone just quickly looks at it, judges it, walks away to the next thing.
    there are reasons and arguments for other factors that you can compare.. im not judging anything else what you say than what you say about there being basically two types of people. use 5 minutes on studying personality psychology and if you still think that there are basically two types of people theres something seriously wrong with you
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  10. #30
    Senior Member Munchies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    im not judging ... if you still think that there are basically two types of people theres something seriously wrong with you
    Right....

    Anyways, i did plenty of study on psychology, and i know there are distinct reasons to why people act the way they do. I am interested in the science of opinions and how they are formed. If you wanna argue with me the reasons i described in my article do it. But If you want to stick to one personality theory your whole life, great. Some people want to discuss different ideas on different things and maybe make progress.
    1+1=3 OMFG

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