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  1. #11
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    I was spanked (as well as other unmentionable forms of punishment) as a child, and all it did was make me passive-aggressive and severely depressed. Once my parents started treating me like someone that can be reasoned with instead of punished every time I did something bad (sometimes, something "bad" wasn't very much at all, or even intentional), our relationship began to become healthy and happy.

  2. #12
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I think if the sixteen-month-old keeps trying to stick a slobbery finger in an outlet or keeps wriggling out of their car seat while you're driving down the road and you've already tried redirecting, rewards, and scolding, a stinging (not bruising) slap on a little fat thigh is not an unacceptable solution.
    I was going to say that IMO spanking is MORE acceptable for the younger toddlers than older kids, not less. They are more likely to connect the spanking to their actions instead of their motives, so they won't feel ashamed, which is what bothers me about spanking older kids.

    At the same time, there's usually another way to do it without spanking- part of the reason I don't spank is because I was a nanny for many years before I was a mother, and I had to come up with ways to get kids to do what they're supposed to do without spanking them, so that was what I was used to. Outlet covers have saved my son's life many a time.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  3. #13
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I was going to say that IMO spanking is MORE acceptable for the younger toddlers than older kids, not less. They are more likely to connect the spanking to their actions instead of their motives, so they won't feel ashamed, which is what bothers me about spanking older kids.

    At the same time, there's usually another way to do it without spanking- part of the reason I don't spank is because I was a nanny for many years before I was a mother, and I had to come up with ways to get kids to do what they're supposed to do without spanking them, so that was what I was used to. Outlet covers have saved my son's life many a time.
    I could only see myself spanking a child under certain circumstances, ones where the behavior is very dangerous, like running in the street. And I agree that it's more acceptable at a younger age.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #14
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArtlessFuture View Post
    outlawed in California (where I live) but I don't know if it happened.
    For it or not, that's a parent's call, but outlawing it statewide... That's some straight coyote BS right there.

    Not at all surprised that California would waste it's time with such a stupid law though. I love Cali, don't get me wrong but the place is a little out there.

  5. #15
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I could only see myself spanking a child under certain circumstances, ones where the behavior is very dangerous, like running in the street. And I agree that it's more acceptable at a younger age.
    IMO running in the street is something that it is up to the parent of a very young child to prevent. If they make it to the street they're not being supervised well enough IMO. There's no sense in punishing a toddler for something they're really too young to be in charge of themselves. All in good time, my pretty. All in good time.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  6. #16
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I was going to say that IMO spanking is MORE acceptable for the younger toddlers than older kids, not less. They are more likely to connect the spanking to their actions instead of their motives, so they won't feel ashamed, which is what bothers me about spanking older kids.

    At the same time, there's usually another way to do it without spanking- part of the reason I don't spank is because I was a nanny for many years before I was a mother, and I had to come up with ways to get kids to do what they're supposed to do without spanking them, so that was what I was used to. Outlet covers have saved my son's life many a time.
    My daughter would go for the ones with things plugged into them. We had covers on the open ones. She was extremely determined. We would say no and redirect, say no and redirect, say no and redirect and she'd go right back to it every time, look us right in the eyes and do it again. Forget terrible twos. She started that at 9 months. If I'd been her nanny I would have quit.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  7. #17
    Fe, rusted. Poser's Avatar
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    I was spanked when I was a child. I can't remember anything worse than when I was sent to my room to wait for it. I am a parent now and I also believe in spanking. But more importantly, I believe in finding whatever works for each kid and using that. Children have different personality types too. For instance, spankings never fazed our first born, so we had to find something else. However, just the threat of a spanking with our second born will stop anything. We always have and still do reserve spanking for defcon 5 situations though. And another rule was to always count to 20 first.


  8. #18
    Highly Hollow Wandering's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I think if the sixteen-month-old keeps trying to stick a slobbery finger in an outlet or keeps wriggling out of their car seat while you're driving down the road and you've already tried redirecting, rewards, and scolding, a stinging (not bruising) slap on a little fat thigh is not an unacceptable solution.
    Agreed. When he was younger, my son would sometimes get into this defiant mode, where he would deliberately do what he knew he mustn't do. Sometimes he would even look at me while doing it, with a very clear message in his eyes: "Look, Mom, I'm doing what you forbade me from doing." Only one thing worked at those times: a couple of slaps on his nappy-covered bottom. He'd cry, not out of pain, but out of sheer frustration (I know, because I would actually miss sometimes, and he would cry anyway!), but we'd be straight about who's the boss around here, and believe it or not, but he actually liked that!

    I haven't had to spank him in a while now, and I'm much more uncomfortable with doing it anyway, because he's not wearing any nappies anymore, so the slap would end up straight on his bum, which I feel would be increasingly inappropriate. Any slaps I feel like handing out are now aimed at the specific offending party: the hand that keeps getting too close to danger, the foot that won't stop kicking the wall, things like that. But mostly, it's the verbal communication (not necessarily of the patient kind, though) that's on the increase. Ultimately, my secret hope is that we can solve our conflicts through serious talking, my all-time favourite solution - and the one that
    unfortunately can't often be applied to toddlers.

    As for the article: I'm with others that the connection probably isn't between spanking and delinquent behaviours later in life, but between overall deficient parenting and deliquency, spanking being only the tip of the deficient parenting iceberg. IOW: it's probably not about spanking, but about the lack of communication, the lack of respect (from the parents towards the kids at first), and so on.

  9. #19
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    My daughter would go for the ones with things plugged into them. We had covers on the open ones. She was extremely determined. We would say no and redirect, say no and redirect, say no and redirect and she'd go right back to it every time, look us right in the eyes and do it again. Forget terrible twos. She started that at 9 months. If I'd been her nanny I would have quit.
    Heh. I did have one like that who if he'd been mine I'd have spanked him, most likely. As it happened I just counted down the minutes until his mom picked him up. He was a SUPER sweet little guy with so much energy, he was just a limit tester and wouldn't take no for an answer.

    Thing 2 is just now starting to deliberately test limits. He has always been a handful but for the most part he's been an oblivious handful- it really does just go in one ear and out the other, so he's not so much defiant as out to lunch. But now he's doing that look-you-in-the-eyes thing and upping the ante. It's like he's saying "Whatcha got to back up that 'no'?"
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    First, I would very clearly defined "spanking" -- it covers a wide gamut of disciplinary measures, but of course if it's taken to mean " indiscriminately beating your child," I doubt anyone sane would support that.
    I agree. There is a world of difference between a smack on the rear and an honest-to-goodness beating.

    I was spanked as a child and were I to have children I would spank them as well. Despite enlightened (?) arguments to the contrary, I don't believe young children can be reasoned with like an adult. And I'd rather spank my child and ensure that they understand dangerous or unacceptable behavior than have something awful happen and be left with the cold comfort that at least I never spanked him. (I know that sounds overly dramatic, but I didn't know how else to say it.)
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

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