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  1. #21
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    I'm likely to befriend him only and ignore the rest of what he wants, as it's his turf. I wanna *know* him. I have this anyways with the partners I select, but with him, I'd wanna know it all. And, I am normally not known for my patience, but in this case, I have oceans of time. If he's interesting enough, I'm in no hurry. I'd wanna know it all. Quid pro quo games, playful banter on a platonic level, and *any* time he goes back to playing his game, and go sexual, innuendo or whatever, I'd ignore it, be utterly oblivous to it and not let it affect me. I know..this, coming from me is ironic, but yeah. Coz it's the only way to show him there's more to life than powerplay. It's fun, for sure, but it's not what a relationship is built on.

    The goal is to let him know that I like him for who he is, not what he can do to me. Not the cheap thrills (while mightily fun) that he provides. He's more than that. And, my main prize? It would be his trust. That's what I'd set out to get. I'd not be interested in him sexually till I get it..and till he's proven to have earned mine. As I said..quid pro quo.

    Ultimately, I'd listen, without being judgemental and I'd wait. If he runs, then I wasn't the right person to do this for him, and we might not have been a good couple anyways. If he sticks around and puts in the time, you as well as he might just find what you're looking for


    Btw. You'd better know what the f** you're doing, if you're going to go down this road, or be ready to have your heart torn out. Those are the stakes, my dear.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  2. #22
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satine View Post
    I'm likely to befriend him only and ignore the rest of what he wants, as it's his turf. I wanna *know* him. I have this anyways with the partners I select, but with him, I'd wanna know it all. And, I am normally not known for my patience, but in this case, I have oceans of time. If he's interesting enough, I'm in no hurry. I'd wanna know it all. Quid pro quo games, playful banter on a platonic level, and *any* time he goes back to playing his game, and go sexual, innuendo or whatever, I'd ignore it, be utterly oblivous to it and not let it affect me. I know..this, coming from me is ironic, but yeah. Coz it's the only way to show him there's more to life than powerplay. It's fun, for sure, but it's not what a relationship is built on.

    The goal is to let him know that I like him for who he is, not what he can do to me. Not the cheap thrills (while mightily fun) that he provides. He's more than that. And, my main prize? It would be his trust. That's what I'd set out to get. I'd not be interested in him sexually till I get it..and till he's proven to have earned mine. As I said..quid pro quo.

    Ultimately, I'd listen, without being judgemental and I'd wait. If he runs, then I wasn't the right person to do this for him, and we might not have been a good couple anyways. If he sticks around and puts in the time, you as well as he might just find what you're looking for
    SOLID. GOLD. may the angels sing your praises, woman. have you seen this technique work? i've heard others talk about playing the "loyal friend patiently lying in wait" game. i see no downside as long as body parts stay right where they belong.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  3. #23
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    I've done it before. And not with people I wanted to date. Just people that I found incredibly interesting, that I saw such potential in, but were stuck within themselves. It doesn't always work. And it takes tons of work. Don't expect any miracles.

    And..know what you expect at the end. I did it coz I genuinly cared for them, and, because the bond you build with them is one of a kind, every damned time. But I didn't expect *a thing*. You have to go in expecting *zero*. Otherwise, you lose by default.

    Forget about dating this man. Forget about even considering him for sex. Find out who he is and what makes him so unique.

    BTW. This isn't a game. It's not even to be considered as such. This requires a lot of patience, perseverance and the utmost respect for the other person's being and soul. This is brainsurgery, in many ways. One screw-up, and the backlash can devastate not only you, but especially them. Once again, I ask you, are you up for this?

    TBH, I wouldn't recommend it to *anyone*, especially not lightly.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  4. #24
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satine View Post
    Forget about dating this man. Forget about even considering him for sex. Find out who he is and what makes him so unique.
    yes. i'm not sure what that'd make us (friends, i suppose). that seems wise. i also like the thought of coming from a place of genuinely caring for him/expecting nothing. i'm not sure how many people have ever done that for him. i think he said maybe 1-2 people truly know him. i've also read a lot of INTJs complaining online that no one would like them if they really knew what they were like inside. hmm...

    i really do think the rational, calm, cynical side of him is just a facade, and that he's unaware of his inner beauty. he certainly gets plenty rewarded by never engaging it. and i've seen just little glimpses of it. he'd probably roll his eyes if i said i'd like to know that side of him.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Rex's Avatar
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    blablabla. Chop hes head of..
    Epic derailment:
    wierd memory work->Tamagochi->tetris->Starcraft2->thugs->Chess->german techno->Love parade->disaster->death..
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1wH2...eature=related

  6. #26
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Satine's analysis of this guy are pretty much on the money.

    The dark side of the INTJ is that we can be completely ruthless about getting what we want. Ni figures out the angle, Te handles the execution, and the world bends to our will. When all we seek is a shallow form of personal satisfaction, all parties are quite correct to beware of us. We will find the optimal way of achieving our goals, whether those goals are selfish or altruistic.

    Most INTJs I've known aren't like this, having a sensitive inner Fi side that they're protecting, rather than insatiable desires that they're feeding. The way to tell the difference is to point out the stereotypical "death gaze" to them. The sensitive INTJs will look confused and hurt. The selfish ones will instead blandly reply, "Yeah. So?"
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  7. #27
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satine View Post
    BTW. This isn't a game. It's not even to be considered as such. This requires a lot of patience, perseverance and the utmost respect for the other person's being and soul. This is brainsurgery, in many ways. One screw-up, and the backlash can devastate not only you, but especially them. Once again, I ask you, are you up for this?.
    i don't think i can possibly do this if i don't have the purest of intentions. and if any romantic feelings linger. i'll have to ponder this carefully...

    i told him last night that i wouldn't mind seeing him on a mind-altering drug. just to see his analytical side disengaged. he said they help, but "good luck." i think this is going to be harder than crashing the Vanity Fair Oscar party...
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  8. #28
    Unlimited Dancemoves ® AgentF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MatsNorway View Post
    hes what... 38?
    yep.
    I may be kindly, I am ordinarily gentle, but in my line of business I am obliged to will terribly what I will at all.
    ~ Catherine the Great


    7w6 ❣ sx/so ❤ physical touch ❥ sanguine 70%, choleric 30% ❦

    Johari.

  9. #29
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satine View Post
    And..know what you expect at the end. I did it coz I genuinly cared for them, and, because the bond you build with them is one of a kind, every damned time. But I didn't expect *a thing*. You have to go in expecting *zero*. Otherwise, you lose by default.

    This is so true, and I think is applicable to all sorts of types/relationships -- meaning, if you genuinely care about them and such, and want to help them or at least want them to continue being in your life, you can't have any vested interest in the outcome. I think most of the times, it's really hard - and sometimes/often impossible- to get to this internal point where you truly *don't* need it to eventually turn into a romance, or for them to 'come around' and want to be wtih you, etc -- they may, or they may not. As Satine also mentioned, you might not be the right person to foster any of this - and frankly, he might not want it. And if you have an emotional tie to a particular outcome, then that will always be 'skewing' your purity of intention and such in getting to know them and helping them - because you're factoring in your own desires as well. Anyway, this whole paragraph is just more of a generality - I'm not specifically applying it to your situation.

    So that said, if you don't know that you even want him to be in your life, in any capacity (i.e. you're not ok with him being a potential Friend starting now and forever, watching him dating others and hearing him talk about that), then might be good to reflect on why you're in it. Why ARE you in it, given how you're fitting into his life and how he's treating you/the relationship? Do you like having these sorts of dynamics or do you like the sort of dynamics he creates with other women? Do you really see any of that changing in the near future?
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  10. #30
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    I'm not entirely comfortable contributing in a thread where people are publicly stating that they find it acceptable to maximize the pain of another individual as a group. I read the thread earlier and walked away from it because I found it distasteful, however, I was invited to contribute explicitly so I guess I should. So the first thing I would say is that it isn't necessarily ethical to plot to get 'social' revenge on someone and to encourage that in others then to document it for everyone to review. It is up to the OP to decide what it is that they require from another person based upon the alternate perspectives.

    As people know I am continuously pre-occupied with logical ethics to the point of distraction; however, I would hate to imagine that someone would assume that because I wasn't willing to analyse them that they do not exist. That doesn't excuse the behaviour of this individual, but unless you are willing to have good agreement on ethics I think it will bother you and his behaviour will continue. However, you should also understand that he is rationally correct to a point in saying 'This is how I behave, if you don't like it don't suffer me'.

    In my view this guy must have a few mental issues, after all, he did try to commit suicide as a child; but it isn't in anyones interest to try to find that fault in him and fix it unless he is willing to do that and the most effective place to do it would be with a psychiatrist. As you say, if he does view that he was abused in a past relationship then he may simply be out to play as much as possible with as little commitment as possible to protect himself from that.

    I can tell you that the INTJ involved isn't acting in a way that I would find ethical and is acting out of what he sees as 'self protection', it appears very arrogant and very manipulative in this case.

    You can't transmute lead into gold, I fear you are looking either for the philosophers stone or to find someone who will tell you what to do with this situation because your Fi rational side is displaying extreme distress and making extreme alarm noises at your Ne which is rolling around like purring kitten and enjoying the experience in the current context. It is up to you to work out what is the right action in this situation.

    With regards to dominance; I like to keep dominance to the bedroom and to have a partner who is an equal socially otherwise. However, different folks, different strokes. Yes I am successful, yes I am arrogant, yes I am unwilling even to participate unless I have sufficient information to think I can 'win' and on occasion I am quite willing to manipulate all of the pieces into the correct place in a very logical and clinical way. However, at the same time if I do directly give my word to do something I never fail to follow through, I will tell you exactly what has happened and has happened in a truthful way, whether others like that or not and I am extremely observant.

    This is just INTJ-ILI and I do warn you that this can be quite typical behaviour for us in some cases. You may find that if this dominance powerplay and pragmatism focus is very dangerous or too exceptional that INTJ-LII is more of a similar flavour you can enjoy without getting a burnt tounge, or of course ISTJ/INTP.

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