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  1. #81
    Senior Member Adasta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    Hmm, I don't even think that there are that many people from Eastern Europe in the US.
    Apart from the Jews...

    NB. Polish Jews, Germans Jews etc. Before someone numpty says "Jews are from Asia."
    That girls are raped, that two boys knife a third,
    Were axioms to him, who'd never heard
    Of any world where promises were kept,
    Or one could weep because another wept.

  2. #82
    Starcrossed Seafarer Aquarelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    Hmm, I don't even think that there are that many people from Eastern Europe in the US.

    Not as many as Western European, certainly, but there are a fair amount of people of Eastern European descent. I know lots of people of Russian, Ukrainian and Polish descent. Their ancestors tend to be more recent immigrants, like I said. You might find this interesting - I did!:

    Self-Identified Ancestry from 2000 Census

    Actually 7.2% of the population identified their ancestry as simply "American" (listed separately than Native American). But the largest ancestral groups are German, Irish, African, and English. Closely followed by Mexican and Italian (all above 5%).

    Albanian and Serbian are pretty low on the list, but Yugoslavian is higher.
    Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting.

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  3. #83
    Senior Member guesswho's Avatar
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    Yugoslavia no longer exists....there was a war in there because of Russia. And the country was divided. Lovely Russia.

    The ancestry census thing is really interesting .

  4. #84
    Starcrossed Seafarer Aquarelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    Yugoslavia no longer exists....there was a war in there because of Russia. And the country was divided. Lovely Russia.
    Exactly. People whose ancestors came over while Yugoslavia still existed probably self-identified as Yugoslav. People who identified as Serbian, Macedonian, etc probably are either immigrants themselves or maybe their parents.
    Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting.

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  5. #85
    Senior Member Hirsch63's Avatar
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    If you enjoy puzzles as I do tracking you ancestry has a lot of appeal, after all it is your personal puzzle. You learn how this great experiment, this melting pot of cultures produced the family you came from. Surely boring to some who are more forward looking and for whatever reason have no interest in ethnic heritage.

    When I undertook my initial work in my trade I was very impressed with american adaptations of british styles of eighteenth century furniture; queen anne lowboy, Chippendale chairs....I rapidly discovered that these forms had strong regional characteristics, their own genealogy as it were. As I studied more I realized that these were furniture forms my ancestors could not have owned or afforded. This turned me towards a serious study of the material culture of the Pennsylvania Germans. Which went hand in hand with the study of my own family. For the seriously invested student genealogy may open up a a world of knowledge regarding the social, political and economic forces that have shaped the evolution of america and give the experiences of your family deeper meaning. There is also as mentioned earlier the knowledge of what particular illnesses have dogged you family for generations. America is of course a relatively young country many of us can still see back to our immigrant ancestors who sacrficed much to venture here and try life anew. These were brave people. Of course not everyone is deeply invested in their heritage; they are aware of it and perhaps the fond memory of an uncle who still spoke the old language or the memory of childhood customs makes them proud to say I am lithuanian or greek or whatever. Euorpeans stayed at home. They were comfortable or satisfied where they were. Those who risked coming here (especially early on) would have experienced significant physical, spiritual and emotional challenges...they may deserve some modicum of recognition, even if it is just a simple aknowledgement of our name being the same as theirs.
    Patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings...Steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you a king

  6. #86
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    No Eastern European people over here? Are you kidding?

    As someone else has said, the States has a large number of Russians, Ukranians, and Poles. When I lived in Wisconsin, mony people I met were of Polish descent.

    In Western Canada there are Doukhabours (Russian), Mennonites (from Russia and Ukraine), Ukranians, and Poles a-plenty. In addition, recent years have brought over a large number of Bosnians, Serbs, Croads, Yugoslavians, Czechs etc. Every school and many of the food places/factories in my town have people from Eastern Europe there who are recent immigrants.

  7. #87
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hirsch63 View Post
    If you enjoy puzzles as I do tracking you ancestry has a lot of appeal, after all it is your personal puzzle. You learn how this great experiment, this melting pot of cultures produced the family you came from. Surely boring to some who are more forward looking and for whatever reason have no interest in ethnic heritage.

    When I undertook my initial work in my trade I was very impressed with american adaptations of british styles of eighteenth century furniture; queen anne lowboy, Chippendale chairs....I rapidly discovered that these forms had strong regional characteristics, their own genealogy as it were. As I studied more I realized that these were furniture forms my ancestors could not have owned or afforded. This turned me towards a serious study of the material culture of the Pennsylvania Germans. Which went hand in hand with the study of my own family. For the seriously invested student genealogy may open up a a world of knowledge regarding the social, political and economic forces that have shaped the evolution of america and give the experiences of your family deeper meaning. There is also as mentioned earlier the knowledge of what particular illnesses have dogged you family for generations. America is of course a relatively young country many of us can still see back to our immigrant ancestors who sacrficed much to venture here and try life anew. These were brave people. Of course not everyone is deeply invested in their heritage; they are aware of it and perhaps the fond memory of an uncle who still spoke the old language or the memory of childhood customs makes them proud to say I am lithuanian or greek or whatever. Euorpeans stayed at home. They were comfortable or satisfied where they were. Those who risked coming here (especially early on) would have experienced significant physical, spiritual and emotional challenges...they may deserve some modicum of recognition, even if it is just a simple aknowledgement of our name being the same as theirs.
    Yes! I think that the people who left Europe had compelling reasons to leave. Most people are unwilling to leave a comfortable, familiar life for one of many hardships and unknowns and never seeing one's family again. One of our Indian friends who came here as a doctor once commented that he things that all immigrants must be a little crazy. Perhaps that's true! I think certainly it does take a certain kind of person to be willing to leave everything for a long shot chance. In looking back through my family's history, there was either nothing left in the old country for them economically, or they were escaping danger or famine, or they were pursuing religious freedom. This made the potential risk worth it to them. I believe that the forces that compelled them to come here also impacted the kind of lives they led and what was important to them. This in turn has shaped me significantly.

    For this reason, I am interested in knowing more about them and how they lived, not so much so that I can proudly claim a particular ethnicity, but so that I can better understand what hass gone into the decisions and choices I have made. In two strands of the family from opposite areas of the world, they followed religious scheisters half way around the globe. While it was a wild goose chase, in both cases, it saved them and their offspring from death, war or famine that they could not have foreseen. I'm interested in knowing what factors made them follow someone who turned out later to be so imbalanced, what those who shared that experience have in common, and what the implications are for how I should conduct my own spiritual life. I also find it interesting to see how even the "mistakes" we all make can sometimes turn out to be the saving of us. It's also interesting to see what kind of response both strands had to the disillusionment or embarrassment that would have ensued after breaking away from those groups as far as far as the role religion played in their lives and those of their children.

    In Western Canada, our ancestors often came here within living memory, only 2 or 3 generations previous. Therefore, "what we are" is more relevant because we may still practice the religion, cultural traditions, and/or speech patterns etc of those who came before us, even if we are not directly from that country. Depending on where people settled, some have remained within a thriving subculture of these people's descendants or they are still genetically very recognizable as part of a particular group.

  8. #88
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    No Eastern European people over here? Are you kidding?

    As someone else has said, the States has a large number of Russians, Ukranians, and Poles. When I lived in Wisconsin, mony people I met were of Polish descent.

    In Western Canada there are Doukhabours (Russian), Mennonites (from Russia and Ukraine), Ukranians, and Poles a-plenty. In addition, recent years have brought over a large number of Bosnians, Serbs, Croads, Yugoslavians, Czechs etc. Every school and many of the food places/factories in my town have people from Eastern Europe there who are recent immigrants.
    Yeah we have a ton of Eastern Europeans in Newport Beach. Everywhere you go people are speaking in one of their foreign languages.

  9. #89
    Starcrossed Seafarer Aquarelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquarelle99 View Post
    Not as many as Western European, certainly, but there are a fair amount of people of Eastern European descent. I know lots of people of Russian, Ukrainian and Polish descent. Their ancestors tend to be more recent immigrants, like I said. You might find this interesting - I did!:

    Self-Identified Ancestry from 2000 Census

    Actually 7.2% of the population identified their ancestry as simply "American" (listed separately than Native American). But the largest ancestral groups are German, Irish, African, and English. Closely followed by Mexican and Italian (all above 5%).

    Albanian and Serbian are pretty low on the list, but Yugoslavian is higher.
    Okay, I just realized the 2000 census is over 10 years old. Is it a sign of getting old that I still think of the year 2000 as "not that long ago"?

    Anyway, here's a more up-to-date count (although in a different format):

    Ancestry Data from 2008 US Census
    Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting.

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  10. #90
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adasta View Post
    From an advertising point of view, it's largely European.
    I suppose if all you know about the US is through TV & Hollywood movies, then sure.

    A bit of a knee-jerk reaction. Is it correct to call a desire to be from another culture a cultural phenomenon?
    But that's NOT what it is. It's just a mere recognition of one's personal history & what influence it has had on your family & local culture.

    No-one's doubting that. The point could maybe be expressed with a big brother/little brother analogy. I mean, Americans that latch on to the identity of their ancestors resemble a younger brother who mimics his older brother. They're both distinct and should have their own identities; it seems weird for one to mimic or replicate the other.
    Who is mimicking or replicating? Identifying your heritage & noting a few small similarities between those of similar heritage is a far cry from what you're implying. I think you're the on blowing it out of proportion.

    Europeans don't "look down" on Americans for doing this - it just seems a bit weird to be so enamoured by it.
    Frankly, the tone of your posts imply that a strongly condescending attitude.

    Sometimes I feel like I'm trampling over some sort of inferiority complex when I talk to Americans about this issue, but I don't mean to do that - I don't want to get anyone's back up. It's not a competition: we all have ancestors. It's the way in which that is "celebrated" that causes curiosity, hence the title of this thread.
    It feels the same in reverse; the need to criticize cultural quirks of Americans seems to stem from some insecurity...
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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