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  1. #101
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    I'm curious - how can you be sure that you are correct that these people are sociopaths and not people you just have a natural antipathy for? Not suggesting you haven't I'm just wondering how you can be sure and thus be certain of the accuracy of your gut reaction. The reason I ask is - is it possible that some people develop an ability to spot these types of personalities as an evolutionary adaptation? It seems reasonable that in a primitive situation where cooperation was essential and life was balanced on a knife edge in the best of times having a sociopath in the primary group could be a serious problem.

    I'm very intrigued about your talent. If you are inclined I'd be curious to hear more about it.
    my hypothesis is just the opposite. many scientists claim that grief for the dead, caring deeply for others and feelings of guilt and shame evolved throughout the evolution of homo sapiens sapiens. it's possible that most of the psychopaths would have died out because they lacked group cooperation skills and would have likely been cast out of the tribe or killed by the emerging non psychopath humans. this would have lead to non psychopath humans having strength in numbers and thus evolutionary advantage. however, in recent years, the independence, ambition and intelligence of psychopaths have allowed them to advance very far in society. this would not have been possible 10,000 years ago
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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  2. #102
    Senior Member jimrckhnd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    my hypothesis is just the opposite. many scientists claim that grief for the dead, caring deeply for others and feelings of guilt and shame evolved throughout the evolution of homo sapiens sapiens. it's possible that most of the psychopaths would have died out because they lacked group cooperation skills and would have likely been cast out of the tribe or killed by the emerging non psychopath humans. this would have lead to non psychopath humans having strength in numbers and thus evolutionary advantage. however, in recent years, the independence, ambition and intelligence of psychopaths have allowed them to advance very far in society. this would not have been possible 10,000 years ago
    Interesting idea. But... the implication is that these early humanoids/humans had the ability to detect these individuals. How and why? And why drive them out or kill them? Unless of course they are a liability as I speculate they would be. Or this could be just one of those quirks that show up from time to time in species. I suspect, however, that being able to "read" members of the group was an essential skill and individuals who had the ability to spot anti-social personalities would have an evolutionary advantage – what that advantage was I’m not sure.

    It might be as simple as surviving longer and thus increasing their chances of reproducing because their primary groups were stronger. Then again maybe this trait gave them capabilities that gave them better access to mates if they were male or better access to higher quality mates if female.
    Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups

  3. #103
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    Interesting idea. But... the implication is that these early humanoids/humans had the ability to detect these individuals. How and why? And why drive them out or kill them? Unless of course they are a liability as I speculate they would be. Or this could be just one of those quirks that show up from time to time in species. I suspect, however, that being able to "read" members of the group was an essential skill and individuals who had the ability to spot anti-social personalities would have an evolutionary advantage – what that advantage was I’m not sure.

    It might be as simple as surviving longer and thus increasing their chances of reproducing because their primary groups were stronger. Then again maybe this trait gave them capabilities that gave them better access to mates if they were male or better access to higher quality mates if female.
    - primitive peoples relied more on body language and voice inflection because language wasn't developed yet, so they would be able to tell things like that more intuitively than people nowadays for the same reason that blind people have better hearing or deaf people pick up on visual ques better (with the exception of living people who have extensively studied it)
    - a psychopath would be a serious detriment to a tribe of on psychopaths. psychopaths are only able to sustain a relationship with a group like a parasite. thus, they would have immense difficulty in a tribal setting
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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    my hypothesis is just the opposite. many scientists claim that grief for the dead, caring deeply for others and feelings of guilt and shame evolved throughout the evolution of homo sapiens sapiens. it's possible that most of the psychopaths would have died out because they lacked group cooperation skills and would have likely been cast out of the tribe or killed by the emerging non psychopath humans. this would have lead to non psychopath humans having strength in numbers and thus evolutionary advantage. however, in recent years, the independence, ambition and intelligence of psychopaths have allowed them to advance very far in society. this would not have been possible 10,000 years ago

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    - primitive peoples relied more on body language and voice inflection because language wasn't developed yet, so they would be able to tell things like that more intuitively than people nowadays for the same reason that blind people have better hearing or deaf people pick up on visual ques better (with the exception of living people who have extensively studied it)
    - a psychopath would be a serious detriment to a tribe of on psychopaths. psychopaths are only able to sustain a relationship with a group like a parasite. thus, they would have immense difficulty in a tribal setting
    This is a VERY interesting theory and makes a lot of sense. Maybe this is why there are so few INTJs. (I'M JOKING!! HA HA!!...there are even less INFJs are they're known for their empathy...)

  5. #105
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    This is a VERY interesting theory and makes a lot of sense. Maybe this is why there are so few INTJs. (I'M JOKING!! HA HA!!...there are even less INFJs are they're known for their empathy...)
    my best friend is an abused INTJ 8w7 Sp/Sx so he looks pretty damn sociopathic sometimes, but I think he's mentally healthy. recently he's tapped into his Fi a great deal and is thinking "damn, you were right, being internally congruent and having strong convictions feels good!" healthy use of Fi is really a great remedy for psychological trauma that causes internal incongruencies.

    Edit: glad you liked it. all those documentaries on hominid evolution I've been watching are paying off
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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  6. #106
    Senior Member Tiger Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    This is a VERY interesting theory and makes a lot of sense. Maybe this is why there are so few INTJs. (I'M JOKING!! HA HA!!...there are even less INFJs are they're known for their empathy...)
    Maybe I should change my x to N to help bolster their numbers.
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  7. #107
    Senior Member Tiger Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    Prisons aren't as populated with sociopaths as one might think. The majority of people hounded by the justice system are those who were pushed to the brink or dumbasses. If sociopaths occupy a higher plain of intelligence and lack affect, then they can endure the forces that would compel most to break the law and calculate the consequences of their actions in ways tailored to their self-preservation. Even Hannibal Lector was useful and cunning in the grander scheme of things.
    I could have been more clear. I was referencing supermax prisons and prisons for the criminally insane.
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  8. #108
    Senior Member Tiger Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    I'm curious - how can you be sure that you are correct that these people are sociopaths and not people you just have a natural antipathy for? Not suggesting you haven't I'm just wondering how you can be sure and thus be certain of the accuracy of your gut reaction. The reason I ask is - is it possible that some people develop an ability to spot these types of personalities as an evolutionary adaptation? It seems reasonable that in a primitive situation where cooperation was essential and life was balanced on a knife edge in the best of times having a sociopath in the primary group could be a serious problem.

    I'm very intrigued about your talent. If you are inclined I'd be curious to hear more about it.
    I would be happy to answer questions, if you read this article it will explain a good bit about me. I am a slow typist and honest when answering questions. Less forthcoming in my prose.

    http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm
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  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    I always assume that most psychopaths end up in upper management positions. It explains alot and it has the advantage of keeping me on my toes around them.
    I looked up "psychopath/sociopath/ASD" a few weeks back and the information seems to point in that direction because those individuals will bulldoze others to get out ahead and the "superficial charm" seems to be a good asset for making good first impressions. Scary... I make it a policy not to get close to others who are overly charming. hah

  10. #110
    Aquaria mrcockburn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    i'm pretty sure i know a sociopath. my best guess typing him would be estp 8w7. he's a crack dealer/pimp and seriously the most selfish person i've ever met. hanging out with him is like watching a trainwreck. one time i was in the car with him and his girlfriend, he was fucked up and hit a parked car and completely smashed the passenger side window. his girlfriend had glass all over her and was lucky she didnt get seriously hurt, but he ended up making her get out of the car and clean it up for him. he also used to show up at my house early in the morning and decide to make that his home base for the day, just stayed there coming in and out for over 12 hours one time. cooked crack in my apartment in my pot without asking. idk i get some sick fascination out of him because of how little he cares about other people's feelings/what people think of him. he gets social security for his back problems (which he exaggerates a lot) and when i hear him on the phone with the government people i'm amazed at how he gets all sweet and turns the charm on and calls people ma'am.

    i've met a large portion of his family though and they are all fucking insane in their own special way. his dad's the worst of all.
    holy shit. I'd keep him the fuck out your house if I were you. If cops do raid the place, they're going to get YOU for it - they're not going to care or investigate who actually had the oven mitts on - not that it's easy to prove, anyway. They'll just know that it was on YOUR stove.

    That's probably exactly why he's doing it at your house in the first place.
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