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  1. #31
    heart on fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I suppose I unloaded like that because at the time, a lot of things had been building up inside of me and I had no way for it to be released. What was shocking was that the professor and I had very little direct contact (about 35-40 people in the class) and he was the last person on earth I expected to say what he said to me. I was either being obvious or the professor somehow knew that I wasn't doing to well. He didn't bring it up again, but I felt that if I needed to talk he would be open to me. Knowing that I had someone available to just talk if I needed to do so was very comforting and it made somethings more tolerable.
    I am glad you had that experience and that it was beneficial to you.

  2. #32
    More human than human MetalWounds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by heart View Post
    If you were serious about killing yourself and feared that anyone who knew it would try and stop you, would this still work? When you were past the point of wanting to be stopped? If you felt that there was no hope left and that you were just marking time until the moment was right or you had the guts to carry out your plans?

    A person serious about suicide is in a very dark and desperate place where it seems no one can be trusted without putting a wrench in the plan and so it seems a very delicate situation to navigate. However, I am not ENFJ so maybe ENFJ would think differently, I am not sure.
    I agree, someone with this attitude toward suicide is the most dangerous. Very few people will ever see the symptoms manifest themselves because the individual is intentionally hiding them. The bigger issue here would be the fact that someone with this mentality is very more than likely planning to take the most lethal means possible toward attaining their ultimate goal.
    It doesn't sound like this is the point in which your friend is at, so it's more of a plea for you to help her. If she's truly an E then she can gain a lot of faith in life from your true support and concern.
    I'm doing science and I'm still alive

  3. #33
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wandering View Post
    Here are my totally unprofessional comments, as someone who went through a deep and long depression herself, and who is married to a bipolar ENFJ.

    Quite frankly, it's not so much the whole list of behaviours that bothers me. I see them as symptoms of the real problem: cure the problems, and the symptoms will disappear on their own, or most of them anyway....
    Exactly.

  4. #34
    Mamma said knock you out Mempy's Avatar
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    I agree with you, Wandering, that there are probably underlying problems causing her destructive behavior. She told a friend of ours a few months ago that she'd been raped by her first boyfriend in her freshman year of high school. That may be a big part of the problem.

    Someone mentioned to me through pm that her Fe may be getting out of control; in other words, she's trying to please everyone. I see this is possible, but I'm not sure how I can help her see that pleasing everyone isn't imperative without perhaps appealing to my Fi and Ne for the right things to say. If you could elaborate on why Fi and Ne are so toxic to unhappy ENFJs, Wandering, I would appreciate it.

    Santtu, what you said about changing your life really seemed important to me. I can't quote it, because for some reason I can't figure out how to copy and paste on this junk computer, but you said that part of what made something exhilarating for you was the unconscious hope that the experience would change your life for the better. I think this is true. It ties into depression because to the depressed person, every day will bring more of the same bleakness. There is no hope or exhilaration, only a subsistence of the torture they had today, and yesterday, and the day before that. The fewer reasons for living a person has (e.g., responsibility to family, children to rear, moral objections to suicide) the closer that person will come to throwing it all away.

    Depression and pessimism also seem to bring with them a lot of self-fulfilling prophecies. Believing that something will happen may influence someone's actions, either through fear or logical confusion, enough so that their actions ultimately bring about their false prophecy. So on top of already feeling like crap, the proof that you are incapable, helpless and worthless tends to stack up over time, creating a mountain of negative experiences that you must then get over, as if the depressed feelings themselves weren't enough without proof.

    For my ENFJ friend, I want to try to show more interest and support for her. We have little contact as of now. We haven't spoken since last weekend, and before that we hadn't spoken for close to five or six weeks. I want to be more available to her, keep in contact with her more.

    The reason for this thread, I want to make clear, is that it just recently occurred to me how susceptible she may be to suicide. I hadn't realized it until the night before last, when I heard about Heath Ledger dying from overdosage, and it made me realize how tenuous life is. I also realized, given that she'd been going through an unhappy time, that I truly had no clue how near or far from suicide she was. I realize now that all that was probably necessary for me to do was to get off my bum and see how she was doing, first of all. Then the reasonable thing to do would be to contact professionals if she did seem to be close to suicide. So, in a way, this thread was not what I intended it to be. On the other hand, it has proven more insightful than I first thought, especially into depression and perhaps the underlying reasons for her depression in particular.

    As for you, Prote. I don't appreciate that kind of uninformed, biased opinion. But thank you for the redirection to a drug addictions page. You'll be glad to know that I take a drugs and behaviors class and that I knew most of that already.

    I skimmed your religious questions, Wandering, but first I'm going to respond to something else. She told me she worked long hours because she had no choice. She cited monetary reasons, and they didn't seem reason enough for me. "Can't you get enough money from your parents and family to feed and clothe yourself?" "No," was her response. I felt terrible for how she perceived her situation, but I couldn't say for sure if her perceptions were wrong. I told her that I thought she could get by on taking out loans for most of her needs, but that was just a fly-by suggestion. Working seems absolutely imperative to her, judging by how much she still works.

    Since you mention that she probably beats herself down, I see clear evidence of this, and I also think this is one of her biggest enemies. She definitely uses a lot of "shoulds," and it's obvious she's not kind or gentle with herself. "I should be thin, I should be responsible, I should support myself money-wise," are just a few of the things she probably says. I think "shoulds" are everyone's enemy, when we feel we're worthless without meeting them.

    So now, back your questions about religion. I don't think she has time for religious activities, just to be frank. I just don't think she's involved at all; I'd be surprised if she could whittle some time out of her schedule for religious activities. It also probably doesn't help that she doesn't see her immediate family very often, as they recently moved about an hour and a half away.

    Once again, thank you for all your input and responses, everyone!
    They're running just like you
    For you, and I, wooo
    So people, people, need some good ol' love

  5. #35
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mempy View Post
    I agree with you, Wandering, that there are probably underlying problems causing her destructive behavior. She told a friend of ours a few months ago that she'd been raped by her first boyfriend in her freshman year of high school. That may be a big part of the problem.

    ...
    This has everything to do with her problem. It's time for her to face the pain and deal with it.

  6. #36
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    My ENFJ is really pain-avoidant, and can't stand the sight of his own blood. Is your friend like that, too?

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