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Inattentiveness

Ghost of the dead horse

filling some space
Joined
Sep 7, 2007
Messages
3,553
MBTI Type
ENTJ
I've had fair time to observe my IxTP (n?) wife now, and I think it's safe to say her behavior falls on this category.

I'd like to know what functional cognition theory and personality theory has to offer on this subject. I've tried to understand it on the basis of personality; I've said to myself - these Ti people don't follow what's going around them - their brain and what's happening in there is their own universe.

Most of anything outside, it seems to me, is just for amusement. Most of all, I've said to myself - they want to follow their own pace. It seems that anything normally judged as urgent is just another thing to them, something that has equal intellectual value with ageless theorems and the end of the universe. In other words, catching a bus and contemplating the meaning of life take equal importance.

Whom am I kidding? Pondering the meaning of life, surfing in the net and missing the bus takes greater precedence.

So, I'll just want to know what's there, and why she (or any other INTP for that matter) can be so unable to respond to urgent situations when they arise. I know that she's content with losing almost - if not completely - all the situational opportunities if she's able to perform everything at a leisurely pace. I see Ne there, so I suspect INTP.

So, INTP and inattentive.

What's your take on it?

in·at·ten·tive
adj.
Exhibiting a lack of attention; not attentive.
not paying attention; heedless; negligent

Synonyms: absent, absentminded, apathetic, blind, bored, careless, distracted, distrait, distraught, diverted, dreamy, faraway, heedless, inadvertent, indifferent, inobservant, listless, lost*, musing, neglectful, oblivious, off-guard, out to lunch, preoccupied, rapt, regardless, remiss, removed, scatterbrained, thoughtless, unconscious, undiscerning, unheeding, unmindful, unnoticing, unobservant, unobserving, unperceiving, unthinking, unwatchful, vague

Antonyms: attentive, heedful, looking, noticing, observant
* = informal/non-formal usage
 

wildcat

New member
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
3,622
MBTI Type
INTP
I've had fair time to observe my IxTP (n?) wife now, and I think it's safe to say her behavior falls on this category.

I'd like to know what functional cognition theory and personality theory has to offer on this subject. I've tried to understand it on the basis of personality; I've said to myself - these Ti people don't follow what's going around them - their brain and what's happening in there is their own universe.

Most of anything outside, it seems to me, is just for amusement. Most of all, I've said to myself - they want to follow their own pace. It seems that anything normally judged as urgent is just another thing to them, something that has equal intellectual value with ageless theorems and the end of the universe. In other words, catching a bus and contemplating the meaning of life take equal importance.

Whom am I kidding? Pondering the meaning of life, surfing in the net and missing the bus takes greater precedence.

So, I'll just want to know what's there, and why she (or any other INTP for that matter) can be so unable to respond to urgent situations when they arise. I know that she's content with losing almost - if not completely - all the situational opportunities if she's able to perform everything at a leisurely pace. I see Ne there, so I suspect INTP.

So, INTP and inattentive.

What's your take on it?

in·at·ten·tive
adj.
Exhibiting a lack of attention; not attentive.
not paying attention; heedless; negligent

Synonyms: absent, absentminded, apathetic, blind, bored, careless, distracted, distrait, distraught, diverted, dreamy, faraway, heedless, inadvertent, indifferent, inobservant, listless, lost*, musing, neglectful, oblivious, off-guard, out to lunch, preoccupied, rapt, regardless, remiss, removed, scatterbrained, thoughtless, unconscious, undiscerning, unheeding, unmindful, unnoticing, unobservant, unobserving, unperceiving, unthinking, unwatchful, vague

Antonyms: attentive, heedful, looking, noticing, observant
* = informal/non-formal usage
After reading your synonym list I understand attentiveness was a thing highly valued in Hitler's Germany.
 

Little Linguist

Striving for balance
Joined
Jun 23, 2008
Messages
6,880
MBTI Type
xNFP
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
YAY now that we've made foolish comparisons between attentiveness and Hitler's Germany (WTF?), I'd like to make a serious answer.

Although I cannot speak about INTPs, I can speak about my own experience. I'm grossly inattentive. Just today, my IXTP husband, who is highly observant btw, pointed something out to me. And I simply had not noticed either the previous way it was nor the current change.

This kind of thing happens on a daily basis.

Therefore, I am really wondering if it is truly a Ti thing. I think there may be some other factor involved.
 

wildcat

New member
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
3,622
MBTI Type
INTP
YAY now that we've made foolish comparisons between attentiveness and Hitler's Germany (WTF?), I'd like to make a serious answer.

Although I cannot speak about INTPs, I can speak about my own experience. I'm grossly inattentive. Just today, my IXTP husband, who is highly observant btw, pointed something out to me. And I simply had not noticed either the previous way it was nor the current change.

This kind of thing happens on a daily basis.

Therefore, I am really wondering if it is truly a Ti thing. I think there may be some other factor involved.
Attentiveness was the major feature in Hitler's Germany. It was not a foolish comparison. :)
 

Ghost of the dead horse

filling some space
Joined
Sep 7, 2007
Messages
3,553
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Well, my search on the phrase "inattentiveness" revealed the name of a well-establish disorder, although however well-established, doesn't count as a real thing in my book. Should it?
 

Tallulah

Emerging
Joined
Feb 19, 2008
Messages
6,009
MBTI Type
INTP
We're capable of understanding urgency, when it's truly urgent. Like, "if you don't turn in this paper to your teacher by 5pm today, she will not accept it, and you may fail the class." But a lot of times people say things are urgent, or act like they're urgent, when they're really not, in our eyes. It's simply not worth getting worked up over doing things by a certain time a lot of times. So you miss the bus. Another one comes along in 10 minutes. So you miss an exit ramp? You can just get off on the next exit and be there two minutes later. It's not the end of the world. So you didn't wash the dishes right after dinner? They will still be there after we watch the movie. Etc. It's a matter of not letting things rile you up when they're not that important.
 

ragashree

Reason vs Being
Joined
Nov 3, 2008
Messages
1,770
MBTI Type
Mine
Enneagram
1w9
I'd like to know what functional cognition theory and personality theory has to offer on this subject. I've tried to understand it on the basis of personality; I've said to myself - these Ti people don't follow what's going around them - their brain and what's happening in there is their own universe.
Short descriptor for these characteristics: Introversion. I'm not sure the Ti categorisation, correct or otherwise, is desparately relevant at this stage. Introverts are more aware of what is going on inside themselves than what is going on in the world outside by definition; it's part and parcel of who they are and why the categories of introversion and extraversion exist. When people have functional preferences strongly geared towards one dimension of introversion/extraversion (as opposed to skills, which can be learned by most individuals), it is extremely difficult for them to focus on the other dimension of experiencing for any length of time, and tends to drain their energy. Perhaps spending time alone and self-reflecting on ideas without external stimulation is just as difficult and draining for you as noticing external matters and attending to them in the same way as you do is for her.

Is either preference definitively "better", or just a reflection of the person's unique personal attributes, that defines who they are and what they have to contribute to their existence?

Most of anything outside, it seems to me, is just for amusement. Most of all, I've said to myself - they want to follow their own pace. It seems that anything normally judged as urgent is just another thing to them, something that has equal intellectual value with ageless theorems and the end of the universe. In other words, catching a bus and contemplating the meaning of life take equal importance.
Whose definition of "normal" are we going by? Should your own preferred one take precedence? If so, why?

Whom am I kidding? Pondering the meaning of life, surfing in the net and missing the bus takes greater precedence.
Your grammar is now fixed. :nono:

Now, can you figure out why I just responded as I did? Not perhaps the easiest of connections to make, I grant you, but there is a reason directly and expressly relevant to the topic.

So, I'll just want to know what's there, and why she (or any other INTP for that matter) can be so unable to respond to urgent situations when they arise.
Whose definition of "urgent" are you going by, yours or hers? If your personal definitions are at variance, you're misunderstanding the situation. If she's unable to respond in an appropriate manner to something she herself classifies as urgent, then there may indeed be an issue. If, however, it's simply the case that you consider something to be of utmost importance and she doesn't, as is rather strongly implied here, I would instead ask you why it's so important to you that she attunes her own beliefs to yours? You are both different people with different skills and priorities: perhaps you also have something different to offer one another.

I know that she's content with losing almost - if not completely - all the situational opportunities if she's able to perform everything at a leisurely pace.
What is a "situational opportunity", as defined by yourself, that it should be as important to anyone else as it appears to be to you? (This is something of a challenge to shift from your familiar and comfortable perspective.)

After reading your synonym list I understand attentiveness was a thing highly valued in Hitler's Germany.

YAY now that we've made foolish comparisons between attentiveness and Hitler's Germany (WTF?), I'd like to make a serious answer.
Nothing foolish about it really: I agree with Wildcat on this. It's characteristic of totalitarian and authoritarian society that standards of behaviour are not allowed to develop from the exercise of individual conscience and judgment, but are imposed on the individual by an external authority, reinforced by social proscription and the fear of punishment. One is necessarily highly attentive to these externally imposed values in order to ensure that one is either fully compliant or that one's own non-compliance goes unobserved, in order to avert negative consequences to the self. Wildcat was probably just using an extreme and familiar example to make his point.

Therefore, I am really wondering if it is truly a Ti thing. I think there may be some other factor involved.
As I said earlier, it's probably mostly to do with introversion. ;)

Well, my search on the phrase "inattentiveness" revealed the name of a well-establish disorder, although however well-established, doesn't count as a real thing in my book. Should it?
Depends. Do you feel an urgent need to fit your wife into a pathological category; or are you prepared to accept the way she is, where that may differ from your own personal or idealised qualities, as part of her natural personality? Both are equally viable options; which one you choose to take is in the end a measure of the heirarchy of values you choose to adopt.
 

Haphazard

Don't Judge Me!
Joined
Apr 14, 2008
Messages
6,704
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Sugar is unhealthy.

Is sugar unhealthy? Or is it sugar in mass quantities that's unhealthy? Because, I mean, I'm pretty sure there are worse things in your food. You know, like mercury.
 

Ghost of the dead horse

filling some space
Joined
Sep 7, 2007
Messages
3,553
MBTI Type
ENTJ
Oh, what's wrong with inattentiveness? I guess your main claim for the virtues of the trait lie in the presumption that an inattentive person is doing "something else" of value. I'm saying it generally isn't so.

The kind of inattentiveness I'm writing of gives person bad school performance, makes them appear lazy in the eyes of an employer, makes them seem unresponsive in the presence of a company, etc. Now that's their choice to do them, and it's everyone else's choice to deal with it as they please.

I'm in for daydreaming, silent thinking and all that, but this kind of thing is just less, not more. Of course, it's OK for anyone to settle for less, and inattentive people do just that. The problem comes if there's a mutual project that requires roughly equal share of the activity for all the people. The solution is then not to include the inattentive person in the activity. This is also fine.

Now my wife is pondering if she's eating well. Perhaps she's tired because of not meeting the daily nutritional requirements. The thing is, it's not just me telling her what to do or some crap you'd expect of ENTJ. She's missing out from a lot of things because of her inability to keep up. She compensates by going into situations that don't require her to be fast. That's fine as well, I just can't figure out why a person would cripple themselves that much voluntarily.

Okay, I can figure out some relative merits of inattentiveness. The relative independence from outside events gives a person some calmness. Not everyone is of the type who's the first to react to sudden events, nor do they have to. I don't think my wife's traits are worthless or anything like that. What I'm saying is that rewards from the "outside world" are commensurate with the investment made, and inattentive people don't invest much.
 

Giggly

No moss growing on me
Joined
Jun 12, 2008
Messages
9,661
MBTI Type
iSFj
Enneagram
2
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Yeah I'd say that this is a problem to do with introversion vs. extroversion primarily.
 

wildcat

New member
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
3,622
MBTI Type
INTP
Is sugar unhealthy? Or is it sugar in mass quantities that's unhealthy? Because, I mean, I'm pretty sure there are worse things in your food. You know, like mercury.
The bakers do not put mercury in your bread. :)
 
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