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View Poll Results: When I see jealousy in my partner, it is generally a...

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  • xNTP: positive thing/something I can appreciate/like when displayed/sign of commitment

    4 14.29%
  • xNTP: negative thing/something I don't appreciate/dislike when displayed/sign of problems

    7 25.00%
  • xNTJ: positive thing...

    0 0%
  • xNTJ: negative thing...

    1 3.57%
  • xNFP: positive thing...

    2 7.14%
  • xNFP: negative thing...

    4 14.29%
  • xNFJ: positive thing...

    4 14.29%
  • xNFJ: negative thing...

    3 10.71%
  • xSTP: positive thing...

    0 0%
  • xSTP: negative thing...

    2 7.14%
  • xSFP: positive thing...

    0 0%
  • xSFP: negative thing...

    0 0%
  • xSTJ: positive thing...

    0 0%
  • xSTJ: negative thing...

    0 0%
  • xSFJ: positive thing...

    1 3.57%
  • xSFJ: negative thing...

    0 0%
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Results 141 to 150 of 253

  1. #141
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Presumably there are differing amounts of jealousy, I don't know what the right amount is per se, but my opinion is that you have to have jealousy over your partner doing certain things with other people, or you relationship with that person is completely unworthy of note, akin to my relationship to my mail deliverer.
    Or you just fully trust that person not to do those things with other people.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  2. #142
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    I also think that by saying "if you would ever feel sadness at being betrayed by your significant other, and/or would consider ending the relationship over said betrayal, then you have jealousy," you've so widely defined jealousy that it becomes a meaningless catch-all term for all possible negative feelings about a romantic relationship.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  3. #143
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Had more to say than I thought at first:

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Presumably there are differing amounts of jealousy, I don't know what the right amount is per se, but my opinion is that you have to have jealousy over your partner doing certain things with other people, or you relationship with that person is completely unworthy of note, akin to my relationship to my mail deliverer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Or you just fully trust that person not to do those things with other people.
    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Jealousy is anger over something that you think should be yours going to someone else. If you can have no jealousy, your relationship must be a blank contract.
    Your if-then statements seem a little rigid to me. There's another option here, which is that having no jealousy is a sign of having fully abandoned yourself to a relationship, and chose to fully trust your partner not to fuck you over, which is an extremely passionate place to be. If you do that and then are later betrayed and decide to end the relationship, what you feel is not jealousy, it's grief- which is why what MLF said about jealousy being a form of premature grief was so profound to me. Feeling that grief prematurely, perhaps in an effort to keep yourself from being surprised by it later, is what jealousy is.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  4. #144
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    No. Jealousy and love are incompatible.
    If I love you and you never give me any cause for jealousy, it would be inappropriate for me to feel jealous. Unloving, in fact. That doesn't imply that I'm blase about how you choose to conduct yourself. It means that I trust you implicitly in the absence of any reason not to.
    There is no universal definition of what is an isn't an appropriate cause for jealousy. Which is where the next part comes in.

    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan Le Fay View Post
    If I love you and you give me reasonable cause for jealousy, that would be unloving on your part. I have to then decide whether you are invested enough in the relationship for me to want to maintain it, or if I might have been misled as to your character. Being jealous is not a solution - it contributes nothing.
    Maybe I didn't know it's something you would consider cause for jealousy.

    The thing to do here would then be to communicate what your expectations are, and from the other person can try to determine if they can live by those expectations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Or you just fully trust that person not to do those things with other people.
    And if you misplaced your trust?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I also think that by saying "if you would ever feel sadness at being betrayed by your significant other, and/or would consider ending the relationship over said betrayal, then you have jealousy," you've so widely defined jealousy that it becomes a meaningless catch-all term for all possible negative feelings about a romantic relationship.
    Hardly. I didn't actually use the word betrayal, which might be important. There are lots of ways to be hurt by a significant other that don't involve them providing to others what you think should be yours.
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  5. #145
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    I'm really proud of these people who say that if their significant other did something to make them jealous they wouldn't be worth their love. So tough. So rigid. So convinced their love for that person wouldn't continue. So logical about love.

    /sarcasm

    It's not that easy for me to change my feelings. I can't just shut down like that. It's unrealistic to say that I would. I'd like to. But no.

  6. #146
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    And if you misplaced your trust?
    Well, that would blow, and maybe you would either grieve the end of the relationship then or feel some temporary hurt if the breach of trust isn't great enough to end the relationship over and can be repaired. But if that never happens, then you never have to grieve or feel the hurt. I disagree that the capacity for being hurt by a relationship is tantamount to present jealousy. I think this whole line of reasoning is a big red herring actually.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Hardly. I didn't actually use the word betrayal, which might be important. There are lots of ways to be hurt by a significant other that don't involve them providing to others what you think should be yours.
    I don't really see how changing "betrayal" to "hurt" in my post changes the meaning of it at all. Is every hurt feeling in a relationship jealousy? I don't think it is.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  7. #147
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Your if-then statements seem a little rigid to me. There's another option here, which is that having no jealousy is a sign of having fully abandoned yourself to a relationship, and chose to fully trust your partner not to fuck you over, which is an extremely passionate place to be. If you do that and then are later betrayed and decide to end the relationship, what you feel is not jealousy, it's grief- which is why what MLF said about jealousy being a form of premature grief was so profound to me. Feeling that grief prematurely, perhaps in an effort to keep yourself from being surprised by it later, is what jealousy is.
    I don't see why it couldn't be both. Certainly some people seem to spend years nashing over the relationship they once had, and I do see jealousy in that, not just grief. And that's for those who end the relationship, to say nothing of the people that keep going even after their has been infidelity.

    I suppose technically someone coud have no jealousy if they were only capable of wanting another person equally or less than the amount they perceived the other person to want them, but I am skeptically curious about the existence of such a person.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  8. #148
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Well, that would blow, and maybe you would either grieve the end of the relationship then or feel some temporary hurt if the breach of trust isn't great enough to end the relationship over and can be repaired. But if that never happens, then you never have to grieve or feel the hurt. I disagree that the capacity for being hurt by a relationship is tantamount to present jealousy. I think this whole line of reasoning is a big red herring actually.
    Makes sense to me, or else I am not protective of my home as I have not actually experienced anyone committing arson upon it yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I don't really see how changing "betrayal" to "hurt" in my post changes the meaning of it at all. Is every hurt feeling in a relationship jealousy? I don't think it is.
    No. The answer is no because I'm not relying soley on the word hurt. There was a string of words after the word hurt that were important.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  9. #149
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    hmmm... interesting thread

    there's a difference between being proud that you're with someone and lacking trust in them enough that you want to control their every action out of an irrational fear that they'll cheat on you... the first is necissary for a healthy relationship in my opinion, the later is a sign of an UNhealthy relationship

    in other words, caring is sexy, continual unfounded suspicions and controlling behavior is heinous

    not showing that you care to be with someone isn't healthy either... for this reason

    “The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference. The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference. The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference. And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference.” ~Elie Wiesel
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  10. #150
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Makes sense to me, or else I am not protective of my home as I have not actually experienced anyone committing arson upon it yet.
    Subjunctive mood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The seed thought of the thread was YLJ's dealbreaker, "someone who doesn't get jealous." He didn't say "someone who wouldn't get jealous," which would apply if what you've been saying about hypothetical jealousy was at all relevant. I'd be frothing at the mouth if my partner cheated on me. Pretty sure he would be if I did that to him, too. Who wouldn't? Do you honestly think anyone would be all "*shrug* oh well!" about it?

    But I picked him and stay with him in large part because I'm about as sure as I can be that he won't do that, so getting jealous would be like borrowing trouble. It's also disintegrative to the relationship to be jealous when he hasn't done anything wrong.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

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