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  1. #1
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Our Little Wars Here

    Wars are very important because in wars we forget ourselves and reveal our true selves.

    All that is needed is to call an armistice and analyse, evaluate and critique what has been revealed.

    Wars are similar to the imagination in that in both we forget ourselves for a while and allow our true selves to come out to play.

    And so wars and the imagination are only half the story without analysis, evaluation and critique.
    Last edited by Mole; 04-27-2010 at 03:06 PM.

  2. #2
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Wars allow you to blow shit up. Wooo!
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  3. #3
    Probably Most Brilliant Craft's Avatar
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    What if we don't have "true selves" nor "selves, what if we are impassive?

  4. #4
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Is this really our true self? I would suggest instead that in a time of war, we would merge into some sort of social, nameless, faceless aggregate and be much more likely to follow the herd?

    I would assume that in a society under stress-ie resource limitation-standing alone as an individual is not a good idea-thus we would abandon ourselves more fully?

  5. #5

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    I've had wars on my mind for the last week. Might have been ANZAC day and all. It's seemed like a real idea this week rather than a distant concept which I'll never face.

    I think I understood why it matters so much that we remember them. I always thought it was all about respect for those who fought, and honouring those who served the country when we needed them. But we attach the line "Lest we forget" to the end of the ode of remembrance. That line changes a tribute into a lesson or a warning. It isn't "please don't forget", or "we'll never forget them", or anything cheesy like that. It sums up the impending Armageddon we'll face when we forget. As the veterans die off and we no longer have the marches, as the history becomes a smaller and less relevant part of the school curriculum, as we escape any understanding of the true horror they faced and any feeling of the gravity or seriousness of the situation, we set ourselves up to repeat it. The problem is that it is inevitable. War/peace is a cycle, like summer/winter or growth/recession. To have one too long sets the world in a state where it eventually chooses the other.
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  6. #6
    Reason vs Being ragashree's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noigmn View Post
    It sums up the impending Armageddon we'll face when we forget. As the veterans die off and we no longer have the marches, as the history becomes a smaller and less relevant part of the school curriculum, as we escape any understanding of the true horror they faced and any feeling of the gravity or seriousness of the situation, we set ourselves up to repeat it. The problem is that it is inevitable. War/peace is a cycle, like summer/winter or growth/recession. To have one too long sets the world in a state where it eventually chooses the other.
    Unfortunately this appears all too true. We're going through it now with the reprisal of the Vietnam situation in the Middle East, the lessons learned apparantly having only been kept in remembrance as long as it took a generation who hadn't actually experienced the horror and futility for themselves (aka, Dubya and his cronies) to take over the reins of power.

    I do find it particularly ironic that wars throughout the course of human history have inevitably been rationalised in the name of Peace by those with something to gain from them - and that the majority of those with little to gain and much to lose (ie their lives, comforts, and liberty) are ever-willing to accept this argument without noticing its inherent absurdity. If the current state is peace, and that is something inherently desirable, what is to be gained from upsetting it with war? At best an eventual resumption of the present situation, after much has been lost and rebuilt, until it is time for the next war. Peace is a desire that can never be truly fulfilled, unless, perhaps, that fulfilment begins deep within each individual self.
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  7. #7
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orobas View Post
    Is this really our true self? I would suggest instead that in a time of war, we would merge into some sort of social, nameless, faceless aggregate and be much more likely to follow the herd?

    I would assume that in a society under stress-ie resource limitation-standing alone as an individual is not a good idea-thus we would abandon ourselves more fully?
    I was referring to the war in the Astrology thread - our little war.

  8. #8
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noigmn View Post
    I've had wars on my mind for the last week. Might have been ANZAC day and all. It's seemed like a real idea this week rather than a distant concept which I'll never face.

    I think I understood why it matters so much that we remember them. I always thought it was all about respect for those who fought, and honouring those who served the country when we needed them. But we attach the line "Lest we forget" to the end of the ode of remembrance. That line changes a tribute into a lesson or a warning. It isn't "please don't forget", or "we'll never forget them", or anything cheesy like that. It sums up the impending Armageddon we'll face when we forget. As the veterans die off and we no longer have the marches, as the history becomes a smaller and less relevant part of the school curriculum, as we escape any understanding of the true horror they faced and any feeling of the gravity or seriousness of the situation, we set ourselves up to repeat it. The problem is that it is inevitable. War/peace is a cycle, like summer/winter or growth/recession. To have one too long sets the world in a state where it eventually chooses the other.
    ANZAC is a legend and it is our legend. And our legends tell us an awful lot about ourselves because we choose them to define ourselves.

    We thought and even hoped in the 70s that the ANZAC legend would disappear, but it has been taken up by the younger generation, and so plainly it speaks to all of us.

    What we need to do is find out what it says.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craft View Post
    What if we don't have "true selves" nor "selves, what if we are impassive?
    Well it is true that the individual self is a product of literacy, and that the new electronic media are creating a new tribal self.

    So if you are impassive perhaps you are responding to the electronic media.

  10. #10
    Writing... Tamske's Avatar
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    I don't believe in a "true self". People act out all sorts of roles in different situations and are a compound of all these actions. War is just one of these situations.
    Why would the "self" during wartime be more "true" than the "self" during peace-time?
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