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View Poll Results: Do you believe in astrology?

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  • Yes

    33 18.13%
  • No

    142 78.02%
  • I have no idea what it is? So I'm not sure.

    7 3.85%
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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    What is this STD nonsense about?
    It's about Victor grasping for any lifeline he can to try and get out of the quicksand he's put himself in...

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    The attraction of Esalen was sex in a puritanical society.

    The attraction of Esalen was certainly not the intellect. And the proof of the pudding is in the eating, for Esalen produced no works of the intellect.

    However Esalen did specialise in producing sexually transmitted diseases.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    So you've read everything by every author/thinker who's ever spent time studying at Esalen, and deemed them to be "not works of the intellect"?

    Have you read either one of these books?

    Passion of the Western Mind

    Cosmos and Psyche
    How bout all of these people, Victor.

    You read all of their works and ready to put them in the "non-intellectual" category:

    Past teachers
    Ansel Adams
    Joan Baez
    James Baraz
    Robert Bly
    Gregory Bateson
    Ray Bradbury
    Joseph Campbell
    Fritjof Capra
    Carlos Castaneda
    Deepak Chopra
    Harvey Cox
    Erik Davis
    Warren Farrell
    Moshe Feldenkrais
    Richard Feynman
    Matthew Fox
    Fred Frith
    Buckminster Fuller
    Spalding Gray
    Stanislav Grof
    Michael Harner
    Andrew Harvey
    John Heider
    Paul Horn
    Al Chung-liang Huang
    James Hillman
    Albert Hofmann
    Aldous Huxley
    Sam Keen
    Ken Kesey
    Paul Krassner
    R. D. Laing
    George Leonard
    Dennis Lewis
    John C. Lilly
    C. Allen Lockwood
    Amory Lovins
    Abraham Maslow
    Peter Matthiessen
    Rollo May
    Terence McKenna
    Robert Nadeau
    Claudio Naranjo
    Sara Nelson
    Babatunde Olatunji
    Dean Ornish
    Humphry Osmond
    Linus Pauling
    Fritz Perls
    J. B. Rhine
    Carl Rogers
    Ida Rolf
    Gabrielle Roth
    Jerry Rubin
    Douglas Rushkoff
    Virginia Satir
    Will Schutz
    Daniel Sheehan
    B.F. Skinner
    Huston Smith
    Gary Snyder
    Susan Sontag
    Paul Tillich
    Arnold J. Toynbee
    Alan Watts
    Robert Anton Wilson
    Andrew Weil
    Marion Woodman

    Scholars in Residence
    Esalen has sponsored long-term residencies including
    Gregory Bateson
    Joseph Campbell
    Stanislav Grof
    Sam Keen
    George Leonard
    John C. Lilly
    Babatunde Olatunji
    Fritz Perls
    Ida Pauline Rolf
    Virginia Satir
    William Schutz
    Brother David Steindl-Rast
    Alan Watts
    and others who have lived and worked at Esalen as part of this program.

  3. #53
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    It's about Victor grasping for any lifeline he can to try and get out of the quicksand he's put himself in...
    I'll send him some protection.



  4. #54
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Wait...

    Who's the Libra ENFP?
    Me. I was born/nurtured an ENFP, but then I got accustomed to the Sith side of things.

    As with all things, you should engage it with a critical mind, never allowing yourself to be duped, always taking it for what it's worth, but also being open to any truth that might actually be contained in it.
    That's me default modus operandi, but thanks for the advice. Still, my questions were more than just a Ne rant, so if you have any answers to them I'd welcome some insight.

  5. #55
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    The Fighting Spirit

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Oh, you also share onemoretime's characteristic of bringing up completely irrelevant "counterarguments" to arguments that have absolutely decimated your positions...?

    How interesting...
    C'mon you're like Monty Python's Black Knight.

    When I cut off one arm, you tell me you are only beginning to fight.

    And when I cut off the other arm, you tell me you are just warming up.

    And when I cut of one leg, you tell me you will decimate me.

    And when I cut off the other leg, you tell me it's completely irrelevant.

    What a fighting spirit!

  6. #56
    Boring old fossil Night's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Needless to say, I opened up a bit more to astrology after this experience.
    Z, this is all anecdote. There's no falsifiable basis for anything you've offered here.

    So two consecutive retail clerks guessed your astrological sign. So, what? It doesn't necessarily follow that their presumption was anything more than simple, dumb luck.

    Let's examine the data:

    Clearly, you were in the store to purchase some form of clothing; ergo, you have specific aesthetic taste. So, her statement confirming that fact is a no-brainer.

    Plus, it sounds like you had a bit of conversation beforehand, as your provided detail was exceedingly specific:

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    When I'd originally bought the jeans, I was helped by a tall, very attractive, sandy blond Lebanese girl who'd grown up in Switzerland. I was trying on some jeans in the dressing room, and she and I were talking, when all of a sudden she says to me, "You're a Libra."
    Perhaps you casually mentioned something that tipped her off, in terms of your birth date? Perhaps it was autumn when you were in the store. Did the topic of seasons come into play at all? Maybe she was attracted to you and was attempting to animate details of your life to perpetuate conversation?

    Plus, didn't you say they both worked at the same store? Maybe it's some weird fad they shared. Or, maybe the first girl discussed you with the latter.

    What you've offered sounds a lot like confirmation bias. Or, cold reading. I wouldn't put much stock into astrology based on this experience. Plus, like any worthwhile clinical metric, shouldn't you repeatedly expose yourself to similar variables under approximate conditions to verify hypothesis?

    At best, it sounds like your sample set is incomplete.


    It might interest you to know that I'm a Sagittarius and have very particular aesthetic values myself.

  7. #57
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    left-overs

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    How bout all of these people, Victor.
    These are all avatars of the New Age. And the New Age ended with the advent of AIDS.

    Of course we still have our left-overs, for MBTI and astrology are left-overs from the New Age.

    Some of course like left-overs, but I feed left-overs to the dog.

  8. #58
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Tarnas' Introduction to Archetypal Astrology

    I was curious as to how he'd explain the causal mechanism. His explanation avoids the assertion that cosmic alignment causes a direct impact on human nature, but that it's more accurate to say that cosmic alignment represents the current archetypal forces present in the universe [or local region, I suppose] at the time.

    I find it very New Age-y and lacking in scientific rigor. Not really into these kinds of things. But, to each his own.



  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by JocktheMotie View Post
    Tarnas' Introduction to Archetypal Astrology

    I was curious as to the causal mechanism. His explanation avoids the assertion that cosmic alignment causes a direct impact on human nature, but that it's more accurate to say that cosmic alignment represents the current archetypal forces present in the universe [or local region, I suppose] at the time.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    C'mon you're like Monty Python's Black Knight.

    When I cut off one arm, you tell me you are only beginning to fight.

    And when I cut off the other arm, you tell me you are just warming up.

    And when I cut of one leg, you tell me you will decimate me.

    And when I cut off the other leg, you tell me it's completely irrelevant.

    What a fighting spirit!


    Sure thing, Victor.

    Keep telling yourself that.

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