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  1. #11
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Actually if you want to, the happy types going by socionics theory would be ENTx, INFx, ISTx, and ESFx, and ISFx, INTx, ESTx and ENFx the unhappy ones.
    Ha!!

    I can actually see both points. I think there probably ARE some generalizations that could be made - because I do think there are certain mbti types that seem overall to be very bouncy and not much phases them - but I also think there's something to be said about ANY type overcoming their issues. Basically, I think ANY type CAN be happy...I just personally feel that some types have a much harder time finding that (I'd say INFx in my experience ;-), and yeah, several others too), or it waxes and wanes for some types more than others.

    And each type is going to have its unique 'battles' I think....for example my reasons for unhappiness would be quite different from an ENTJ's reasons. Etc. Or an ISTP may have no idea why certain things trigger my unhappiness. And vice versa. That kind of thing. (just pulling those two examples out of a hat...it's the same across the board)
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  2. #12
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    Pt I think you're just excusing your own unhappiness.
    You would be incorrect for two reasons;

    1) I am not referring to my own happiness, nor am I particularily unhappy. My strong introversion would denote only a lack of happiness, I am not particularily neurotic, which would be more indicative of my unhappiness.

    2) I am merely reporting research done.

    It's no more logical to say that Fi getting its way... or any introverted function that's allowed to run its course would be any less happy.
    I didn't want to push it onto a function. I was merely deducing the logical equivalent.

    What about an SP who gets all the candy she wants? Even an introverted one.
    Or an ISFJ who gets married and has kids and gets to perpetuate all the things her mother did?
    Temporary; eventually results in a regression to mean.


    (Disclaimer: I don't support the functional view that one is "happier", as I said in my OP. I only answered the logical extension of happiness being a fundamental aspect of Extraversion.)

  3. #13
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    2) I am merely reporting research done.
    Why?

    And what research? I've never heard anything about that. Post the link, or name of a book or wherever you got it from. I wanna see this.


    I didn't want to push it onto a function. I was merely deducing the logical equivalent.
    Merely... so humble...


    Temporary; eventually results in a regression to mean.
    Happiness is always temporary...


    (Disclaimer: I don't support the functional view that one is "happier", as I said in my OP. I only answered the logical extension of happiness being a fundamental aspect of Extraversion.)
    ... and apparently you know that. No type is inherently happier than the next. In the first place, hapiness is too broad a term (especially if it's used to describe someone's entire demeanor), and functions are even more broad. One can't be used interchangeably with the other, which is what the OP is asking about.
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  4. #14
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Happiness Comes Cheap -- Even For Millionaires

    Makes me think Se is the happy function.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  5. #15
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I think what Santuu was asking if there's a cognitive function related to happiness. Pt is saying (and all the research I've seen) says that Extroversion, the ability to feel and express positive emotions is linked with happiness. The extroversion that pt is referring to isn't the MBTI/Jung definition of extroversion. But if extroversion is linked to happiness I'd think that types with a dominant extroverted function would be the happiest.

    You all can debate what happiness is.

    Extraversion and happiness from articles
    Last edited by proteanmix; 12-06-2007 at 01:43 PM. Reason: added link
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  6. #16
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy
    Why?
    Why...? I'm quite satisfied because I have a good job, a good mate, a stable life, security... Very few negative external concerns, optimising what happyness I can have.

    And positive and negative emotions are probably biologically seperated, which is generally measured in extraversion (degree, length and ease of reaction of positive emotions) and neuroticism (degree, length and ease of reaction of negative emotions). Both correlate strongly to happiness - satisfaction in jobs, relationships, sports, failure... both short term and long term.

    ... and apparently you know that. No type is inherently happier than the next.
    No, this I don't agree with. The research clearly shows that some types are happier than others (if, by type, you subscribe to cognitive wiring leading to behavioural tendencies - happiness is cognitively wired). Within Jungian type, it's hard to claim that any one function is responsible because insufficient research has been done, and of course, no one can actually find a way to see what functions you use. Almost any way of measuring personality (MBTI, DiSC or behavioural measures like FFM) shows the same thing.

    In the first place, hapiness is too broad a term (especially if it's used to describe someone's entire demeanor), and functions are even more broad. One can't be used interchangeably with the other, which is what the OP is asking about.
    I'm sure it doesn't fit every definition of happiness, but the scope is pretty broad. It's generally considered impossible to make oneself "happier" than we are wired, although it is easy to make us consistently unhappier than we could be. General happiness is pretty hardwired.

    But interchangeably? No, although I'm not sure that's what was being asked.
    Depends if you use Jungian definitions from 60 years ago or more modern views on them though.

    (This thread might help as well - http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...version-4.html )

  7. #17
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I think what Santuu was asking if there's a cognitive function related to happiness. Pt is saying (and all the research I've seen) says that Extroversion, the ability to feel and express positive emotions is linked with happiness. The extroversion that pt is referring to isn't the MBTI/Jung definition of extroversion. But if extroversion is linked to happiness I'd think that types with a dominant extroverted function would be the happiest.
    Yup, although I'll add that the different versions of E all tend to express the general "positive emotions" approach. How well it correlates together... well, that the rub. However, using MBTI shows the same "happy" correlation as most personality tests, in terms of E/I. (But not N vs openness so much which wasn't strong to start with.)

    Course, this gets down to definitions - if you define x, then ask if a person is like x, and then they tend to also be y... can you say that x and y are related? I believe so. It doesn't have to be part of the definition (to extend this, the logical definition of any function would be brain structure and so forth, thus Jungian definitions are really the "y" in the above).

  8. #18
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Happiness Comes Cheap -- Even For Millionaires

    Makes me think Se is the happy function.
    This is strongly tied to my answer: aerobic exercise. Cycling in the woods during the spring, summer or autumn; then, after a steep climb, resting on the grass, either under the sun, or under the spray rain typical of autumn and spring early afternoon. Those were the moments that made me feel the best in my life; this is also why I never understood how people were able to feel pleasure out of getting an high grade, for which they had to give up a lot of this flavor of free time. The answer was that they simply never experienced such pleasurable things, so in comparison for them the grade felt very good, whereas I'd compare it to how I felt under the sun, over the grass, with the conclusion that it wasn't worth a damn. It's always cliché to cite surfers as paramount example of how to be happy without much, yet it might not be far from the truth. The best 3 months of my life have been those I spent as a lifeguard at the beach.

  9. #19
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Well, I would agree with regards to myself - I'm extremely happy when I'm out DOING things and just being in tune with my senses - being active (hiking, climbing, walking), playing games, painting and creating things.... But I'd hate to project what makes me happy onto everyone else!

    I also think there's a deeper level of fulfillment/peace with life *as a whole* though - I guess that's more what I was thinking of and attempting to get at in my post; not just 'moments' of happiness. And for myself, being non-stop Se would soon become unfulfilling, and even the Se could become routine. :-)
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  10. #20
    filling some space UnitOfPopulation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mempy View Post
    I don't think any function makes you happier. I can see why people might think F is happier than T, because Fs tend to be warmer and that looks like happiness, but warmth and happiness aren't equivalent.
    --
    I think we all have our problems, and I think the best solution to problems is probably thinking highly of yourself, and thinking of things from several different angles.
    --
    Now if we're talking about personality traits like confidence, self-esteem, open-mindedness, etc, that's a difference story. Those things can be correlated to happiness.
    Good point with the T/F, tho I don't yet consider the issue decided.

    I do think that the examples you gave are more important to happiness. Moreover, they are something anyone can do.. but then type theory, people of any type can use other functions too. Even if happiness was function-related, it would be within anyone's grasp.
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Aerobic exercise.
    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    Cycling in the woods during the spring, summer or autumn; then, after a steep climb, resting on the grass, either under the sun, or under the spray rain typical of autumn and spring early afternoon. Those were the moments that made me feel the best in my life;
    My top moment in life was having a 70km mountain bycycling trip with my dad on the island of Kos in the mediterranean. These kind and other kind of sensations consitute a big part of my happy moments right now, too

    Quote Originally Posted by Nocapszy View Post
    What about an SP who gets all the candy she wants? Even an introverted one.

    Or an ISFJ who gets married and has kids and gets to perpetuate all the things her mother did?

    --
    I hope this thread is a joke that I didn't pick up on the humor of.
    This seems to relate to the situational and individual points raised by other forum members. I agree that getting what you have desired is good for happiness. As pt pointed out, the happiness does seem to regress towards mean some time after the event.

    I simplified for effect, and you got it right. It was for humor.

    Edit: the simplicity was for humor, the message was real. Usually I explain my questions more so as to establish their serious nature. Lately I've tried to make shorter comments so as to cater to the short attention span community within our board.

    Still, there are serious responses to be made, and have been made. That's great!

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Temporary; eventually results in a regression to mean.
    Happiness Quotient: After becoming Paraplegic or Quadriplegic - by Ian Boyne
    "Lottery winners and the accident victims experienced a sudden change in fortune, yet they both adapted to their circumstances, finding themselves surprisingly close to where they had begun in terms of happiness. It was a startling discovery for it seemed to prove that happiness is relative, marked only by changes from the recent past."
    Quote Originally Posted by cascademn View Post
    Basically, I think ANY type CAN be happy...I just personally feel that some types have a much harder time finding that (I'd say INFx in my experience ;-), and yeah, several others too), or it waxes and wanes for some types more than others.

    And each type is going to have its unique 'battles' I think....for example my reasons for unhappiness would be quite different from an ENTJ's reasons. Etc.
    That's what I think too. Some are more bothered about injustice and harsh competition, to say a few.

    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Happiness Comes Cheap -- Even For Millionaires

    Makes me think Se is the happy function.
    That's a good article, it made me happy Thank you. I did enjoy my trance music, chicken and beer more when I thought about it, and made me think about everything I did this day that promoted happiness.. even though I didn't have time to consider it at the moment. This may seem somewhat unlike me to say, so I'll clarify that I meant what I said.

    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I think what Santuu was asking if there's a cognitive function related to happiness.Extraversion and happiness from articles
    That's a good source. I found this great article from there - it describes some results, that even introverted people experienced more happiness at the times of extroversion. Happiness, as reported by the participants, was improved also in those cases where the participants were ASKED to be more extroverted.
    Acting extraverted spurs positive feelings, study finds
    Last edited by UnitOfPopulation; 12-07-2007 at 08:09 PM.

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