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  1. #1
    in-game Gamine's Avatar
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    Default Value of "Flow" (Csikszentmihalyi)

    Good evening!

    I stumbled on something and wanted your opinions!

    "...The first needs are the basic needs; biological needs such as food, shelter, etc. that we need in order to stay alive. Once these needs have been fulfilled, we need to meet our safety needs. Notice that safety does not have to do with danger; safety needs are actual feelings of comfort, knowing that we are in control of our actions and so on. The next level consists of psychological needs. First is the belonging need, or having a role in any ingroup. The second psychological need is esteem. Esteem, in addition to belonging, requires that your role in the ingroup is a positive one, and that people like and respect you.

    Sometimes referred to as the highest level, self-actualization is when you have satisfied all of these other requirements and bring them all together to figure out who you are, knowing that you have strong beliefs, values, morals, and confidence. Finally, there is the peak experience. This is similar to Csiksentmihalyi's idea of flow (discussed in the following section). When you have a peak experience, everything is in place and all of your focus is on one enjoyable activity. A good example of this is an artist who gets caught up in painting something. (While Maslow considers the highest level of fulfillment, Frued would call it sublimation, a defense mechanism.) For more information on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, see M. Dowling's Electronic passport to Abraham Maslow.

    Csikszentmihalyi - the Flow experience
    Flow is the experience of focusing all of one's energies on a specific activity. During flow, nothing else matters, not the passage of time, not physical state. A commonly used example is chess masters in a day-long tournament, in which they concentrate on the game. At the end of the day, the players realize that several hours have passed, they're sore, and they need to go to the bathroom, but none of those things were noticeable while they were playing (Csikszentmihalyi 1999)." From HERE!

    What do you think people? Is "Flow" the highest form of existance? This same type of experience is found in many different fields of study as being somehow pure and maybe even spiritual.

    Go go go!

    (Waits impatiently)
    "Beware Those Who Are ALWAYS READING BOOKS" - Bukowski

  2. #2
    in-game Gamine's Avatar
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    Default My Ne is going insane right now



    Makes me think of



    joining together to make



    !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    "Beware Those Who Are ALWAYS READING BOOKS" - Bukowski

  3. #3
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Flow is the hallmark of the creative experience. In flow, time ceases to exist. Flow is like non-interrupted pleasure.

    There is a sense in which you fall into flow in the same way you fall in love. But most desperately want to maintain control of themselves and others, so they dare not let go and fall into flow.

    They dare not let go and fall into the river of flow because they fear they might drown. So the first thing is to learn how to swim into and out of flow at will.

    I learnt how to get into and out of flow by attending a class by a sports' psychologist, Mr Turnbull. He warned us of the traps for young players, and taught us how to safely get into and out of flow. And to boot he even gave us some useful things to do in flow.

    We found it very easy to be fond of Mr Turnbull as he seemed to be in flow most of the time. Yet he was always modest and helpful.

    And of course once you have learnt to get in and out of flow safely yourself, there is nothing nicer than sharing flow with someone else who can do the same.
    Likes elodia liked this post

  4. #4
    in-game Gamine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Flow is the hallmark of the creative experience. In flow, time ceases to exist. Flow is like non-interrupted pleasure.

    There is a sense in which you fall into flow in the same way you fall in love. But most desperately want to maintain control of themselves and others, so they dare not let go and fall into flow.

    They dare not let go and fall into the river of flow because they fear they might drown. So the first thing is to learn how to swim into and out of flow at will.

    I learnt how to get into and out of flow by attending a class by a sports' psychologist, Mr Turnbull. He warned us of the traps for young players, and taught us how to safely get into and out of flow. And to boot he even gave us some useful things to do in flow.

    We found it very easy to be fond of Mr Turnbull as he seemed to be in flow most of the time. Yet he was always modest and helpful.

    And of course once you have learnt to get in and out of flow safely yourself, there is nothing nicer than sharing flow with someone else who can do the same.
    What have you learned about it?

    Learning performance, different teachers of mine described presence in the same way. Where you both cease to exist, and exist wholly. Where you are disconnected, but completely connected.
    "Beware Those Who Are ALWAYS READING BOOKS" - Bukowski

  5. #5
    Senor Membrane
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    Hey! You just found me some new reading! I've found out about Maslow quite recently and have been looking for his "followers". Csikszentmihalyi obviously is a huge fan of Maslows. He has too damn hard name though...

    Yeah, umm, I've had some experiences with the flow. It's mostly connected to painting in my case. I usually have more or less clear idea of what I'm going to do, I might plan it quite a lot, and I might execute it with precision, but sometimes I get into the flow. It's like changing perspective of what I am doing. It takes away the plan and focuses on the idea without a structure.

    I've had similar feelings when I am watching something organic. Like nature or a big mass of people. And recently I've been able to get it through a sort of a meditation.

    By the way, Freud is full of shit! :steam:

    Yeah, but he is! Now, come on! This is definitely not a sick state of mind.

  6. #6
    in-game Gamine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Hey! You just found me some new reading! I've found out about Maslow quite recently and have been looking for his "followers". Csikszentmihalyi obviously is a huge fan of Maslows. He has too damn hard name though...

    Yeah, umm, I've had some experiences with the flow. It's mostly connected to painting in my case. I usually have more or less clear idea of what I'm going to do, I might plan it quite a lot, and I might execute it with precision, but sometimes I get into the flow. It's like changing perspective of what I am doing. It takes away the plan and focuses on the idea without a structure.

    I've had similar feelings when I am watching something organic. Like nature or a big mass of people. And recently I've been able to get it through a sort of a meditation.

    By the way, Freud is full of shit! :steam:

    Yeah, but he is! Now, come on! This is definitely not a sick state of mind.

    Just thinking about Freud makes me a bit nauseated. I'm with you on that one for certain!

    Yay new reading! Is this something people can control like Victor suggested, something that happens external to us, maybe something that is always there but we are usually too busy to notice it? What is it?

    "Beware Those Who Are ALWAYS READING BOOKS" - Bukowski

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by nolla View Post
    Hey! You just found me some new reading! I've found out about Maslow quite recently and have been looking for his "followers". Csikszentmihalyi obviously is a huge fan of Maslows. He has too damn hard name though...
    It isn't too hard. It is pronounced "Chick sent me high"


    Quote Originally Posted by Gamine View Post

    What do you think people? Is "Flow" the highest form of existence? This same type of experience is found in many different fields of study as being somehow pure and maybe even spiritual.
    It does seem to have some similarity to the kind of experience that is talked about in Zen. But in flow you invariably must fall out of flow at times. I don't think of it as mystical or spiritual. There are specific steps to reaching flow in any experience if you want to.

  8. #8
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    There's a book called, Right Brain Learning in 60 days or it's 30 days, can't remember. It's short. It discusses how to induce a flow experience using music.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    It happens for me with music and with doing interior design. Occasionally with art, but I don't do much art, so that has been rare. Sometimes with high speed highway driving. I used to love transcribing tapes at work, because that would always do it, although it would take an hour or so before I fell into the groove. Also, believe it or not, typing handwritten patent applications while listening to Radiohead full blast on earphones.

  10. #10
    Senor Membrane
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamine View Post
    Just thinking about Freud makes me a bit nauseated. I'm with you on that one for certain!
    Yeah, the way I see Freud, he's the kid in the Sixth Sense: "I see sick people..", I mean why do they need to drag Freud everywhere... he did invent psychology, yeah, good for him, but he also wants to see sickness everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamine View Post
    Yay new reading! Is this something people can control like Victor suggested, something that happens external to us, maybe something that is always there but we are usually too busy to notice it? What is it?
    I guess you could set it up. Then when it comes you need to let it do it's stuff. I know I don't always trust it. It seems like a risk after I've painted for three hours and know that I could easily mess up and need to start from the beginning. But it is often much more creative than I can be...

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfy View Post
    It isn't too hard. It is pronounced "Chick sent me high"


    Quote Originally Posted by wolfy View Post
    It does seem to have some similarity to the kind of experience that is talked about in Zen. But in flow you invariably must fall out of flow at times. I don't think of it as mystical or spiritual. There are specific steps to reaching flow in any experience if you want to.
    Maybe the focus is what is different. You are not actually doing anything when having a satori experience, right? So, maybe the flow is kind of a satori, but more attainable for regular people since it is easier to lose yourself while doing something.

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