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  1. #21
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    I totally fail the Fe test!!

    I have no Fe, thus no sense of shame and will talk quite openly about things others will not-if someone asks or expresses an interest.

    I fail the "how was your weekend/" question quite often. "mediocre", " it sucked", "beautiful with waves of happiness" when "great, how was yours" is the correct answer.

    I have to very specifically monitor the context of the information. Once I relax, just a bit, I am prone to being massively open.

    These ones I will totally discuss if asked:
    Your financial/socioeconomic status?
    Your religious beliefs?
    Your political beliefs?
    Substance (ab)use?

    These ones if I know them and they inquire:
    Your sex life?
    Messy personal relationships?
    Quality of significant relationships?
    Illnesses (psychological and physical)

    Hysterically me and the ISTJs all talk about our sex lives together. Also the ISTJs totally dig therapy and will tell you explicitly how many times they have been.

    (On a side note, it turns out most people I work with are visiting two local therapists. My company is quite well known in local psychiatric circles. I wasnt always this emo-nutty)

    The one thing I will NOT talk about:
    How I feel emotionally about something. Hurt feelings/love feelings. Even writing emo/Fi posts here leaves me really anxious and sort of emotionally torn up and overwhelmed.

    Dont ask me what I feel.

  2. #22
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I hear people saying that they don't know about the other person's comfort level with talking self-disclosure, but I'm still wondering what would prompt you all to think that a person is self-disclosing too much. Do you feel like the other person is talking about themselves too much or putting you in an uncomfortable position with what they're discussing?

    If someone discloses something rather personal fairly quickly how do you react? For example, I was talking to a coworker around Thanksgiving about what she was doing. She told me that they usually go to her aunt's house but recently her mother and her aunt had a falling out. She then described to me the circumstances of the fall out and I thought to myself hmmm, I'm surprised she's telling me this.

    Now when I've seen people disclose casually it tends to be rather smallish (<5), an intimate atmosphere (like a dinner party with low lighting and ambient music), a little bit of alcohol consumption (although people aren't drunk...mostly wine), and it tends to happen later on in the night after people have eaten and settled a bit. I find all types of things start flying out. I guess my experience is that people do tend to start talking about things that matter to them and content of conversations tend to go more personal. And I have had one person tell me they had an abortion under these exact circumstances among other things that I considered personal. I then found myself saying more personal things as well.

    Reactions in these situations are interesting because the mood can be broken rather quickly and feel like a dunk in frigid water. Something as simple as shoulder's stiffening can sour the mood and make people feel silly and self-conscious. I understand what people are saying that it's just a hunch or intangible feeling that you can go there with the person, but you are working from clues that you've honed in on even if you can't identify or articulate them. For me, I've written about throwing little meaningful chunks out and seeing who bits or how receptive and responsive people are to others who have thrown their own chunks out. But it's a fine line because it can just as easily come across as being nosy and intrusive.

    I guess I'm talking about atmospheres like this...talking about TV, movies, and music seems unnecessarily stiff like suspended animation. And I'm with Usehername and Ivy on this. It's really difficult to be the one to stick your neck out there and say something that will break the ice because you risk feeling foolish and being the one who said too much.
    Relationships have normal ebbs and flows. They do not automatically get better and better when the participants learn more and more about each other. Instead, the participants have to work through the tensions of the relationship (the dialectic) while they learn and group themselves and a parties in a relationships. At times the relationships is very open and sharing. Other time, one or both parties to the relationship need their space, or have other concerns, and the relationship is less open. The theory posits that these cycles occur throughout the life of the relationship as the persons try to balance their needs for privacy and open relationship.
    Interpersonal Communication Theories and Concepts
    Social Penetration Theory 1
    Social Penetration Theory 2
    Social Penetration Theory 3

  3. #23
    heart on fire
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    In a place like work, my past and present relationship status, my health, my political beliefs, my religious beliefs, all of this are no one's business and I usually don't discuss these things. I've had problems in office type situations where other women felt deeply slighted because I didn't want to talk about these issues.

    Time is not a factor, emotional intimacy is.

    It doesn't bother me when other people self-disclose. People will tell me everything, even complete strangers in a department store or something like that. I am used to it.

  4. #24
    Senior Member proximo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I hear people saying that they don't know about the other person's comfort level with talking self-disclosure, but I'm still wondering what would prompt you all to think that a person is self-disclosing too much. Do you feel like the other person is talking about themselves too much or putting you in an uncomfortable position with what they're discussing?
    Sometimes, yes... though it's more to do with what they seem to be asking of me. Not help or support or anything like that, because I'm usually happy to give that when I can to anyone.

    It's when a person is constantly telling me things, big things about their past or their life, just always talking about things like how difficult their life has been, bad experiences they've been through... if I get an impression that they're trying to either explain in advance any bad behaviour they might show, or gain sympathy or otherwise impress me... they might come across like they're trying too hard or something.

    It makes me feel uncomfortable because it feels to me like they're sort of forcing me to be their friend, their confidante. And until I know that person better, I don't know if I want to be in such a position, because I don't know what their expectations are, what else they'll ask of me. And also, there might be an expectation that I self-disclose to them, and I don't know what they'll want me to disclose or how they'll react if I decide I don't want to.
    I'm male and over 30, FYI.
    Preferences: 20% Extravert, 98% Intuitive, 68% Thinker, 17% Perceiving

  5. #25
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Honestly, I don't really care what people disclose to me at all, as long as it's not going to affect anything within myself. (For example: If I'm mutual friends with a boyfriend/girlfriend.. I Don't want them coming up to me to talk trash about the other. I don't like it when people talk trash about people I like to me.. ESPECIALLY if they know I like them.)

    I still won't stop people from saying what they have to say. Just know freedom of speech isn't the same as freedom of speech without consequence with me.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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  6. #26
    Senior Member proximo's Avatar
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    It's happened before, where someone's confided loads of personal stuff in my in only a very short time of knowing me.

    It had the effect that this person saw me as a close friend, and became very attached to me because I knew all this stuff about them. The reality was that I saw them as a bit of a "problem", you know - "what am I going to do about X? how can I reduce the amount I see them without without hurting their feelings?"

    It was all about how much they wanted me (or anyone really) to understand them, little awareness that that's the kinda thing that has to go two ways. It's something I've often found in lonely people, those who have very few or no other friends and bad/dysfunctional family relationships. They pour their hearts out to the first person who'll listen, and then come the strings.

    They expected loyalty and confidence from me, and a lot of contact with me that was just impossible for me to give at that stage even if I had wanted to. And they also expected me to share in return stuff about myself on a similar level to what they'd told me. When it didn't come, they said I'd "betrayed" them, that I'd led them on and let them believe I was their friend when I really didn't care and didn't really trust them.

    So... I've had variations on that theme quite a few times now, so I'm very wary of people who over-disclose.
    I'm male and over 30, FYI.
    Preferences: 20% Extravert, 98% Intuitive, 68% Thinker, 17% Perceiving

  7. #27
    Lungs & Lips Locked Unkindloving's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I hear people saying that they don't know about the other person's comfort level with talking self-disclosure, but I'm still wondering what would prompt you all to think that a person is self-disclosing too much. Do you feel like the other person is talking about themselves too much or putting you in an uncomfortable position with what they're discussing?
    I would imagine that people who don't disclose certain things will be made uncomfortable when other people disclose such things. I rarely feel anyone is self-disclosing too much and tend to embrace when people do as it's not a very common thing.
    A lot of people have this blockade in communication, they feel like it is a game and they have to have all of the wording down before starting in or else they'll lose. You don't. It's not necessary. I've learned that, when i'm hesitating too much, i need to throw every note and over-analyzing thought to the wind and just speak.
    There is an easy way to acknowledge how it is to stick your neck out with something and it's by saying "I'm probably going to feel foolish about this, but..." or "I'm not exactly comfortable putting this out there, but...". That makes me respect any words that leave the person's mouth following it that much more.
    Hang on traveling woman - Don't sacrifice your plan
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  8. #28
    Emerging Tallulah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lauren Ashley View Post
    The above = private. I think my criterion for what is private/personal is anything that has an emotional impact on me and all of the above would fall under that. Also, my emotional life, innermost thoughts, personal reactions to events, would fall under "private." Under very rare circumstances will I discuss those openly. I'm open to discussing issues that I am furthered removed from, such as news, current events, others' lives, movies, TV, etc. I don't actually do a whole lot of talking, except to those I am comfortable with discussing the above topics with.

    All of the above is true for me. I'm a very private person, though I don't have a lot of skeletons or anything. I have just never been one to spill my guts to the world. I don't mind people telling ME stuff. That's their choice. But if they're telling me a bunch of personal stuff thinking that will make me reciprocate, they'll probably be disappointed.

    Quote Originally Posted by LaurenAshley
    Not so much time, but the significance of the relationship. Time can increase the importance of the relationship, but not always. Some I have known for years I still do not and will not share private information, and sometimes a person I've known for only a few months I find myself sharing my personal life with.
    Yeah, that, too. It's just the chemistry/relationship with that particular person. Sometimes it's a trust issue, sometimes it's not. Sometimes it's just because the right occasion has come up. Sometimes it's because I think sharing my experience will help the other person.
    Something Witty

  9. #29
    Glycerine
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Messy personal relationships?
    Quality of significant relationships?
    Illnesses (psychological and physical)
    Your sex life?
    Your financial/socioeconomic status?
    Your religious beliefs?
    Your political beliefs?
    Substance (ab)use?
    All of the above + family info, my personal accomplishments/failures, and my innermost thoughts. However, if I like you and get a good vibe from you, I will disclose certain aspects to build rapport. I have always hated when teachers force you to write anything personal...invasion of privacy.

    If you were to talk to me irl, I would talk mostly about random ideas, serious issues impersonally, and/or stuff related to the realm where we start conversing. I can talk to someone for several hours w/o them getting much personal info about me.

  10. #30
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    Reactions in these situations are interesting because the mood can be broken rather quickly and feel like a dunk in frigid water. Something as simple as shoulder's stiffening can sour the mood and make people feel silly and self-conscious. I understand what people are saying that it's just a hunch or intangible feeling that you can go there with the person, but you are working from clues that you've honed in on even if you can't identify or articulate them. For me, I've written about throwing little meaningful chunks out and seeing who bits or how receptive and responsive people are to others who have thrown their own chunks out. But it's a fine line because it can just as easily come across as being nosy and intrusive.
    To drag this topic up to a weird level...

    In the last two months I have developed a new trick-seeing Fe masks. You look at the other person and you notice if they are wearing an Fe mask or not. It's in the eyes, the face, the smile. There is a tenseness there.

    I realized I have always used that as a screening tool when I select people to interact with. I called it "snobby or prudish or standoffish", but in reality I just knew I would not mesh with them. I didnt know why.

    ENFPs are the best Fe mask breakers ever. We can find tert Fe folks, say utterly crazy shit, then break them out of the Fe facade of politeness and make them giggle. Especially the ENTPs. My ENTPs seek this out IRL.

    So I will be very open with those who dont wear Fe masks, but I will choose not to interact with those who do and disclose nothing as a result.

    Perhapos this sheds some light on the alcohol/party scene described above?

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