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Secure when veiled; veiled insecurity.

Magic Poriferan

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So here's one of my funny quirks. I feel more comfortable in public the more covered I am. I tend to wear coats and gloves, etc... sooner in the year to later in the year than most people do, because I value the abstract comfort in spite of the discomfort of the heat.

I assume this is a manifestation of social anxiety. as I find no discomforting physical sensation from dressing lightly, I just get tense. The more my shape and my skin is apparent, the more nervous I suppose I am. This is to some extents true for almost everyone, hence the discomfort for a lot of women in going out in a tiny bathing suit. But for me, I do think it goes to odd lengths, obfuscating completely socially innocent parts of my body in 68 degree weather. Another example of this is I almost never wear shorts of short sleaved shirts, as they too, make me nervous somehow.

I think I'd wear a mask if that didn't make people so suspicious.

So this is pretty weird, or at least I think it is. Does anyone else have similar feelings? And what do you think of my habit? Unhealthy? Neurotic? How would you rationalize it?

I guess there are broad cultural questions inside my habit to. What does it mean to be seen by someone? Why care?
 

Mad Hatter

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Oh I can relate. I'm actually glad that it's winter right now so I can wear my jacket, gloves and shawl pretty much all of the time. This is also why the summer bothers me a bit ... Going short-sleeved makes me uncomfortable because it increases the chance of skin contact with other people (I usually avoid even casual things such as handshakes etc.).

So, even though I do it, I find it weird myself. And I would go with your explanation that it's probably due to insecurity, but then there's the question where this insecurity comes from.

I can't really give any advice on how to get rid of it though :(
 

Snuggletron

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I'll admit I am the same way. One of the reasons I like colder seasons also.

Part of it stems from the feeling of security of being more anonymous (or more covered up), part of it stems from insecurity (which likely stems to image and how someone relates to others...which may or may not stem from bad experiences in public school ;) ).

stems.
 

LostInNerSpace

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You're right. I'm ready to be "unveild". I'm ready for prime time. Let's take this show on the road. My ego needs room to stretch.
 

Qre:us

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Could you be more specific?

Nope, because then I'm setting parameters on the answers.

I'm just interested in the response given however way you (he) perceives the question.
 

Magic Poriferan

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How do you perceive your body? In a social context?

Actually I'm confused by the placing of the question marks. Are those two different questions? :huh:

Well I'll answer it as if it were all one question (maybe it is).

It's pretty undeniable that I have poor body image. I'm too skinny, too pale, and in my opinion, for a guy, too short. This is all to say nothing of my face, which is where my biggest complains come from. So that would seem to have something to do with it.

On the other hand, in contrast to this, I get hit on... by men. Straight men. I think it's odd that I should be confused for a woman, and even odder that I should be confused for a woman attractive enough to hit on, but it happens more often than you might think. I'm pretty sure the only reason it declined recently is because I stopped shaving. I makes me incredibly uncomfortable when guys, shall we say, express their interest in some way.

Maybe I also just don't want to be identifiable. :thinking:
 

Qre:us

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Actually I'm confused by the placing of the question marks. Are those two different questions? :huh:

Well I'll answer it as if it were all one question (maybe it is).

It's pretty undeniable that I have poor body image. I'm too skinny, too pale, and in my opinion, for a guy, too short. This is all to say nothing of my face, which is where my biggest complains come from. So that would seem to have something to do with it.

On the other hand, in contrast to this, I get hit on... by men. Straight men. I think it's odd that I should be confused for a woman, and even odder that I should be confused for a woman attractive enough to hit on, but it happens more often than you might think. I'm pretty sure the only reason it declined recently is because I stopped shaving. I makes me incredibly uncomfortable when guys, shall we say, express their interest in some way.

Maybe I also just don't want to be identifiable. :thinking:

Do you get frustrated trying to figure out how to project your physical self in the face of labelling such as masculinity/femininity [this was what I was hinting at, regarding the 'social context']? Are you apprehensive about that (or even that you need to worry about that, in the first place)?

Finally, if you could mold a world where people saw exactly what you wanted them to see, how would you like others to perceive you*?

*not what you can change about yourself, but what perceptions you'd change in others.
 

Magic Poriferan

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do you look like Bill from Tokyo Hotel?

That dude is a world wonder. But no, I'm not that feminine. I have a profile picture, man. Also, I posted stuff in the picture thread (I think the old, locked one).

Do you get frustrated trying to figure out how to project your physical self in the face of labelling such as masculinity/femininity [this was what I was hinting at, regarding the 'social context']? Are you apprehensive about that (or even that you need to worry about that, in the first place)?

Yes, generally. I mean obviously I don't want to be pursued by obnoxious men, just like any woman, but even more so for me since I'm a straight man. It's not only something I'm totally uninterested in and anoyed by, but also a source of fear when I consider how people may react when they find I'm male (some don't take it well).

The women don't behave the same way, but it's still awkward when they get my gender wrong. And it doesn't really make me feel good about myself, because I figure if I'm mistaken for a woman all the time, I may not be too attractive to any heterosexual woman that I'm actually interested in.

So I do assess my clothes in terms of dressing masculine or dressing feminine (which really isn't that feminine if you ask me, but whatver). I think about my apparent gender in general, and yes, it does bother me. I'd rather not have to think about it at all.

Finally, if you could mold a world where people saw exactly what you wanted them to see, how would you like others to perceive you?

That's easy. I'd be exceptionally beautiful, but to women, and I'd be distinctly male. Which is not to say I want to appear typically masculine, I just want people to know my gender. Most of our gender identifiers are articifial anyhow.

If you want to be more abstract, I'd want people to see me as unthreatening, and fascinating.

You know, it's going to be a long list of positive things, right?
 

Qre:us

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Yes, generally. I mean obviously I don't want to be pursued by obnoxious men, just like any woman, but even more so for me since I'm a straight man. It's not only something I'm totally uninterested in and anoyed by, but also a source of fear when I consider how people may react when they find I'm male (some don't take it well).

The women don't behave the same way, but it's still awkward when they get my gender wrong. And it doesn't really make me feel good about myself, because I figure if I'm mistaken for a woman all the time, I may not be too attractive to any heterosexual woman that I'm actually interested in.

So I do assess my clothes in terms of dressing masculine or dressing feminine (which really isn't that feminine if you ask me, but whatver). I think about my apparent gender in general, and yes, it does bother me. I'd rather not have to think about it at all.

May I ask, why the long hair? Do you like it, or do you like the extra veil (comfort) it affords you so that your face isn't that prominent?

And, you know, if you hide behind layers of clothes, it hides you more, yes, but, this also raises the ambiguity, because you are less apparent. Hidden. So, there might be something to the way you dress and why you get perceived the way you do. You, in trying to veil yourself, leave the door open for ambiguity.

Dress to be comfortable, don't dress to be comfortable because you're hidden.


That's easy. I'd be exceptionally beautiful, but to women, and I'd be distinctly male. Which is not to say I want to appear typically masculine, I just want people to know my gender. Most of our gender identifiers are articifial anyhow.

If you want to be more abstract, I'd want people to see me as unthreatening, and fascinating.

Yes, gender identifiers are artificial, as are most things that gets evaluated through physical appearance. It's just the nature of the beast.

Stop hiding. Shake off the layers, and, stand in front of the audience, and let them be the judge again. If you've tried one way for so long, and it's not getting desired results, just for a social experiment, try its opposite (step out of your comfort zone)....


You know, it's going to be a long list of positive things, right?

Of course, if you can note down those positives, then you can figure out concrete ways to manifest that externally.

Ask trusted friends for opinions, too.

I saw your profile pic, you are undeniably male, so I think a lot of the bells and whistles that you use, like the layers of clothing, your hair, etc., that are your security blanket.....covers the very thing you want women to see.

Our physical body is just a shell, revel in it. Experiment with its projection.
 

Magic Poriferan

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May I ask, why the long hair? Do you like it, or do you like the extra veil (comfort) it affords you so that your face isn't that prominent?

Sometimes I hide behind my hair. My hair goes way back, though. My mom cut it when I was a kid, and I hated the process, so my mom stopped. My hair grew long, and save one and only one time since, it's never been above my chin. So I'm very used to it being like this, and it has become a piece of self-identification I suppose.

I do like it. Also, there's a hint of laziness involved in just not cutting it.

And, you know, if you hide behind layers of clothes, it hides you more, yes, but, this also raises the ambiguity, because you are less apparent. Hidden. So, there might be something to the way you dress and why you get perceived the way you do. You, in trying to veil yourself, leave the door open for ambiguity.

Dress to be comfortable, don't dress to be comfortable because you're hidden.

Yes, gender identifiers are artificial, as are most things that gets evaluated through physical appearance. It's just the nature of the beast.

Stop hiding. Shake off the layers, and, stand in front of the audience, and let them be the judge again. If you've tried one way for so long, and it's not getting desired results, just for a social experiment, try its opposite (step out of your comfort zone)....

Of course, if you can note down those positives, then you can figure out concrete ways to manifest that externally.

Hmmm. I don't think I've been told some of this before. I have nothing to say. I can only consider it.

Ask trusted friends for opinions, too.

:unsure:

I saw your profile pic, you are undeniably male, so I think a lot of the bells and whistles that you use, like the layers of clothing, your hair, etc., that are your security blanket.....covers the very thing you want women to see.

Our physical body is just a shell, revel in it. Experiment with its projection.

Wellll... to get picky here, it's not like I've never been lightly clothed. I've head to go out in the middle of summer, long walks, and it usually gets into the 90s here. In those cases, lots of clothing was intolerable, so I dressed down. I still got hit on a lot. :dry:

But that final comment is more general, kind of like some of the other stuff. I don't know, I'll think about it. I have to go to sleep now.
 

LostInNerSpace

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I need a zipper for my mouth. For some reason it is a struggle to avoid put my foot in the poop on this site.
 

FDG

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Wow, that's weird. I feel the opposite (except for the extreme of being naked in public, of course).
 

Magic Poriferan

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Today a man stopped me to ask what my gender was. :laugh:

Well, I guess his approach made it funnier. He said "hey, hey... what is your gender? I'm sorry, I'm lost". I said I'm a man, and he said "Oh shit!" and turned away. He was waking along with a woman. It's almost like they made a bet.
 

Mad Hatter

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Poriferan/Adoamros: Do you feel compelled to wash your hands often?
 
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