User Tag List

First 12345 Last

Results 21 to 30 of 46

  1. #21
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    2,054

    Default

    Thanks for the feedback! Just a quick reply from work: You guys saw this part, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    I was trying to convince him that I had acted badly (so we could move on to talking about what had caused me to do so).
    proximo, your point about exercising humility and giving up judgment is exactly why it took me several hours to grudgingly accept that continuing to see him would be a poor investment.

    How do you foresee my session trajectory with a therapist who spends an hour insisting that I am holding myself to an impossible standard when I describe the behavior with which I am dissatisfied and want help, in the process rationalizing actions he would no doubt decry as abhorrent if he heard them described from the victim's perspective? proximo, you probably don't know me very well, but Athenian, you're an old-timer. Do you really think I need a hand-holding enabler as a therapist, someone who is so taken in by me that they refuse to believe that I could be the one with the problem? It's not exactly like I'm on the little.bad.apple end of the Sweet Dreams spectrum here.

    I would have to bring in other people (and remember the 7-hour round-trip here) to defend "their side" just to convince him to start talking about what I'm there and ready to talk about. (I wonder if he would react the same way even if I embellished that I had been violent...)

    I think I need someone who is neither charmed nor confounded by me but who can take in all the information I provide and make something of that.

    Edit: Me and my quick replies.

  2. #22
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,536

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Economica View Post
    What have been your experiences?
    The problem with most therapies is that they presume there is something wrong with you, while evolution is only concerned with what is right with you.

    So I was struck by the therapist William Reich who plainly loved life. So I found an excellent Reichian therapist, Lara Amber, who was trained at the Radix Institute in New Mexico.

    And like evolution itself, Lara Amber was concerned with what was right with me.

    And I breath deeply just thinking of her. And my feet start to move as I remember her voice. And I can't help myself from dancing, and wanting to dance with you.

  3. #23
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,536

    Default

    Of course therapies are secular substitutes for religion. And most religions presume there is something wrong with you, such as Original Sin or Bad Karma. So naturally most therapies, like religion, presume there is something wrong with you.

    And what you look for, you find.

  4. #24
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    MBTI
    INTx
    Posts
    224

    Default

    Most therapies presume something wrong, as in every other therapist, yeah. My experience was different though. My therapist was himself more of a normal, philosophical theorist with whom I, as an abnormal, crazy gal, just really couldn't get along. He talked like he was understanding me, when in fact he couldn't possibly understand at all. Nor could I understand him. I mean, really, how is one to get anything from therapy when it goes like that.

  5. #25
    (blankpages) Xenon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5
    Posts
    836

    Default

    Damn, sorry you didn't feel he was a good match for you. It can be hard to find someone who is. I'd personally give him a couple more chances to see if he's on to something, especially since first meetings are often awkward.

    While I generally agree that people should normally give a therapist time and consideration, it is a problem if the therapist spends so much time pushing his own views that he doesn't bother to listen to you. He should be listening to what you are saying, even if he doesn't agree. There's lots of information to be gained about a person from listening to their viewpoints, to how they see their problems, even if you have different ideas. And particularly at this point, getting to know you and hear you is what he should be trying to do, and that should be a higher priority than trying to get you to accept his opinions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Z Buck McFate View Post
    Ive learned that, personally, I get a lot more out of psychotherapy if I show up at the session with a succinct, bullet-point summary of whatever I want to work on. In between sessions Id usually journal like crazy, which would really help me single out the issues that were bothering me the most. Then- within the 24 hours before the session- Id condense it into a list. And Id prioritize the list by putting the points that bothered me the most at the top. More often than not, I wouldnt even make it to the bottom of the list by the end of the session.

    It also helped when I formed specific questions about each of the points. To figure out which questions to ask the therapist, Id look at my list and ask myself why I need help with each of the points. Whatever questions I wouldn't be able to answer myself are the questions Id toss at the therapist.
    Oh lord, I wish I were that organized and businesslike. I did write some emails to him, which would pretty much be a mish-mash of thoughts and feelings and analysis, and we'd usually talk about them in our next session. He told me I was eloquent and expressive in my writing and understood myself very well, so that wasn't a problem. It was just the whole planning and action part. He was very non-directive, and maybe I needed more of that. I'm not always good at making coherent, long-term plans and sticking to them on my own. I start to think of something I can do, think of all the problems I might have and back off, start to think of something else, worry and back off...

    Then again, I'm seeing someone now who does act more directive, and it annoys me and isn't helpful. It might have to do with him not understanding me well though.

    Quote Originally Posted by cascadeco View Post
    I think it's important to find a therapist who will meet your specific needs, and what you specifically desire out of the process. For my own situation at the time, I mostly just needed a listening ear/empathizer/supporter, and through the process she said a few things that sparked something in my mind and cleared my mind out -- just a different approach to the entire situation.

    I ended up ceasing to go because I no longer needed the 'Listener'. She was really skilled at Relating - I think that was her strength as a therapist - but by the end of it I no longer needed someone who only related, I would have preferred instead a therapist who could give me *actionable items* to actually work on - giving me a game plan, as such. Being more probing, being more hardcore in the end and pushing me/challenging me.
    Yeah. I'd think that was one of my therapist's main strengths too. And I do believe it helped me feel better temporarily, especially since I was so isolated, but it wasn't enough for making lasting changes.

    Quote Originally Posted by proximo View Post
    That sounds extremely familiar. I don't know what they hope to achieve with that kind of crap. I suppose it all sounds very PC and that they're afraid to be accused of railroading you or putting words into your mouth. Some of them don't want to be in a position where you can say they "made" you do or say things you didn't want to or feel ready for; I suspect that's what's behind that approach, a lot of the time.
    Well, he often told me it would be "unfair" to assume what I'm thinking or what I want, or "inappropriate" to decide what we should talk about. And that he wanted to leave room for me to talk about something else that hadn't been on our agenda previously, so he'd ask me what I wanted to discuss every day. Still, I'd have preferred it if he'd just asked questions about what I'd written to him or what we'd discussed previously, especially when I'd have trouble getting started. It would have been better than nothing, and it might have led to something productive eventually. And, I hated repeating myself, so it annoyed me when he'd ask about things we'd already discussed, as if we'd never talked about it before.

    He seemed almost overly cautious with me at times. He was very careful not to ask me leading questions or assume anything at all. That often led to me having to state things that seemed so obvious I felt silly saying them outright.

    Quote Originally Posted by proximo View Post
    Another approach I encountered was the one where they take up most of the session with detailing to you their plan and asking if you understand and are okay with it. I parodied it once to a friend who asked how the therapy session went. It was like, I came in and he said "Right, now, what we're going to do today, i'm just going to tell you first what I plan for us to do today, and you can tell me what you think, are you okay with that? Do you understand that? Well, what I wanted to do was that, well, after you came in I'd greet you, then we'd check that you were okay with that greeting and I'd get some feedback off you about how that went, then maybe you could try greeting me, and I'll give you some feedback on that, and then we could try sitting down. Are you okay with sitting down? Just tell me if you feel I'm pushing you too hard here, it's no use if we go too fast, is it? So, if you're alright with that, then we can start on our greeting and see how that goes, and then we'll take it from there and see if we need to adjust the plan, depending on the feedback you give me..."

    I was like,
    Wow. I haven't experienced anything like that. Yet.

    Well, best wishes to you Economica, whatever you decide.

  6. #26
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Sorry it didn't work out, Eco. Glad you saw the incompatibility up front and didn't waste your time. I'm also surprised a psychoanalyst talked so much; isn't that something that gets in the way of what they're trying to accomplish? (I'm thinking he should spend much of the session just asking you leading questions and trying to get at your subconscious processes.)

    I wasn't planning to contribute at all, despite having spent 6-7 years in therapy, because I wasn't technically doing psychoanalysis which is what I thought you were interested in. I think I spent the first few years with a shrink doing half-hour sessions, and her primary value was to get me on meds (which did help stabilize things at the time) + help me get used to talking to someone I didn't know about my feelings. But it wasn't really psychoanalysis, she was much more a pragmatist and had hints of CBT where we would assess my responses/perceptions of things and then develop new behaviors of dealing with them.

    When I finally went into hour-long therapy with someone else in the practice, she used an informal brand of Schema Therapy (she didn't use the word, I just realized that's what it was), which mixes CBT with some "healthy parenting" in order to compensate for perspectives I developed in childhood that have been not just detrimental to me but inaccurate. Once you change the scheme through which you view the world, it's far easier to change the maladjusted behavior.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #27
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    3,939

    Default

    I had cognitive behavioural therapy - six sessions, I think - for a few months this summer, for a phobia. I'd never had therapy before.

    It's hard to say yet how helpful it was because it was for fear of flying and I've only taken one short round-trip flight since starting the therapy (just before I finished). It went ok, certainly better than some flights in the past year (which is when the phobia became a problem) but at the moment I have no flights planned as I have too many other things to worry about in my life (like getting a proper job!)... I will get a better idea when I start flying a bit more regularly again.

    The therapist seemed quite good and there were some relaxation techniques I learned which I think helped. We also talked about thought-challenging, and the fact that anxiety always has to peak and then go down again...etc...and those seemed helpful. But I felt like I didn't have the time and energy to practice some of the techniques enough.
    Female
    INFJ
    Enneagram 6w5 sp/sx


    I DOORSLAMMING

  8. #28
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    2,054

    Default

    Would a mod please change the title of this thread to "Economica's (and others') experiences with psychotherapy" and move it to the NT Personal Threads? Thanks in advance.

    Quote Originally Posted by blankpages View Post
    While I generally agree that people should normally give a therapist time and consideration, it is a problem if the therapist spends so much time pushing his own views that he doesn't bother to listen to you. He should be listening to what you are saying, even if he doesn't agree. There's lots of information to be gained about a person from listening to their viewpoints, to how they see their problems, even if you have different ideas. And particularly at this point, getting to know you and hear you is what he should be trying to do, and that should be a higher priority than trying to get you to accept his opinions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Sorry it didn't work out, Eco. Glad you saw the incompatibility up front and didn't waste your time. I'm also surprised a psychoanalyst talked so much; isn't that something that gets in the way of what they're trying to accomplish? (I'm thinking he should spend much of the session just asking you leading questions and trying to get at your subconscious processes.)
    ^ That.

    Jennifer, I too was surprised that he took the liberty to talk so much. I think maybe 1) he tries to make patients feel at ease by making it more conversational (but that was a waste of time for me since I had no problem whatsoever opening up) and 2) he is used to patients eating up his words (whereas I require more bang for my buck and would prefer for him to concentrate his energy on listening and processing and producing just a few relevant questions or observations per session).

    If he lived in my city, I might give him a second chance, but for me to go there again (and to ask other people to come with me), he would have to be someone I had more faith in from the get-go.

    By the way, in case anyone is interested, I think he is an ENFJ.

    I will make an appointment with a local therapist soon and keep you all updated on how that goes!

  9. #29
    Senior Member proximo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    584

    Default

    Okay, well good luck with it, then.

    I hope we're not going to be here again, four therapists later, though
    I'm male and over 30, FYI.
    Preferences: 20% Extravert, 98% Intuitive, 68% Thinker, 17% Perceiving

  10. #30
    Dhampyr Economica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Posts
    2,054

    Default

    I hope not either...

Similar Threads

  1. [MBTItm] NFP's - What are you experiences with ISTJ?
    By Santosha in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 01-30-2012, 03:59 PM
  2. FJs: What are your relationships like with other FJs?
    By proteanmix in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 11-10-2008, 03:08 PM
  3. Replies: 20
    Last Post: 04-28-2007, 06:40 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO