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Is logic limited?

Oaky

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Magic Poriferan

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If we're talking about any possible system and what it potentially yields to the most competent person, then logic is virtually unlimited in its application. The only area where I can think of it not applying is when value judgments come up. We use logic to apply values to reality, but generally, all values have an illogical foundation. There is no logic involved in your feeling that a cheeseburger is or isn't tasty.

However, all human thoughts and feelings are just a biological process, which means all of your values are probably derived from a set of switches, of sorts. In such a case, it means there is a system to those switches, and the values they produce, that could be understood through logic. So maybe even values are within logic.

However, our experience of values, as well as many of our other feelings and senses, can probably never be understood logically. Alas, logic itself is an abstract construct of ours, and something we sort of experience. This brings about an issue with the OP's question. How are we supposed to understand the word limited? I say logic is applicable to anything, but it does not explain everything about what it is applied to.

As for whether or not there is truth outside of logic, I'd say no. True and false are the most basic components of logic. Even acknowledging your illogically formed values requires you to make a statement about them within the real of true/false.
 

ajblaise

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Logic has limits, but we're not going to reach them any time soon.
 

INTP

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i dont think human logic is limited, but info to make logical desicions with is limited, allso some things are so hard to understand that it might take meny lifetimes to figure something out.

animal logic is really limited and apes arent the only ones using logic. for example some birds use better logic than apes
 

Oaky

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^ If you consider the theory of evolution your theory of human logic not being limited would be false.
If we're talking about any possible system and what in potentially yields to the most competent person, then logical is virtually unlimited in its application. The only area where I can think of it not applying is when value judgments come up. We use logic to apply values to reality, but generally, all values have an illogical foundation. There is no logic involved in your feeling that a cheeseburger is or isn't tasty.

However, all human thoughts and feelings are just a biological process, which means all of your values are probably derived from a set of switches, of sorts. In such a case, it means there is a system to those switches, and the values they produce, that could be understood through logic. So maybe even values are within logic.

However, our experience of values, as well as many of our other feelings and senses, can probably never be understood logically. Alas, logic itself is an abstract construct of ours, and something we sort of experience. This brings about an issue with the OP's question. How are we supposed to understand the word limited? I say logic is applicable to anything, but it does not explain everything about what it is applied to.

As for whether or not there is truth outside of logic, I'd say know. True and false are the most basic components of logic. Even acknowledge your illogically formed values requires you to make a statement about them with in the real of true/false.
Interesting... A good explanation of what logic is. By limited I mean are there things that can go beyond human logic and understanding? If there are than logic is therefore limited.
 

Oaky

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^ Information is limited therefore logic is limited?
 

BlueScreen

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^ If you consider the theory of evolution your theory of human logic not being limited would be false.
Interesting... A good explanation of what logic is. By limited I mean are there things that can go beyond human logic and understanding? If there are than logic is therefore limited.

Of course there are. Why would the universe work the same way as our thoughts and move in the same way as the rules we invent. Our understanding is in this domain because it is our comfortable way of modelling it. The truth of the processes could be anything. It may not be definable in human thought.

As you said also, our perception is limited, hence logic is limited. Crap in = crap out.
 

Laurie

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Human logic is limited by the human. Before I joined this forum I didn't realize that so many people were insistent that their logic is superior, just by virtue of their (often poorly adjusted) personality.

I used to value logic more highly before I found out what many people actually consider logic. I now see the term as something people use as a weak reason that they feel should cause others to unquestioningly agree with their point of view.
 

Oaky

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^ Very interesting. So you believe logic is limited as every human has a limit to their logic. Do you not however use logic as a standpoint in argument yourself?
Of course there are. Why would the universe work the same way as our thoughts and move in the same way as the rules we invent. Our understanding is in this domain because it is our comfortable way of modelling it. The truth of the processes could be anything. It may not be definable in human thought.

As you said also, our perception is limited, hence logic is limited. Crap in = crap out.
I see. Nice explanation.
 

Laurie

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I think logic is a good tool to understanding and presenting thoughts. I think logic is very limited by people's views on what logic is.

People just often talk about "logic" and aren't even being logical.
 

Oaky

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^ I see. True, very true.
 

INTP

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human logic isnt limited to one human
 

EcK

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It's not about logic , it's about logic x culture. If we imagined a theoretical infinite future for humanity (purely for the argument's purpose), the tools we'd develop+the accumulated knowledge etc. could make logic as a process tend towards infinite information.

Now ofc that's not possible in this universe, be it only because of proton decay, entropy in general and the limited quantity of matter available to store information. So the process isn't limited but the universe is.
 

Oaky

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^ Interesting, But wouldn't that just make logic constantly grow but not reach to infinite?
 

Oaky

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logic, knownledge and understanding are different things, so thats irrelevant
1+1=2 is a logical equation
The knowledge is that there is a 1 and another 1.
 
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