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  1. #21
    Junior Member GHC's Avatar
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    For me like someone else said I value truth cause it is reality, it is the only way for me to know that I am not being manipulated, deceived or that I am fooling myself to see things better than they are ( we are speaking about different truths here) or imposing my belief unfairly on other people, Knowing the truth I have a better perspective about things and I can use that knowledge to help myself and others in a healthy way.

    Sometimes when being Truthful you might end up being seeing as tactless or blunt though when you aren't doing to harm anybody or to impose the way you see things in others your honesty would be appreciated.(Most of the time, at least)

    That said, there are many Jerks that can get purposely nasty with words and claim after that they were only being "truthful" or "honest" while in reality they were just being obnoxious and nasty, to this kind of people just tell them to FUCK OFF or just ignored them. This are usually the most dishonest and rude you can find.

    I suck with punctuations I know

  2. #22
    Retired Member Wonkavision's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post

    Oh yeah, and socionics is voodoo, and for that reason people won't agree with you.
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  3. #23
    Magical BlackCat's Avatar
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    Awesome. xD
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  4. #24
    Senior Member Gewitter27's Avatar
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    Anybody can believe what they want to believe, they'll just be wrong. One should point out their error. If they do not desist from there, then you must respect their inherent idiocy and move on.
    I 96% N 93% T 75% P 63% 5w4 sp/sx/so ILI
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    I'm interested in what you percieve me to be. Johari/Nohari

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I mean, it seems like most people have a devotion to their version of it, and value this whole thing about being "honest," regardless of whether anyone is interested in what they have to say. Generally speaking, I find people who overtly value "truth" to be pointlessly tactless and crude. They can also be rather thick, unable to discern subtlety, and unwilling to present themselves in a positive light in order to help them succeed.

    It can be rather frustrating to have to put up with a bunch of blunt, self-assured "truth-tellers" who don't have the least bit of respect for my willingness to accommodate others, and think I'm worthless because I don't go around trying to inflict my views on everyone I meet.

    What I have to question, though, is whether "truth" is really as desirable as people make it out to be. I mean, in some cases, couldn't it be detrimental to our well-being, comfort, ability to function day-to-day, or relationships with other people? It seems to me that people today often put truth ahead of people's humanity, and believe that the truth speaks for itself, and justifies itself, unable to consider the idea that truth isn't warranted in every context of human affairs.
    I know how you feel. As a fellow INFJ, I have tremendous issues with certain accepted behaviors or rules within my community and the world in general. In fact, sometimes I can't believe certain rules and codes of behavior are accepted at all. A better option seems readily visible and doable to me, but others often cannot or do not want to see it.

    Personally, I have not had your experience quite so much. Actually, I've had issues with people not being upfront enough at times. Not that they were liars, they just lived very much in the external world, so they weren't able to see what was really going on inside of other people or even inside themselves. Thus, they came across as pretty "out of touch" to me because even direct communication was too deep for them. But I digress... (sorry about that)

    Back to your situation, I think you might be overestimating the honesty of the people you've mentioned, ironically. I somehow doubt they're all telling the truth about everything all of the time. It just doesn't seem likely or even really possible to me. Make no mistake, honesty IS important. It's important that your significant other can count on you to be faithful, it's important that people can trust you when you tell them something that happened if it's necessary to and it's important that you don't cheat or steal (unless you absolutely had to as a last resort to put food on your table....that's different).

    As important as honesty is, though, if everyone only told the truth all of the time, I think the world would be a pretty messed up place. When you're on a job interview, dating someone or just seeing someone on the street who's your friend, it's usually not appropriate to tell them EVERYTHING. When you make a resume`, you only put down the GOOD things you did. If you put down the bad things, you would be compromising yourself. Technically, it's not completely honest to only write the good things you've done, but everyone else is going to be doing that, and you want to put yourself in the best light possible. Some very honest individuals may view that as lying, but it's really an attempt to grease the wheels of opportunity and social interaction.

    When you're on a date, are you going to tell them some embarrassing story from your day on the first date? It would be inappropriate and not helpful towards breaking the ice, which is really what you want to be doing in that situation. You try to look your best and put yourself in the best possible light, again, because you want to get to know the person, and ironically, putting yourself in the best light makes them want to get to know you better.

    When you're seeing a friend on the street and you feel horrible about something personal in your life, you probably aren't going to want to go and tell them about it when they say, "How are you doing?" It's again, you guessed it: inappropriate.

    Children tell all, but adults don't have to. If something is your business and you don't feel like sharing it, it's your right to keep it to yourself and no one has to know. Keep in mind that when you've cheated someone or generally done something wrong that hurts people, it's probably best to own up to it, but if it's just something that's your business and doesn't hurt anyone not to know it, then by all means feel free to keep it to yourself. Everyone has secrets anyway. There isn't a (sane) person on this Earth who doesn't have at least one thing they probably don't want you to know about them.

    My point is, I guess, that tact, like intuition, is a personality skill which is developed over time. Knowing when or when not to share something is an all-too important aspect of life in this world. Usually, the more mature you get, the better you become at choosing when or when not to express something. If you never learn to hold back, you will definitely rub people the wrong way, but if you keep everything inside, you're just cut off from the rest of the world. So there has to be a happy medium, and that's what you want to strive for.
    A hero is someone who does the right thing without expectation of reward, just because it's the right thing to do.

  6. #26
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    In reference to the OP, I'm typically suspicious of snake oil salesmen peddling "truth."

    America has become a society of liars. We see it in politics, we see it in business, we see it in nearly all of our societal institutions.

  7. #27
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    The "Truth" you speak of is bound to come out sooner or later.

    If not addressed when things are negative this will lead to more drastic consequence. If I know what I am working with I can assess it correctly. After all knowledge is power.

    This seems to be the dynamic.....I want to know when truth is good, but not negative.

  8. #28
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    The only constant in life is the breath. Everything else is negotiable.

  9. #29
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I mean, it seems like most people have a devotion to their version of it, and value this whole thing about being "honest," regardless of whether anyone is interested in what they have to say. Generally speaking, I find people who overtly value "truth" to be pointlessly tactless and crude. They can also be rather thick, unable to discern subtlety, and unwilling to present themselves in a positive light in order to help them succeed.

    It can be rather frustrating to have to put up with a bunch of blunt, self-assured "truth-tellers" who don't have the least bit of respect for my willingness to accommodate others, and think I'm worthless because I don't go around trying to inflict my views on everyone I meet.

    What I have to question, though, is whether "truth" is really as desirable as people make it out to be. I mean, in some cases, couldn't it be detrimental to our well-being, comfort, ability to function day-to-day, or relationships with other people? It seems to me that people today often put truth ahead of people's humanity, and believe that the truth speaks for itself, and justifies itself, unable to consider the idea that truth isn't warranted in every context of human affairs.
    Well, there's a fine line between "honesty" and "indiscretion". It's a valued characteristic to be "honest" but obviously not "indiscreet". An indiscreet person is usually one who talks too much.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne View Post
    Well, there's a fine line between "honesty" and "indiscretion". It's a valued characteristic to be "honest" but obviously not "indiscreet". An indiscreet person is usually one who talks too much.

    I disagree there. I can talk for England, but I'll keep your and everyone else's secrets. If i am asking a question it is because i am looking for guidance as i am stuck in a rut but i would still never tell a lie. Granted i could of been more discreet in my questions when i first came here, but how do you get an proper answer if you are not aware of all the facts to start with.


    But saying that .. What is a lie or the truth? People can convince themselves that their lies are truth and i witnessed it quite recently. Not very pleasant.

    Personally i prefer the truth from people .. Of course it can be worded in a way that is not going to rip someones core to shreds. There is no need to be nasty about it.
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

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