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  1. #11
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post

    This is complicated by the fact that the gullible want to be deceived.
    I don't think a gullible wants to be deceived. Want assumes an awareness. They are too gullible to know deceit to either, (a) avoid it in the first place, and/or (b) want it. As to want is to know of the want.

  2. #12
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    I think the two usually do go together. Sweet people are partly that way because they can't seem to recognize the things around them that would make them susceptible to being cynical. There's an aura of innocence around sweetness or gullibility.

    That said, there are definitely unsweet gullible people, and sweet people that have enough experience to protect themselves from being gulled.

    Quote Originally Posted by me_plus_one View Post
    No, they don't go together.

    I personally prefer gullible persons, because they are automatically truthfull and ...well, gullible.

    Sweetness however, if not accompanied by gullibility, becomes a mean to deceive people.
    Hmph. I don't think you should be so quick to judge people as being deceiving if they're sweet in nature. Some people really are nice as a personality trait.

    The fact that you'd value gullibility in people seems to indicate more to your want to manipulate people. Gullibility is cute, at best, but not very practical unless you're wanting to deceive people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    Maybe if sweet can relate to innocence? Then, yeah, I can see how it could also mean gullible.

    Like, Adam and Eve and the apple, or Pandora and her curiosity to open the box. With knowledge comes the diminishing of innocence, and with that, a shwred awareness (killing gullibility).
    Well said.

    Quote Originally Posted by me_plus_one View Post
    Hm, well that depends. Do you consider gullibility as stupidness or as naivete?
    I consider it stupidness out of naivete.
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  3. #13
    movin melodies kiddykat's Avatar
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    I think perhaps for those who are sweet, in a wise-sense, those who tend to laugh at things, they're probably more keen/aware than most people?

    My motto: those who appear strongest are sometimes, weakest. Those who appear weakest are sometimes strongest. I don't think Ghandi was naiive, as sweet as he was. I think he was wise enough to be understanding, and defenseless, which can be taken for granted by those who seek ignorance, instead of enlightenment.

  4. #14
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    I don't think a gullible wants to be deceived.
    Just as the damaged want to damage,

    And the deceived want to deceive,

    The gullible want to gull.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    And to gull means to deceive.

    And the gullible follow MBTI because they want to be deceived.
    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Just as the damaged want to damage,

    And the deceived want to deceive,

    The gullible want to gull.
    To clear up the discrepency: Does the gullible want to be gulled (be deceived) or does the gullible want to gull (to deceive), because of what's been done to them (i.e., assuming then they know they've been deceived)?

    Maybe you want to say, that the gullible who wants to deceive, by the very act of wanting then to deceive, has thus, once again been deceived? If so, how has then he/she been deceived?

    And round and round we go on the merry-go-round of cognitive dissonance. The dizziness is a form of clarity itself, you'll argue?

  6. #16
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    To clear up the discrepency: Does the gullible want to be gulled (be deceived) or does the gullible want to gull (to deceive), because of what's been done to them (i.e., assuming then they know they've been deceived)?

    Maybe you want to say, that the gullible who wants to deceive, by the very act of wanting then to deceive, has thus, once again been deceived? If so, how has then he/she been deceived?

    And round and round we go on the merry-go-round of cognitive dissonance. The dizziness is a form of clarity itself, you'll argue?
    Those to whom evil is done, do evil in return.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Those to whom evil is done, do evil in return.
    Forgiveness is the strongest solitary soldier against an army of evil.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    Forgiveness is the strongest solitary soldier against an army of evil.
    Forgiveness is a solitary reed against the rising tide.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Forgiveness is a solitary reed against the rising tide.
    And just as the tides shall move to the song of the fickle moon, so shall the reed sway but an inch, rooted to the pull of the steadfast earth.

  10. #20

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    You know, out of all of this, I think I found the best translation for the word I had in mind: innocent.

    Also, I think Gandhi was a very good example where kindness and naivete did not go together. He had a better understanding of human nature than most in his time, and what's even more great was his ability bring out and make use of the better natures in human beings.

    Gandhi believed and executed Satyagraha where
    "[t]he [...] object is to convert, not to coerce, the wrong-doer.[1] Success is defined as cooperating with the opponent to meet a just end that the opponent is unwittingly obstructing. The opponent must be converted, at least as far as to stop obstructing the just end, for this cooperation to take place.
    He was able to convert his enemies, just as Martin Luther King did during the struggle for civil rights in the U.S.

    In a world full of gray areas and compromise, a person who sees things as black and white, is either incredibly naive, or posses a conscience of the highest order.

    I hope to develop such a conscience some day.

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