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  1. #1
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Default Suicide and social power

    When someone is suicidal, this gives them an immediate power card over everyone who cares about them. I spent many years alongside someone who was suicidal and because of this, everyone immediately catered to this person in a desperate attempt to quell off this severe depression. Their feelings were of greater value than everyone around them because they were in a state of emergency. There was an underlying fear to ever offer criticism, get into just a regular spat, constant fear if they withdrew they had done themselves in. People constantly pleaded to consider some more positive alternatives to thinking, reminding them they always have someone to turn to, etc. Being in a clinical depression, this person would throw off every attempt at help as useless and wasn't inclined towards medical help either.

    I have loved such people and 'tried' to be a source of support. But i never offered the basic suggestions to help clarify their thinking. For example, this person from my past believed all the problems would be fixed if they simply had someone to love. Because they saw the responsibility for their happiness as resting on another person, they would sabotage social interactions by obviously placing way too much emotional pressure immediately. People would tend to run. It was a horrible catch-22. This person was admirable and worthwhile, but their insistence on self-destruction and that help could only come from a lover gave them a power card i don't think they even were aware they were playing.

    It's tragic, and important. I have no idea how to negotiate through this type of minefield. I've had to try and i come out with a lot of guilt, confusion, regret, and yet no clear idea of what i 'should' have done.

    Anyone share this type of experience and have success?
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  2. #2
    ✿ڿڰۣஇღ♥ wut ♥ღஇڿڰۣ✿ digesthisickness's Avatar
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    i've experienced a lot of suicide and a lot of suicidal talk in both my family and friends.

    i'm not saying that what i've witnessed is how 'it is', but the ones that followed through (five in total) were always the ones who never mentioned it in the first place. everything seemed fine, and then they were dead.

    the ones that have hinted around about it or came right out and said it's a possibility haven't done more than inflicted superficial wounds.
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  3. #3
    にゃん runvardh's Avatar
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    Had the thoughts, didn't do it, I'd probably say "go ahead" if someone threatened to do it...
    Dreams are best served manifest and tangible.

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  4. #4

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    One of the things I've realized is that depression adn even suicidal thoughts are fare more prevelant than reported, diagnosed and treated. When my family and friends found out I was depressed, many have confessed to feeling the same way. Some did not actually end up taking medication, but counselling was common.

    It seems more thatn the 1 in 5 talked about, closer to the 1 in 3 figure I saw somewhere (but I haven't found).

    I don't think their feelings were of a greater value because of the state of emergency. But the state of emergency did warrant making sure he/she felt heard, loved, and appreciated.

    For me, I always felt loved and appreciated, but the thing that got to me was "marginalization". Never being taken seriously, not being heard, and or being dismissed. I felt like I was incapable of making myself understood on things that mattered to me. I don't know if being depressed was a "power play", but I can certanly understand it being percived that way-- someway to have people listen to me for a change.

    Still, I would consider my own story a "success" so far. I believe I have pulled out of my depression, and now my councelling sessions are going to be on an "as needed" basis and I will see my psychiatrist to check on medication every couple of months or so (mainly to cope with any potential compliations as I start the widthrawal process).

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    i'm not saying that what i've witnessed is how 'it is', but the ones that followed through (five in total) were always the ones who never mentioned it in the first place. everything seemed fine, and then they were dead.

    the ones that have hinted around about it or came right out and said it's a possibility haven't done more than inflicted superficial wounds.
    Of course, the ones who said nothing gave no opportunity to be talked back from the brink, since no-one knew they were there. The ones that hinted or admitted they were having suicidal thoughts could be helped.

  6. #6
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    Of course, the ones who said nothing gave no opportunity to be talked back from the brink, since no-one knew they were there. The ones that hinted or admitted they were having suicidal thoughts could be helped.
    I tend to see it more as in this:

    If someone really wants to kill themselves, they'll do it and have no need to discuss it with someone else. In fact, they might even avoid discussing it... because they don't want someone to stop them.

    If someone wants to find another alternative to killing themselves, even if they do not know what it could possibly be, they'll bring it up. They want SOMEONE to say something that might help, or just have others know what they're going through and perhaps that knowledge might be enough to keep them alive (i.e., being understood).

    Of course, those who bring it up in a context of a fight, to manipulate someone else, really doesn't want to kill themselves at all; they're just playing for power.

    I know with me it's the middle one, when I've talked about it. I really don't want to die, I'd rather live. But often I have very bad feelings of wanting to be dead because I don't know how else to end the pain and/or pervasive numbness. A solution other than death is preferable, if I get a choice.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  7. #7
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I've been depressed most of my life. I rarely tell people anymore, because they normally offer no help or act suprised. I also had a bad experience in therapy that kind of turned me off to the idea of asking for help. It wasn't tramatizing or anything, it was they were trying to change me into something I didn't like. I'm getting to the point where if I don't get help, I'll be dead soon. It's so hard for me to ask though.

    I've had friends tell me they were going to kill themselves/depressed. I found out from one friend later, that she liked me because I listened and just let her vent. And I'm really hard to offend, so people can say whatever they want, and live however they want as long as they aren't hurting others.

  8. #8
    Member whiteraven's Avatar
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    I apologize for using point form, but it is how this wants to be written.

    Years of cycling depression, mostly wanting to disappear, but including bouts of wanting to damage. Morphed into wanting to be dead. Too proud (?) to share, couple of bad experiences trying to share shut me up. Times of okayness. Gradually spiraled into constant thoughts of death, craving to hurt, planning on how, talking myself out of it every waking moment instead of thinking about doing it. Manic stupidity mixed in to distract from the feelings of wanting to be dead, or the feelings of nothingness and constant pain. Finally it came out, made drastic changes in my life that I feel are necessary to avoid being that way, the person whom this affected most had to know the reasons for it and it got even worse. Didn't think it was possible.

    Now I am getting better, has settled to mostly feelings of wanting to run away, cut, or smother when pressured. The person affected by my decision is the one who is where I was. He threatens, but I feel that his is different than mine. Mine gradually built over years, and I think I may have actually slipped through the cracks had I not decided that I had to try some other things first. I also worry that I could go that way again if not enough change is made. His seems to be more a way to get me to listen to him. If he does anything, it will be in a fit of rage or frustration, not completely planned. Mine would have been arranged to the last detail. Oxidation versus combustion.

    I wonder if there is any information out there on which type actually attempts or succeeds more often. I do know they say women attempt more and males succeed more due to the relative violence of the attempts.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Sahara's Avatar
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    I was told that the suicide rate was higher in SJ's Whiteraven, but you might want to check that as this is an infp relaying facts here.
    "No one can be free of the chains that surround them"

  10. #10
    Member whiteraven's Avatar
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    I guess I should have said "kind" instead of "type" around here. I was more asking if the lashing out type of suicidal person actually succeeds or the silent, slip away and do it person does. I guess I was wondering if what digest found was true. Of the two people who were related to me who succeeded, I don't think anyone knew for one, but he had many other issues, and the other had attempted many times, but the family still thinks she was just attempting to get help and not to really die, but this time no one got to her on time.

    I guess part of me wants to know how much to worry.

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