I'm officially emotionally retarded...

[matmos]

And it is a very simple and obvious exercise.

But easier to not do than do.

 

[Mole]

...having someone else say "Hey, that happens to me, too!" can be the difference between depression and motivation. I know this from my own experience, and I am very thankful for this forum in this regard.

This forum is devoted to sympathy and is devoid of empathy.

That is why I say this forum is for palliative care and that this forum is not for therapy.

 

[jenocyde]

I feel empathy for what he is going through, but not sympathy.

 

[Mole]

I feel empathy for what he is going through, but not sympathy.

Empathy means you know what he is feeling without feeling it yourself.

But you are telling us you are feeling it yourself - so you are sympathising rather than empathising.

 

[jenocyde]

Ok, I'm not going to go back and forth with this and I'm kind of tired of this thread now...

It's empathy because I don't feel it, but I can identify his feeling because I have felt it before, sometime in the past. But that doesn't mean that I feel it now, on his behalf. So it's not sympathy.

 

[Mole]

Ok, I'm not going to go back and forth with this and I'm kind of tired of this thread now...

It's empathy because I don't feel it, but I can identify his feeling because I have felt it before, sometime in the past. But that doesn't mean that I feel it now, on his behalf. So it's not sympathy.

OK, so you are right and I am wrong.

So you see we have already created our own little dysfunctional dyad.

 

[MrME]

Empathy means you know what he is feeling without feeling it yourself.

But you are telling us you are feeling it yourself - so you are sympathising rather than empathising.

Empathy is feeling the same feelings.
Sympathy is understanding the feelings, but not feeling them yourself.

 

[Mole]

Empathy is feeling the same feelings.
Sympathy is understanding the feelings, but not feeling them yourself.

You have it exactly the wrong way round.

Are you trying to be funny?

 

[Halla74]

Ok, I'm not going to go back and forth with this and I'm kind of tired of this thread now...

It's empathy because I don't feel it, but I can identify his feeling because I have felt it before, sometime in the past. But that doesn't mean that I feel it now, on his behalf. So it's not sympathy.

Jenocyde, we understand each other, I appreciate your feedback, and apologize if you have been nailed by unecessary semantics in this thread as of late. You are correct, I don't need sympathy, but do appreciate your empathy, thanks my friend!

PeaceBaby: REF: Agreed; that is why it is puzzling to me now that Halla is hesitant to try this exercise; it could represent an opportunity for real emotional growth.

I am not hesitant to try it, I merely do not understand its utility and am in a position where I must make some pretty big choices soon, and have been cited by a counselor I have been working with as emotionally under-developed in comparison to my capability to think. My gut reaction? In times of crisis, go with what you know. Don't try out new weapons in the middle of a war, test them in a less mission critical environment.

FINAL DECISION:
I am taking a formal time out from any and all stresses which preclude me to make a decision that I am not willing to make at this time. I will finish my analysis as I deem necessary and will include the emotional component of decision making to the best degree possible, assuming I have not done so already in some integrated manner, as noted by Jenocyde.

Although I think the "exercises" hokey, I will try them to see what happens. How can it hurt?

I thank all of you for your insights, I have enjoyed the collective expansion of the issue I presented here, and will post a final outcome as soon as time and circumstance allow. Until then, rest well knowing that you have helped me with your comments, feedback, and the sharing of your life's experiences; and please don't bicker at each other anymore.

Cheers to all!

-Alex

 

[PeaceBaby]

Hey, what happened to this thread? I went to eat dinner and bam, a whole bunch of new posts!

Look, Halla is a grown man and he will do what's best for himself. He posted this because he wanted feedback on the methods. So I gave him my interpretation. He can take it or leave it.

It's nice for you to share it. I'm sure it is appreciated.

A feeling is felt - it's either good or bad, that's pretty much the extent of it. If it's good, I roll with it. If it's bad, I act on it. So of course feelings drive decisions. But I won't act even on a good feeling if it doesn't make logical sense to do so - I think we're all like that. Someone may be attractive, but that doesn't mean it makes sense to date that person. I think of all the pros and cons, the effect my decision will have on others, and the effect my decision will have on myself. Then I choose what seems the most logical and what seems will create the less damage down the road, for all parties involved. Later, I reflect on everything and I am then able (most often) to pinpoint what made the feeling good or bad. But the name of the feeling itself doesn't matter. The point is I felt something that spurred me to action.

Cool; thanks for explaining how personal feelings influence your decisions.

But in Halla's case, he has more than just his emotions to worry about.

So you are aware of Halla's situation; you have additional info. That's fine, but appreciate that you have more facts to go with. I am supporting the idea of trying an emotional awareness exercise in the interest of personal growth. And sometimes, what we feel resistance to is the very thing we should be looking at more closely.

 

[Mole]

...what we feel resistance to is the very thing we should be looking at more closely.

Quite so.

 

[PeaceBaby]

Good luck Alex.

 

[MrME]

You have it exactly the wrong way round.

Are you trying to be funny?

No, because I am correct.

People are called "empathic" when they feel another person's emotions. That's empathy. "I feel your pain," is empathy. "I'm sorry for your loss," is sympathy.

 

[Udog]

Do you ever have these gut "hunches" that guide your decisions? I usually view emotional decisions as something like that.

This. Does your body 'speak' to you? Like, do some options just make you sick inside, while other options make you feel a bit better? LISTEN to that. If your body does things that make you feel bad (guts twisting, tensing up), then it's telling you something bad, but if you feel relaxed or get a spring to your step, it's telling you something good.

Illustrative example: Make a choice in your head. Say you decide to punch a puppy in the kidney to make you feel better. Envision that in your head. How does your body react? Does it flinch? Does the image make you want to punch a puppy? Alternative, say you decide to volunteer at a nursing home and do a show. Picture yourself in front of children and elderly, being the entertaining SOB you know you are, and everyone laughing and having a good time. How does your body react to that compared to the puppy punching scenario?

You don't have to understand it, as that's not how you are wired. You just want a VERY rough outline and add some shading to your overall decision.

So you envision the above. Does the thing that makes your guts feel a bit less tight align with your moral compass? Can you logically justify that action? If, for some reason, the puppy punching scenario makes you feel better, does that align to your values? No? Well, crap. Then my example sucked and I FAIL.

However, if the second scenario made you feel better... does that align with your moral compass? Can you logically justify that? If so, guess what? You just learned how to read your emotions a bit better than you did when you woke up this morning. Congrats!

The key to remember is that emotions are the shading and rough outline. As a T, your heaving duty lifting is done logically.

1. How can your counselor be trying to tell you something for months? Why doesn't he just say it?? Seems incredible ineffective as a professional. (sorry, just my honest opinion)

Yeah - I don't have confidence in your councilor either - and not just because of this.

 

[PeaceBaby]

No, because I am correct.

People are called "empathic" when they feel another person's emotions. That's empathy. "I feel your pain," is empathy. "I'm sorry for your loss," is sympathy.

Sorry, incorrect.

em⋅pa⋅thy   
–noun 1. the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.

sym⋅pa⋅thy   
–noun 1. harmony of or agreement in feeling, as between persons or on the part of one person with respect to another.
2. the harmony of feeling naturally existing between persons of like tastes or opinion or of congenial dispositions.
3. the fact or power of sharing the feelings of another, esp. in sorrow or trouble; fellow feeling, compassion, or commiseration.​

'Nuff said.

Clarification: this post of mine doesn't help wrt the overlap of "feeling other's feelings." I think there are other threads on this topic and I suppose the discussion of the difference should probably move there.

 

[Orangey]

Sorry, incorrect.

em⋅pa⋅thy   
–noun 1. the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.

sym⋅pa⋅thy   
–noun 1. harmony of or agreement in feeling, as between persons or on the part of one person with respect to another.
2. the harmony of feeling naturally existing between persons of like tastes or opinion or of congenial dispositions.
3. the fact or power of sharing the feelings of another, esp. in sorrow or trouble; fellow feeling, compassion, or commiseration.​

'Nuff said.

Wait...I'm not seeing how this contradicts what he said. "I feel your pain" is the "vicarious experiencing of the feelings of another. You feel the other person's pain. "I'm sorry for your loss" is being sad for your friend, feeling compassion for their loss.

 

[jenocyde]

Empathy is when you can objectively identify or understand what a person is going through. You can imagine what they may be going through but your current feelings are not involved.

Sympathy is when you can actually feel their pain.

 

[Orangey]

Empathy is when you can objectively identify or understand what a person is going through. You can imagine what they may be going through but your current feelings are not involved.

Sympathy is when you can actually feel their pain.

I think you have it reversed. This quoted bit is from dictionary.com. I have always taken empathy to mean the ability to actually personally experience the pain of others (because you share similar experience), while sympathy is the more objective one (like having pity on someone is a form of sympathy...you may not have had their experience, but you can sympathize with how they might be feeling).

Both empathy and sympathy are feelings concerning other people. Sympathy is literally 'feeling with' - compassion for or commiseration with another person. Empathy, by contrast, is literally 'feeling into' - the ability to project one's personality into another person and more fully understand that person. Sympathy derives from Latin and Greek words meaning 'having a fellow feeling'. The term empathy originated in psychology (translation of a German term, c. 1903) and has now come to mean the ability to imagine or project oneself into another person's position and experience all the sensations involved in that position. You feel empathy when you've "been there", and sympathy when you haven't. Examples: We felt sympathy for the team members who tried hard but were not appreciated. / We felt empathy for children with asthma because their parents won't remove pets from the household.

 

[PeaceBaby]

Yes, the word vicarious complicates the definition. It is easy to intermingle the meanings, and indeed, when you compare dictionary definitions of the two words, they can both overlap and contradict each other as well.

For me the distinction is this: empathy I identify with you, sympathy I commiserate with you.

As added above, here is a thread on the topic for fun: Sympathy/Empathy

 

[Mole]

Empathy is when you can objectively identify or understand what a person is going through. You can imagine what they may be going through but your current feelings are not involved.

Sympathy is when you can actually feel their pain.

This is exactly right.

And it is important because empathy is so uniquely helpful.