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  1. #91
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I find way more difficulty in "digging out" a trapped NF than an NT. Other NFs know how to cover their trail with me.
    thats really interesting. any idea why?

  2. #92
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by happy puppy View Post
    thats really interesting. any idea why?
    Well, like in the example of my ENTP friend, I can just see their hurt beetling all over them. Once, I was standing in a Wal-Mart - there was a bad storm outside. The building got struck by lightning. The lights browned out to near darkness, the floor bowed up and the ceiling warped inward. In the darkness, I saw blue lightning running down and across the pipes near the top of the walls.

    Weird analogy maybe, but to me NTs are like a building being struck by lightning. I see the electricity going everywhere.

    NFs are simply better able to choke down their hurt or hide it behind something or versed in denial because, let's face it, we've been trained from a young age that emotion or display thereof is contemptible. It's considered a sign of weakness. While I think NTs may fear their emotions more, I believe that NFs are more likely to hate their feelings and find them unacceptable.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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  3. #93
    Senior Member norepinephrine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    NFs are simply better able to choke down their hurt or hide it behind something or versed in denial because, let's face it, we've been trained from a young age that emotion or display thereof is contemptible. It's considered a sign of weakness.
    Wouldn't that depend, to a large degree, on the attitudes of those by whom one was raised? I can see some parents valuing and encouraging expressions of emotion where others might tend to quell them.

    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    While I think NTs may fear their emotions more, I believe that NFs are more likely to hate their feelings and find them unacceptable.
    Got you here - I'm intimidated by my emotions but I don't hate them, aside from the fact that they limit my ability to form coherent sentences.

  4. #94
    Senior Member substitute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trinity View Post

    So what does it take for someone to get you to open up? What role does fear of rejection play in your relationships (not just romantic ones)? And how is this linked to your self image?
    I don't know... some kind of external obligation like a hypocratic oath or the seal of the confessional, perhaps, so I can have confidence that it's not going to be the next "snigger over" material for the gang at the office - and even then...

    I think I have to be able to sense that they don't NEED me to, but would welcome it if I did. The pressure I feel when someone says they need me to, or they can't be happy, just exacerbates my fear of abandonment/rejection, and makes me clam up really tight.

    I'm not sure how it's linked to my self image. I think perhaps because of my unusual situation as regards my background with the identity crisis and utter communication breakdown that caused, my self image isn't such an issue, as is my confidence in my ability to a) accurately portray myself to others and b) trust others to perceive me correctly and not misjudge me.

    I have found that often, when I do try to open up, because it's unfamiliar territory and I might not be able to concentrate on both figuring out what I want to say and trying to say it, at the same time as considering the impact of my choice of words on the listener from their point of view... well, it often results in just increasing the misunderstanding. Nothing's more upsetting for me than being hated for something I'm not. I don't mind being hated as long as I know they've got me right - but so, so often, I get just misjudged and then a person takes an irrevocable disliking to me, and anything I try to say just makes matters worse.
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  5. #95
    nevermore lane777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Well, like in the example of my ENTP friend, I can just see their hurt beetling all over them. Once, I was standing in a Wal-Mart - there was a bad storm outside. The building got struck by lightning. The lights browned out to near darkness, the floor bowed up and the ceiling warped inward. In the darkness, I saw blue lightning running down and across the pipes near the top of the walls.

    Weird analogy maybe, but to me NTs are like a building being struck by lightning. I see the electricity going everywhere.

    NFs are simply better able to choke down their hurt or hide it behind something or versed in denial because, let's face it, we've been trained from a young age that emotion or display thereof is contemptible. It's considered a sign of weakness. While I think NTs may fear their emotions more, I believe that NFs are more likely to hate their feelings and find them unacceptable.
    Perhaps, because NF's deal with emotions regularly, they are more sensitive to their presence. And since emotion is not so commonplace in an NT's world, when it does finally appear, they miss it. They could be expressing emotion on the surface without even realizing it. So how could they conceal emotions they're not aware of?
    To die would be an awfully big adventure - Peter Pan

    INFJ ~ 4w5 sp/sx ~ RLOAI ~ Inclusion e/w=1/0 (Melancholy Compulsive) Control: e/w=0/6 (Supine) Affection: e/w=4/0 (Phlegmatic Melancholy)

  6. #96
    Senior Member NewEra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I *have* experienced a truly ridiculous and consistent amount of rejection over the course of my life, so it was more than a fear or possibility. I dealt with it by standing there and taking it right in the face, and then crawling off somewhere and crying until I couldn't cry anymore.

    People felt the need to "put [me] in [my] place". I never knew why. I was really very obedient and avoided conflict unless I was dragged into one. Someone would take one look at me, and suddenly want to start a land war. I mean teachers, principals, peers, strangers. I remember once in my hellhole of a school, this one awful guy (he went to prison ultimately, surprise surprise) told me just out of nowhere that X was so much better than me, would always be, and would always have more friends than me. She stood there laughing like he'd just said something adorable. (I hated her too.) They did that to several people. I knew exactly how to take that girl down, and take her down hard, but I never did. Nothing worse than a bully who's playing the martyr.

    What's strange is that when I was dealing with someone I *really* cared about, I wouldn't flinch. They could lose it and I'd just stand there. It was like hearing bullets flying past and not moving. Like go ahead and frikkin' fire away, I mean it, I'm not budging. You're gonna run out of ammo and then I'm coming over the wall...
    How come people would treat you this way and take advantage of you?

  7. #97
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by norepinephrine View Post
    Wouldn't that depend, to a large degree, on the attitudes of those by whom one was raised? I can see some parents valuing and encouraging expressions of emotion where others might tend to quell them.
    No doubt "nuture" has a great deal to do with it, though I have noticed an overarching theme of choking. Men are certainly the primary targets, but I got a load of that sort of thing aimed at me too. I saw other girls being told the same as well. Perhaps I was around a lot of mean people? (Very possible)



    Got you here - I'm intimidated by my emotions but I don't hate them, aside from the fact that they limit my ability to form coherent sentences.
    Yeah, I don't think many NFs feel intimidated by their feelings, as 24/7 conscious of them as we are made to be. We form a sort of guilty relationship with them and sneak around. I actually used to hate myself for showing any sort of strong emotion, good or bad, because I was reminded over and over to "control myself". There was someone there to say to a compliment "Don't get a big head, think too much of yourself" or to anger/frustration "That's unacceptable and a shame."

    I couldn't feel good or bad without someone jerking on the reins.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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  8. #98
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lane777 View Post
    Perhaps, because NF's deal with emotions regularly, they are more sensitive to their presence. And since emotion is not so commonplace in an NT's world, when it does finally appear, they miss it. They could be expressing emotion on the surface without even realizing it. So how could they conceal emotions they're not aware of?
    I know many NTs who are plenty apprised of their emotional state, but are loath to confront it or feel it fully like it's going to eat them.

    But you do make a point about some NTs not being self-aware of their feelings, and therefore miss them. I wasn't speaking of those NTs in my example. They wouldn't fit.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne View Post
    How come people would treat you this way and take advantage of you?
    They used to. I was raised in a very bad abusive environment. It went on for a very long time. I can't account for the levels of mistreatment, but they were my reality for years. It's not that way anymore.

    I somehow managed to be born into trouble.
    eNFJ 4w3 sx/so 468 tritype
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  9. #99
    We all got it comin' kid Delilah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I know many NTs who are plenty apprised of their emotional state, but are loath to confront it or feel it fully like it's going to eat them.
    They do eat us.
    *clinging to my face like a starfish of love* ....... PinkPiranha

  10. #100
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    I find way more difficulty in "digging out" a trapped NF than an NT. Other NFs know how to cover their trail with me.
    This is true, actually.

    Quote Originally Posted by PinkPiranha View Post
    Weird analogy maybe, but to me NTs are like a building being struck by lightning. I see the electricity going everywhere.
    The Fe lightning shadow!

    While I think NTs may fear their emotions more, I believe that NFs are more likely to hate their feelings and find them unacceptable.
    Srsly? That surprises me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Delilah View Post
    They do eat us.
    Not if we eat them first!!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

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