Feelers - learn to think(!)

[nanook]

as for functions: i say, you invite functions into your live by making room for them. this requires you to understand, how you use on-top-functions to prevent their opposites. you dont want to suppress on-top-functions but differentiate their content. their activity, their application, you stop them from acting absolutist, so that they become permeable to other functions. on-bottom-functions are not sympathetic to you. you fear them. you need to change the attitude, by differentiating your world view. they have their applications. those parts of the world, where they are supposed to be applied are real.

as for actual thinking (ie rationality, being effective, making sense): its mostly a matter of development, which is not very type related. we can talk about how we can access/activate our developed thinking, but we cant grow it deliberately. it's not a given sleeping potential in all cases or by all definitions.

as for your example about Se: that is just a random pattern match in your mind. you could call it Si. its true for everyone, that slapping oneself in the face, can wake one up. borderliners know best. (not me!)

 

[Lauren Ashley]

INFJ is thinking; Having Se as tertiary function...

Since when does INFJ has Se tertiary?

 

[entropie]

as for functions: i say, you invite functions into your live by making room for them. this requires you to understand, how you use on-top-functions to prevent their opposites. you dont want to suppress on-top-functions but differentiate their content. their activity, their application, you stop them from acting absolutist, so that they become permeable to other functions.

as for actual thinking: its mostly a matter of development, which is not very type related. we can talk about how we can access/activate our developed thinking, but we cant grow it deliberately. it's not a given sleeping potential in all cases or by all definitions.

as for your example about Se: that is just a random pattern match

See, I really love your wisdom. But what do you do with it in the real world ? I mean if you go out and have a general idea of what is going on, how can you be open for revolution or how is it at all possible to exist cause you have a general idea of whats going on and life itself, well life itself is pretty boring now.

Didnt you ever had the feeling of being dumb right now. Of being totally lineary thinking with no clue of humanity but absolute knowledge of general relativity ? I mean yea thats college football or nerdism, but its healthy, it keeps the brain from leaving you whacko

 

[lorkan]

Since when does INFJ has Se tertiary?

Asswhole

Now you made me feel unintelligent again, putting me right back to my feelings ;'(

 

[nightning]

When do you other feelers use your thinking process?

To answer my own question somewhat, I've gathered a bit information from 2 different feeler types: INFJ and ENFP.

INFJ is thinking; Having Se as auxiliar function, sensate activation is of utter importance. Using only Ti is hard and very energy-draining so being constantly tuned to the moment makes you stay focused. Just shake your head a bit, jump up and down, hit yourself on your cheeks and think to yourself that whoever pisses you off will get a taste of your fists. Look youself in the mirror and start talking to yourself, say anything (the more you say the more conscious you get of how you apear to others). This is important to get your Se up, you will automatically start using Ti with this approach.

ENFP is thinking(limited info); "Common, order goddamit!". You don't seek values, but truth instead. Doing valuable things will make you think, and doing them many times is necessary. Routines will make you disciplined and get an overhand in (contin...

What on earth are you talking about? That made very little sense...

There is nothing wrong with either INFJ or ENFP's thinking style. Problem isn't in the thought, but in the expression. Notice both types you've mentioned are N dominant. Ni for INFJ and Ne for ENFP. It's the translation from what in your mind (non-linear/relational) into linear sequential description that others can follow that is difficult. Essentially you have to hold that train of thought while you translate. Which means the more ideas you juggle, the worse this process gets.

The only thing that can help improve this is practice... practice translating sufficiently such that it doesn't take as much mental effort to do anymore.

 

[Lauren Ashley]

Asswhole

Now you made me feel unintelligent again, putting me right back to my feelings ;'(

Are you really serious with this thread? I thought it was a joke of some sort because of the language and the responses.

 

[entropie]

Are you really serious with this thread? I thought it was a joke of some sort because of the language and the responses.

To judge his thread by the responses is really dumb

 

[nanook]

To judge his thread by the responses is really dumb

you are drunk. i am sure she meant his own responses. or i am too intelligent.

 

[nanook]

But what do you do with it in the real world ?

impressing and thus stopping social service people from locking me into the same room with violent orks

for the rest of the reply that i have prepared in my notes:
i don't want to post it, because its waaaayyy of topic

 

[Lauren Ashley]

To judge his thread by the responses is really dumb

You're really dumb. I said the language and the responses. People respond to fluff with more fluff. I assumed the moderators were out taking a smoke break.

 

[Nyota]

Reading entropie and lorkan's responses are like reading my journal entries from when I was stoned. Lauren Ashley, I'm totally following you.

 

[lorkan]

nighting: It makes sence.

EDIT: "you have to hold that train of thought"

euhm examples of how to hold that train of thought, without using my examples?

EDIT 2: doh, you mentioned not to juggle ideas around.

Wich in practicality means (atleast for INFJ's) being tuned in the moment.

Ahh fuck it im tired as hell and pretty screwed ;o

 

[cascadeco]

Why is that?

Are you being serious? Because if INFJ= what you have described, as if it's impossibly difficult for INFJ's to actually use their thinking process (really, this goes for any F type..but that shouldn't even need to be said), then I can't relate to that at all. Which is why I said I must be INTJ then (half jokingly, but half serious too).

But maybe you titled the thread incorrectly. In any event, the approach in the OP definitely isn't applicable to all INFJ's/F's/etc.

 

[Snow Turtle]

Yeah. Reading the 1st OP... You pretty much conclude that someones on crack or this is a joke thread.

At one stage I was wondering whether this was the mysterious N talk that I couldn't grasp, but I'm glad to know that other Ns here think it's just random talk too.

 

[lorkan]

It's not random talk. Although what nighting makes the this quickfix technique useless (or does it....?). I just basically explained that to use thinking one has to tune in to the moment and do things at a faster rate. While nighting said that it wasn't necessary; you just have to concentrate on one strong imagination you have and analyze if it is true to what is actually happens around you. Anyway to actually understand what happens around you, you would still have to tune in to the moment.

(nighting: did I not get what you ment it?)

 

[nanook]

lorkan, if it comforts you, i am able to connect your arguments - follow you, see that you are serious. i just dont want to go there with you, because it's a too simple approach for a too broad topic. you seem to underestimate how different people of one type are, in terms of habits, psychological conditioning, development of mind, pathologies like ADHS....
plus there have been similar topics.

 

[lorkan]

lorkan, if it comforts you, i am able to connect your arguments - follow you, see that you are serious. i just dont want to go there with you, because it's a too simple approach for a too broad topic. you seem to underestimate how different people of one type are, in terms of habits, psychological conditioning, development of mind, pathologies like ADHS....
plus there have been similar topics.

Well I can't really think about all the things at once. This just interested me.

 

[nanook]

when someone asks me a question about how my very personal position about something is, i actually like to pressure the side of my middle finger vertically over my "third eye" (just saying, do describe the location). like when you shield your eyes from the sun, with the hand, but discretely bend the middle finger down. this helps me to get a clearer vision/internal image, but maybe also a feeling. maybe it reminds me of a shape, and thus strengthens a boundary of awareness, between self/subject and other/objects.

the human brain is a real nutjob. if it's broken, eating veggies, fish, meditating, and doing body building (yes!) have been proven to help. Ayurveda can balance your chi. but then you do all of that and it does not work for you because you have some kind of unknown stomach shroom infection. and dr house doesn't actually exist. so, you end up desperate enough to slap yourself in the face, every five minutes. like when you put toothpaste on herpes. or cut it out with a knife.

i cant see how such tricks are type related. except, i would guess, that some of the wisdoms that other types come up with, can be applied to us as well, if there is a need.

emotional freedom technique might be of interest for you, ... i mean to decrease emotional distractions, like perfectionism ...maybe

 

[Kyrielle]

When do you other feelers use your thinking process?

To answer my own question somewhat, I've gathered a bit information from 2 different feeler types: INFJ and ENFP.

INFJ is thinking; Having Se as auxiliar function, sensate activation is of utter importance. Using only Ti is hard and very energy-draining so being constantly tuned to the moment makes you stay focused. Just shake your head a bit, jump up and down, hit yourself on your cheeks and think to yourself that whoever pisses you off will get a taste of your fists. Look youself in the mirror and start talking to yourself, say anything (the more you say the more conscious you get of how you apear to others). This is important to get your Se up, you will automatically start using Ti with this approach.

In the INFJ model, Se is the inferior function. Fe is the auxilary function. Using "Ti" (assuming you use it as will) is not difficult or energy-draining. Being constantly tuned in to the moment is difficult and energy-draining! Doing physical things, bringing myself into the moment, does nothing for me to make me start thinking critically. If anything, it shoves other functions to the backburner so I can think intuitively (meaning, just let things turn themselves over and meander about in the background of my head). Se brings about Ni again. The two work in tandem. Much like a dance.

Anyway, if you're implying increasing your ability to think critically, then being in the moment sort of negates that process, no? It's withdrawing that increases and reserves energy for thinking critically (which is what I assume when you say "learn to think") as sensory input is usually very distracting.

 

[entropie]

You're really dumb. I said the language and the responses. People respond to fluff with more fluff. I assumed the moderators were out taking a smoke break.

ok chief