are your type-related "harmless jokes" really as funny as you think?

[Chris_in_Orbit]

You're one of the many, many INTPs on this list, Tallulah? Do you get insulting personal comments sent to you (or read insulting comments posted) almost every day you log in regarding your type preferences? No? I thought not. Since you say you've seen the sort of stuff I post, then you must know that I do not go around only preaching about "Sensor rights". It seems to me that the people who are telling me I'm too sensitive are all people who have popular type codes, and thus have a huge base of support to lean on. No wonder the lame insults feels a lot less annoying when they're directed your way.

I might feel like participating in more discussions if I felt this list were less about people making fun of each other's type codes and/or whining about how much they can't stand everyone of certain type codes. Yes, I do dislike pointless, lame insults posted for no other reason than that it amuses the person dishing it out, and I can't help feeling negatively towards the people who do that. I really wish they'd stop using type as a weapon and started using it more positively. If the insults they posted actually helped people grow and mature, that would be a great thing, but I don't see an awful lot of constructive criticism -- much less the witty variety.

Sarah

I understand this totally. Its really just about the majority. We are mostly INs so those types are just automatically normal. Well, they say the only way to understand a person is to walk in their shoes for a mile... This should be an interesting experiment for me.

 

[heart]

IMO, there is a distinct stereotype difference between the NFP and the SFP on the 'net.

Just saying.

There's nothing flattering about being told you're so emotional and fantasy prone you're good for nothing. In real life I've always put up with sensing types taking potshots at me for having N traits. I've learned to deal with it. It's just part of life. People tend to be uncomfortable and to dislike their opposite functions in others.

Still it is good that Sarah made the thread to talk about the issue.

 

[entropie]

I understand this totally. Its really just about the majority. We are mostly INs so those types are just automatically normal. Well, they say the only way to understand a person is to walk in their shoes for a mile... This should be an interesting experiment for me.

Can I watch ?

 

[Chris_in_Orbit]

Can I watch ?

5 dollars

 

[Usehername]

There's nothing flattering about being told your so emotional and fantasy prone you're good for nothing. In real life I've always put up with sensing types taking potshots at me for having N traits. I've learned to deal with it. It's just part of life.

And that sucks, Heart. Seriously.

I just don't see why a forum which exists to aid people in their ability to understand and value people different than them has to be like RL.

 

[Simplexity]

Well I personally think its fascinating to see just how different types interact and play a long. Being INTP conflict and disagreement is something I'm used to and it is especially great to observe it in forum dynamics. It makes a great study, I think you can learn a lot from these types of discussions. More so than reading any book or studying any type profile or function preference.

 

[Dwigie]

You're one of the many, many INTPs on this list, Tallulah? Do you get insulting personal comments sent to you (or read insulting comments posted) almost every day you log in regarding your type preferences? No? I thought not. Since you say you've seen the sort of stuff I post, then you must know that I do not go around only preaching about "Sensor rights". It seems to me that the people who are telling me I'm too sensitive are all people who have popular type codes, and thus have a huge base of support to lean on. No wonder the lame insults feels a lot less annoying when they're directed your way.

I might feel like participating in more discussions if I felt this list were less about people making fun of each other's type codes and/or whining about how much they can't stand everyone of certain type codes. Yes, I do dislike pointless, lame insults posted for no other reason than that it amuses the person dishing it out, and I can't help feeling negatively towards the people who do that. I really wish they'd stop using type as a weapon and started using it more positively. If the insults they posted actually helped people grow and mature, that would be a great thing, but I don't see an awful lot of constructive criticism -- much less the witty variety.

Sarah

I feel for you. I actually am a wannabe sensor, I scored esfj because they just sound like amazingly nice people from the descriptions but it turns out I didn't quite make it (I try so hard to seem like a practical person in real life but I can't manage my lunch money to save my life.).
I definitely sense that strange contempt for S types labeled as complete airheads overly sexual and extremely "materialistic/dumb", let's be honest here. I value the qualities associated with S types a lot, it sucks that most people don't around here.
(the least popular type on the forum from the vibe I'm getting are ESXJs)
I think however that type bias is never going to end, it's human nature to stereotype.(See just by saying I like esfjs it's like I'm stereotyping,I only know 2 of them and a few fluffy descriptions...)
Types are like brands now :"what are you wearing?INTJ!It's so cool"
Or "Infp/j: I'm so deep.*faints dramatically and breaks into random convulsions of a pain so profound that human understanding is not sufficient.Especially not "s" sympathy .
I first felt it with the F/T wars if we can call that a war.
Keep "fighting".
It's so true what you said though: I never hear a lot XXSX complain about Ns except when it's about the contempt the Ns feel for them(some), very ironic.

 

[entropie]

And that sucks, Heart. Seriously.

I just don't see why a forum which exists to aid people in their ability to understand and value people different than them has to be like RL.

Guess that's some sort of Extroverted Intuition thing. There is no thing as forum, RealLife or VirtualLife. There are just people. And what people lack to show in (Reallife) you yourself have in your imagination.

 

[heart]

And that sucks, Heart. Seriously.

I just don't see why a forum which exists to aid people in their ability to understand and value people different than them has to be like RL.

Part of the culture here that develops is N types finding other N types and it is hard to avoid comiserating about having felt out of step in the S dominated world out there or having had trouble dealing with S type mentality or being misunderstood by them.

Many people here have had damaging relationships with other types and they tend to vent about that.

People come to MBTI to understand interactions, yes that's true, but a complicating factor is that conflict and dysfunction may have been strong motivating factors to seek that kind of understanding. People here are at all different places in their healing over that.

I am not saying it is an excuse or anything, I am just saying that is the reality of the situation as it exists. This forum is always going to have a very INTP flavor as opposed to say INFP Global. It's just the way it is. I come here because I find value in that flavor.

I don't particularly enjoy the negative comments about Feelers from the Ts but I have to realize their comments are reality, if I ask them to shut up, they will still be thinking the same thoughts. But being able to read their comments gives me a view into their true perception of Feeling and I can then see where they are being biased because of their own relationships and their own relationship with self and I can see where there is truth in what they say.

Both give me valuable knowdlege about human experience and conflict. I can learn all of this without hurtful conflict with the people close to me in offline life. I can have conflict with people on one thread and come to agreement on another, it isn't as serious as offline life and so rapid growth and understanding can take place so even when truth hurts online, it can be valuable. I personally don't want to see gag orders placed on others.

I'd rather see the ugly conflicts and come to understand them than sweep them under the carpet.

 

[Chris_in_Orbit]

Well, in some ways, this forum is set up all wrong. Why was it made so that we see each person's type by their posts?

 

[entropie]

Well, in some ways, this forum is set up all wrong. Why was it made so that we see each person's type by their posts?

you look at boobs before you post ? I do too !

 

[Usehername]

@Heart:

If this forum is more conducive to Ns who have felt out of place finding a home, that makes me happy. But this is MBTIc. It's not INTP/INFP/XXXX central.

Just like you could go somewhere where it's "Sense"less (ha!) to meet your needs of identifying with other Ns who feel unvalued IRL, Sarah could go find an ISFP hangout (or make one?).

This place, in truth, is only like INTPc because it literally jumped of INTPc and it's still young. We're getting more and more varied type members weekly. This is MBTIc. Every type is valued equally in theory here, but it's not in practice.

I'm not saying you (or anyone else) should leave to get your needs met somewhere where only Ns hang out, only that your value is not more (and also no less) important than Sarah's.

I want both of you to have your needs met. I hate any situation that isn't win-win.

 

[Totenkindly]

...I am not saying it is an excuse or anything, I am just saying that is the reality of the situation as it exists. This forum is always going to have a very INTP flavor as opposed to say INFP Global. It's just the way it is. I come here because I find value in that flavor.

Actually, it was far more Fe-oriented when it began, when we broke off from INTPc in May 2007. It was supposed to be a "safer" place than INTPc for many of the F types who were left feeling uncomfortable there. We have a bit of bias with more NT people on staff because of our heritage, but we have actively tried to downplay that and bring out more mods representing other approaches, as best as we can.

There has been a recent influx of NT-oriented members over the last few months, resulting in some of the friction here recently. Obviously I like NT flavor, but I'm also very very aware of how disruptive it can be... especially with the typical NT's "everyone for themselves" mentality and insensitivity to how their comments and behavior across time can come across to people who work very differently from them.

Yes, this isn't INFPgc. We have to remember it's supposed to have all flavors of voices here, however... and if some voices naturally drown out or drive off others, that's not what we want and something will have to change.

...I don't particularly enjoy the negative comments about Feelers from the Ts but I have to realize their comments are reality, if I ask them to shut up, they will still be thinking the same thoughts. But being able to read their comments gives me a view into their true perception of Feeling and I can then see where they are being biased because of their own relationships and their own relationship with self and I can see where there is truth in what they say.

Actually, I need to backtrack, and so do you, I think, to a degree.

I don't think the gist of the OP was about the broader forum dynamics and letting T's have the right to speak their minds. It really was about someone who's just getting tired of getting "jokes" putting her down because she's a Sensor and a Feeler, and like has been said elsewhere, that's a tact/consideration issue regardless of what type you are.

Basically, she told everyone she doesn't take them as jokes anymore. So stop sending them to her.

 

[Usehername]

I guess heart meant MBTIc to be a place for people to talk about things they cant talk about in daily life. And it is for some people.

I hope you can tolerate us, even if we are misplaced

I like ya, ENtropie!

I just want everyone to play nice. I don't mind a full-on NT conversation myself but I do mind when people are disrespected or devalued. Types are displayed. We run into individual members regularly. Take in information accordingly and adapt your interaction. (Not "you," just people.)

Anyone who doesn't do this IRL is seen as socially inept. This is MBTIc, it's not INTPc with a different standard by its very nature, and thus I am frequently flabbergasted by people who seem to be unable to transfer their claimed RL social skills onto MBTIc because people here all know type.

 

[Tigerlily]

There's nothing flattering about being told you're so emotional and fantasy prone you're good for nothing. In real life I've always put up with sensing types taking potshots at me for having N traits. I've learned to deal with it. It's just part of life. People tend to be uncomfortable and to dislike their opposite functions in others.

Still it is good that Sarah made the thread to talk about the issue.

I grew up with my mother always thinking I was so weird and to this day she still says, "when I was your age I didn't think about those things." She's ISFJ by the way. I wish she would think of "those" things a bit more often b/c the way things are looking, we'll be stuck with her broke ass as I have no one to pawn her off on or at the very least help out.

I see both yours and Lullahs sides as well as Sarah's, shit I even see what the NT's are whimpering on about. Sarah still has the opportunity to express herself here and by doing so she may gain a better insight into who she is. If you look you will find something in any thread. Even one about what kind of socks you prefer to wear. I like ankle socks.

 

[heart]

@Heart:

If this forum is more conducive to Ns who have felt out of place finding a home, that makes me happy. But this is MBTIc. It's not INTP/INFP/XXXX central.

Just like you could go somewhere where it's "Sense"less (ha!) to meet your needs of identifying with other Ns who feel unvalued IRL, Sarah could go find an ISFP hangout (or make one?).

This place, in truth, is only like INTPc because it literally jumped of INTPc and it's still young. We're getting more and more varied type members weekly. This is MBTIc. Every type is valued equally in theory here, but it's not in practice.

I'm not saying you (or anyone else) should leave to get your needs met somewhere where only Ns hang out, only that your value is not more (and also no less) important than Sarah's.

I want both of you to have your needs met. I hate any situation that isn't win-win.

First off, if people are regularly sending Sarah rep comments and PM remarking negatively on sensing, that's pretty lame and I can see how that would be irritating.

But here's the flip side as far as the board as a whole goes: Should Ts no longer be able to complain about the things they don't like about Fs and vice-versa? Will people still be allowed to make negative stereotype comments about Ns? Is this only going to be special protection for Sensor's feelings?

Is it more important to have a fluffy warm "win-win" atomosphere or to hear people's truth and to bear under their real feelings, thoughts and impressions?

Would you have it also censored in the private NT, NF, SP and SJ forums as well?

 

[entropie]

I like ya, ENtropie!

I just want everyone to play nice. I don't mind a full-on NT conversation myself but I do mind when people are disrespected or devalued. Types are displayed. We run into individual members regularly. Take in information accordingly and adapt your interaction. (Not "you," just people.)

Anyone who doesn't do this IRL is seen as socially inept. This is MBTIc, it's not INTPc with a different standard by its very nature, and thus I am frequently flabbergasted by people who seem to be unable to transfer their claimed RL social skills onto MBTIc because people here all know type.

ok . If this were INTPc I would gonna kill myself

 

[Usehername]

First off, if people are regularly sending Sarah rep comments and PM remarking negatively on sensing, that's pretty lame and I can see how that would be irritating.

But here's the flip side as far as the board as a whole goes: Should Ts no longer be able to complain about the things they don't like about Fs and vice-versa? Will people still be allowed to make negative stereotype comments about Ns? Is this only going to be special protection for Sensor's feelings?

Is it more important to have a fluffy warm "win-win" atomosphere or a to hear people's truth?

Would you have it also censored in the private NT, NF, SP and SJ forums as well?

?

I said information should be exchanged with a recognition of the fact that we value all types equally here, as it is MBTIc. No one should censor their opinions or perspectives but they should present them in a respectful manner that doesn't devalue anyone because of their type.

 

[Tallulah]

You're one of the many, many INTPs on this list, Tallulah? Do you get insulting personal comments sent to you (or read insulting comments posted) almost every day you log in regarding your type preferences? No? I thought not. Since you say you've seen the sort of stuff I post, then you must know that I do not go around only preaching about "Sensor rights". It seems to me that the people who are telling me I'm too sensitive are all people who have popular type codes, and thus have a huge base of support to lean on. No wonder the lame insults feels a lot less annoying when they're directed your way.

I might feel like participating in more discussions if I felt this list were less about people making fun of each other's type codes and/or whining about how much they can't stand everyone of certain type codes. Yes, I do dislike pointless, lame insults posted for no other reason than that it amuses the person dishing it out, and I can't help feeling negatively towards the people who do that. I really wish they'd stop using type as a weapon and started using it more positively. If the insults they posted actually helped people grow and mature, that would be a great thing, but I don't see an awful lot of constructive criticism -- much less the witty variety.

Sarah

Yeah, this board has a lot of INTPs. There are lots of lame jokes about INTPs and INTJs being robotic, coldhearted, social losers. They don't bother me, because a) it's still kinda funny if said in the right way, and b) I can choose whether or not I think it applies to me. I'm not saying you have to love the lame jokes, or that you don't have a point that they're made way too often. But I do think you could realize that probably the people who are making those lame jokes to you are showing you their acceptance, and are trying to be cute in their own way. Give them the benefit of the doubt, rather than just seeing it as the deeply-ingrained bias that proves that we're not where we should be in this world, etc. You're a lot more likely, btw, to get people to see your point, if you befriend them first and then say, "hey, dude, you know those sensor jokes are lame, right?"

Part of the culture here that develops is N types finding other N types and it is hard to avoid comiserating about having felt out of step in the S dominated world out there or having had trouble dealing with S type mentality or being misunderstood by them.

Many people here have had damaging relationships with other types and they tend to vent about that.

People come to MBTI to understand interactions, yes that's true, but a complicating factor is that conflict and dysfunction may have been strong motivating factors to seek that kind of understanding. People here are at all different places in their healing over that.

I am not saying it is an excuse or anything, I am just saying that is the reality of the situation as it exists. This forum is always going to have a very INTP flavor as opposed to say INFP Global. It's just the way it is. I come here because I find value in that flavor.

I don't particularly enjoy the negative comments about Feelers from the Ts but I have to realize their comments are reality, if I ask them to shut up, they will still be thinking the same thoughts. But being able to read their comments gives me a view into their true perception of Feeling and I can then see where they are being biased because of their own relationships and their own relationship with self and I can see where there is truth in what they say.

Both give me valuable knowdlege about human experience and conflict. I can learn all of this without hurtful conflict with the people close to me in offline life. I can have conflict with people on one thread and come to agreement on another, it isn't as serious as offline life and so rapid growth and understanding can take place so even when truth hurts online, it can be valuable. I personally don't want to see gag orders placed on others.

I'd rather see the ugly conflicts and come to understand them than sweep them under the carpet.

All this is true. And I will also add as a personal observation that the threads that NTs start talking trash about feelers in their personal forum are 99% yanking y'all's chain and amusing ourselves, and yet I've noticed a lot of the NFs kinda still take them personally when talking about them in their own personal forums. It's just sort of a language difference or something. There's a lot more affection behind them than y'all know.

 

[Jae Rae]

I'm not saying you have to love the lame jokes, or that you don't have a point that they're made way too often. But I do think you could realize that probably the people who are making those lame jokes to you are showing you their acceptance and are trying to be cute in their own way.

Like dipping her braids in the inkwell?