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  1. #1
    brainheart
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    Default Oh my god I'm a self pres four

    I got the book The Complete Enneagram yesterday by Beatrice Chestnut. She's a follower of Naranjo. In her book she expands on his work and goes further in depth into the subtypes. It's a really insightful great read that I recommend to everyone who is interested in the enneagram. Anyway, I innocently started reading the self pres four description this morning. One and a half pages in I started wailing, and I mean wailing. I cried for at least half an hour, the hardest I've cried in years. I could barely breathe.

    I am not a crier. I will want to cry and it doesn't happen. And this did it. It triggered something extremely deep within me that I have been avoiding, I guess.

    Crap.


    I will go into further detail about the four subtypes if people would like, but I would suggest just going out and getting the book. I checked it out at the library.

  2. #2
    Sniffles
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    Interesting, will have to look at this. What are some of the main points addressed in the description for self-preservation types?

  3. #3
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
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    Shh no more tears. Only type now.

  4. #4
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Please do share. I believe I'm most likely an sp/sx. I'd like to hear what connected for you.

  5. #5
    brainheart
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    @Peguy and @Qlip, it's really long but I'll do my best. I think different things will resonate for different self pres fours. In other words, it's not all going to necessarily fit. But the things that fit... well, it ugh...


    Self pres fours communicate their envy and suffering to others less than the other subtypes. They are more stoic and don't talk about their suffering much.

    They strive to get what they long for. But whatever they get never feels like enough.

    Less likely to communicate sensitivity, suffering, shame or envy even though they feel them just as deeply as the other fours. They swallow a lot without complaining. Endurance is a virtue.

    Suffer in silence. This is how they think they will be redeemed and earn love. Make a virtue of toughing out difficulties without talking about them in the hopes that others will see this and admire them for it, thereby helping them to meet their needs. Bear a lot of suffering and frustration through internalization.

    Very self-demanding. Develop an ability to do without. Test and challenge themselves. They don't allow themselves the experience of living in or from their fragility.

    A humanitarian with an empathetic and nurturing disposition, self pres fours are sensitive to the needy. This is how they project their pain outward, addressing it through others' suffering instead of talking about their own. They try to take care of others' pain so they don't have to fully deal with their own suffering.

    More masochistic than melodramatic. Masochism is the ego strategy for getting love. Devalue themselves in important ways. Want to be seen as strong and resilient. This stems from their childhood desire for their parents to see them as a person who doesn't complain, and is a good child because they don't ask for much.

    They may make efforts to get what they need and want while simultaneously unconsciously working against themselves. (One form of masochism.) And so:

    Impulsive/not impulsive; desire to be happy but then make themselves unhappy; focus on improving and dealing with problems/postpone actions that would make this happen; Wear self out by seeking and striving in areas they know they will fail, which will ensure the perpetuation of a cycle of effort and devaluation. Ambitious, but deny and work against ambitions.

    May resemble a one or three in focus on self-sufficiency, autonomy, working hard, but will be more emotional, even if they don't express it externally. Also, they will thwart their own efforts vs actually achieving like the three would.

    Can also look like a type seven because they express a need to be light. May display the high energy characteristics of sevens, and may have a need for fun/playfulness as an escape from having to do tough things all the time. May appear less melancholy for this reason than other fours, a little more sunny and lighthearted.
    Likes DulcetRefrain liked this post

  6. #6
    Sniffles
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    Thank you @brainheart. Yes there's much I can very much relate to, especially the stoic aspect and the difficulty opening up to others about the deep pain I'm feeling. It's especially hard doing that out in public, where I feel utterly exposed and vulnerable. If I do open up it's usually one-on-one with somebody I can trust they will listen and understand. Even then, a certain level of trust and rapport has to be built up, so I become comfortable telling anybody about such. In part because there is a sense of shame of me feeling hurt or sad about something, when I think it shouldn't bother me but it does. So there's a feeling of embarrassment over how I'm feeling in it or itself.

    I don't know how related this is, but a few impressions I got from reading what you post. I can understand how it could make you cry.

  7. #7
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Thank you. Yes there's much I can relate to, especially the stoic aspect and the difficulty opening up to others about the pain I'm feeling. It's especially hard doing that out in public, where I feel utterly exposed. If I do open up it's usually one-on-one with somebody I can trust or sense will listen and understand.
    Yes, exactly. That's the only time that I do. Or on here, because none of you are real.

  8. #8
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    @brainheart Oh yes, that's very powerful. I've read similar descriptions. Furthermore 4 sp/sxes can appear sx, because of the strange efforts they take to throw themselves in dangerous situations to test themselves, and for the measures they'll take to protect their visions, not necessarily their person.

  9. #9
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    @brainheart Oh yes, that's very powerful. I've read similar descriptions. Furthermore 4 sp/sxes can appear sx, because of the strange efforts they take to throw themselves in dangerous situations to test themselves, and for the measures they'll take to protect their visions, not necessarily their person.
    Yes, which is likely why I thought I was sx/sp, even though I rarely make others suffer and always make myself do so.

  10. #10
    Sniffles
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    Is there anything about Sp/So by any chance? Supposedly we're the most stoic(or strive to be the most stoic) of the self-preservation Fours.

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