User Tag List

Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 120

Thread: Ask a CP6...

  1. #31

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    Sure thing.

    I initially mistyped as being "not much of anything". On another forum I mistyped as 6 because I had no idea wtf else I could be, even though I didn't much identify with the descriptions. That was OK, I was told. Sixes don't see themselves as sixes and are unaware of their own issues (lol).

    When I complained months later that I STILL didn't see myself as being a 6, many counterphobics commiserated that most 6 descriptions are incredibly condescending and have led to incredible fallacies being spread about the type (cp6s are "wannabe 8s", cp6s are posers, and a bunch of other bullshit). Yet, I've also heard reports that many 6s have read the descriptions and known without a doubt that that's their core type.

    So I guess I'm wondering what your own experience has been on that, beyond just finding it "vague" (which I kind of agree with, given the variegation of the type).

    As to me, I'm a core 4w5. If I'm not that, I'm a 8. Haven't found a better explanation than tritype for how it is I sit between two opposite forces (unless I go back to being a 6, of course).
    Yes, it all seems very stupid:

    I think I'm a six.
    Agreed, you're a six.
    Well, actually, I don't think I am.
    That just makes you more of a six.

    Anyway, I agree that six in many ways seems lame. Phobics are cowardly victims, counterphobics are the overcompensating bullies. We're also known as the sheep, the company man, the spineless bureaucrat, and that neurotic guy who's always whining about stuff. The NAZIS are often associated with e6 as well. I can see why people might resist identifying as 6.

    That being said, I've never been a person who relates to positive descriptions. After all, 6's tend to gravitate to the problematic and are generally very aware of their own shortcomings. Besides, I'm a firm believer that if you're not a little uncomfortable reading your type description, then it's probably not your type. They're not supposed to be desirable profiles.

    However, when I am looking for a more desirable embodiment of 6ish traits, I look to all the great 6 comedians like: Louis C.K., George Carlin, Woody Allen, Bill Burr, Jon Stewart, Bill Hicks (maybe), Richard Pryor (maybe). I dunno if they're all 6's, but that's sort of the overall picture I get.

  2. #32
    Rainy Day Woman Array MDP2525's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,131

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    Sure thing.

    I initially mistyped as being "not much of anything". On another forum I mistyped as 6 because I had no idea wtf else I could be, even though I didn't much identify with the descriptions. That was OK, I was told. Sixes don't see themselves as sixes and are unaware of their own issues (lol).

    When I complained months later that I STILL didn't see myself as being a 6, many counterphobics commiserated that most 6 descriptions are incredibly condescending and have led to incredible fallacies being spread about the type (cp6s are "wannabe 8s", cp6s are posers, and a bunch of other bullshit). Yet, I've also heard reports that many 6s have read the descriptions and known without a doubt that that's their core type.

    So I guess I'm wondering what your own experience has been on that, beyond just finding it "vague" (which I kind of agree with, given the variegation of the type).

    As to me, I'm a core 4w5. If I'm not that, I'm a 8. Haven't found a better explanation than tritype for how it is I sit between two opposite forces (unless I go back to being a 6, of course).
    Ok. I tested as 5, 7 and 8 quite frequently. I never got six as a test result when I was taking these tests. So take that for what it's worth. I really think 6's should be divided into two types and have two separate profiles. Anyway, I felt strongly 5 or 8. Like I was perfectly halfway between these two types. Do you feel like half of two types? Have you looked into 5w6(cp)? CP6 can have a lot of "relatableness" with 4's.

    I will do some research and try to find some threads with good descriptions.

    The six profile is mainly a phobic profile. Which is why I did not read up on it and probably why I didn't test is a six. For some reason, the test does not do good job of differentiating six counterphobia and eight normal behavior. It may catch the emotional reactivity (4) or aggressiveness (8). Mainly because the motivation behind the behavior is different but the behavior could look exactly alike. Add the fact that CP sixes aren't aware of fear being a driving force (they may be in denial of it even when faced) and you have a recipe for enneagram confusion. I love what @Forever_Jung said, that when reading your profile you should feel discomfort.

    What is it about the four description that you relate to? Is this 100% for you?
    ~Live and learn from fools and from sages~




    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance

  3. #33
    Riva
    Guest

    Default

    What drives c6s to be so argumentative. When i mean argumentative i mean arguing over the simplest thing, with the closest of all people, over points made that weren't even made to offend or disagree?

    Do you ever feel that you take things too seriously when you get involved in the kind of scenarios explained above?

    Is it normal for c6s to imagine things to prove a point. I am not talking of scenarios where if you don't prove your point you'd get shot in your head.

    Do/would you lie to prove a point.

    Do you constantly feel stress?

    Do you ever think you crossed the limit in going bat shit crazy over another and have you ever apologized or would you?

    If you get to be any other personality type what would you choose to be. It doesn't necessarity have to be a type you admire.

    What do you think of e7s? (Try not to say that they all party too much.) Do you think e7s and e9s take things too lightly?

    Are you conservative when it comes to sex? Do you find it hard to intimately bond with another due to your anxieties? Do you find it hard to simply seek sex?

    Do you fuss ober the simplest things and are you people ever satisfied with things?

  4. #34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    What drives c6s to be so argumentative. When i mean argumentative i mean arguing over the simplest thing, with the closest of all people, over points made that weren't even made to offend or disagree?
    Well I'm not ALWAYS like that, but I certainly am like this at times. Usually it's like a weird reaction to reassert my autonomy, my separateness from them. When I feel totally safe, I get kind of gooey and nineish and sort of melt into people, it's like I fall asleep.

    Then I sort of snap out of it, and push people back. One of my exes used to think I was bipolar because I alternated between being a cuddly/receptive and confrontational/distant. I am also obsessed with clarity, and don't intend my disagreement/nitpicking to be upsetting. I just think I'm spelling things out and being helpful.

    Do you ever feel that you take things too seriously when you get involved in the kind of scenarios explained above?
    Petty arguments? Yes, I think I do think I get too serious.

    Is it normal for c6s to imagine things to prove a point. I am not talking of scenarios where if you don't prove your point you'd get shot in your head.

    Do/would you lie to prove a point.
    Erm, not sure I know what you mean. I don't see how lying would prove anything. Don't get me wrong, I imagine things, but I don't do it to prove a point. I do it to make sure I am aware of bad things that might happen to me. Perhaps I misunderstand your question.

    Do you constantly feel stress?
    Unless I'm at home in my pyjamas, I'm probably stressed. If I am actively engaging with the world, especially with unfamiliar people in an unfamiliar context, I tend to be uncomfortable. Every new person I meet is a ticking time bomb that needs defusing. Humour helps me immensely in this respect. I'm also constantly bracing myself for muggers, when I'm on the street.

    Do you ever think you crossed the limit in going bat shit crazy over another and have you ever apologized or would you?
    I am quick to apologize, because I realize I'm usually fighting an invisible enemy in the first place. But I've never done anything "bat shit crazy", IMO. The craziest I get is calling up my friends to make sure we're still friends (although I've learned to conceal this purpose, because it makes them uncomfortable). I used to project my hypersensitivity and imagination onto my friends, so I was always paranoid I had offended them. I'm a little more grounded and mature these days though.

    If you get to be any other personality type what would you choose to be. It doesn't necessarity have to be a type you admire.
    I'd like to be a 5. I envy their ability to detach.

    What do you think of e7s? (Try not to say that they all party too much.) Do you think e7s and e9s take things too lightly?
    They seem naive to me. To me the 9's approach to life is like taking a nap on a battlefield. 7's remind me of the hyperactive toddler that chases their ball out into the middle of a busy intersection. And when I dive into traffic and save them, they just giggle at me for being so worked up.
    Are you conservative when it comes to sex? Do you find it hard to intimately bond with another due to your anxieties? Do you find it hard to simply seek sex?
    I'm a bit messed up in regards to sex, but it's more of an experience thing than it is a 6 thing. Before some shitty things happened though, I remember finding it a bit tricky, to completely give myself to another person. I definitely have some intimacy issues.

    Do you fuss ober the simplest things and are you people ever satisfied with things?
    I fear satisfaction/complacency, but I have my moments of contentment. When I'm satisfied, it's almost Edenic, but like Eden, it doesn't last forever.

    One of my friends often laments: Why can't you just accept that I care about you, and that will never change?

    And while I know what she's getting at, I can't help but think: people always say forever, people always say their feelings won't change. But they do. How can I accept that which I know to be patently false? How can I build my sense of security on a faulty foundation?

  5. #35
    Rainy Day Woman Array MDP2525's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,131

    Default

    [QUOTE=Riva;2192045]What drives c6s to be so argumentative. When i mean argumentative i mean arguing over the simplest thing, with the closest of all people, over points made that weren't even made to offend or disagree?

    Ok. So, it may be the way you are phrasing things. Something I've noticed lurking on the forum and please - absolutely no offense is meant! I'm only trying to explain possible CP6 behavior. I'm not to judge it right or wrong but I have come across your posts and a lot of times they hit me as argumentative, even if, to you, they may just be inquisitive or challenging. So that naturally, kicks in the "defense" of a CP6.

    ENTJ can have a naturally aggressive style of communication but it's the sureness in what they are saying, even if they may be just "stating the facts as they see it" that can just hit that CP6 button. Immediately, they think "No that's not correct/You don't have all the facts to say that yet/You aren't leaving room for the other POV/How can you know/ etc. Long story short, you may be unknowingly pushing their buttons. Or your natural interaction style may do that as well.


    Do you ever feel that you take things too seriously when you get involved in the kind of scenarios explained above?

    Probably not. Mainly because if we are engaging you, we are either defending our POV as equally viable or trying to maintain consistency by correction.

    Is it normal for c6s to imagine things to prove a point. I am not talking of scenarios where if you don't prove your point you'd get shot in your head.

    In that CP6's head, I doubt they see it like that. We can extrapolate the worst case scenario from a situation easily. We usually do not verbalize this but if we are then the CP6 is extremely stressed and feels backed into a corner.

    Do/would you lie to prove a point.

    I don't think this is type related. Depends upon the person.

    Do you constantly feel stress?

    I think this varies from 6 to 6. I personally, do not until I'm over the stress. In hindsight, I will see it. My friends and loved ones see it.

    Do you ever think you crossed the limit in going bat shit crazy over another and have you ever apologized or would you?

    I don't know very many CP6's who will not apologize when having wronged someone. I don't know what you mean by "bat shit crazy". Example?
    However, if that CP6 doesn't like you, hell will freeze over before they will give you one (normally the CP6 has already shut you out) or they may begrudgingly give one to restore peace to return things to running order. We like smooth running systems.


    If you get to be any other personality type what would you choose to be. It doesn't necessarity have to be a type you admire.

    Probably a 8w9 or 9w8.

    What do you think of e7s? (Try not to say that they all party too much.) Do you think e7s and e9s take things too lightly?

    My SO is E7. My best friend is E9. No, I don't think either takes things too lightly. I can see 7's anxiety subsequent distraction-to-forget and I can see 9's repression fairly easily. So different strokes, different folks. Each has a burden to bear.

    Are you conservative when it comes to sex? Do you find it hard to intimately bond with another due to your anxieties? Do you find it hard to simply seek sex?

    I don't think your first and third questions are type related. As for your second: Since most CP6's tend to be SX first, then I would say intimately bonding with someone is pretty much what we do. For how long that is, remains to be seen but I would look for more information about SX for your full answer on that. I would say that it parallels CP6 behavior with intimacy.

    Do you fuss ober the simplest things and are you people ever satisfied with things?

    A CP6 fussing over small, mundane shit is an over-stressed CP6 who feels their voice or contributions are not being actively considered or appreciated. Easy way to keep a CP6 calm or more manageable, is to notice what they do for you, and thank them for it. A more mature CP6 will know when to fuss and not to fuss. They will know what battles to pick.
    ~Live and learn from fools and from sages~




    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance

  6. #36
    Senior Member Array Sanjuro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    MBTI
    Ne
    Enneagram
    468 sx/so
    Socionics
    :-( None
    Posts
    815

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Forever_Jung View Post
    Yes, it all seems very stupid:

    I think I'm a six.
    Agreed, you're a six.
    Well, actually, I don't think I am.
    That just makes you more of a six.
    Oh God. Yes. YES.

    It's like:
    - I don't think I have an alcohol problem.
    - The first symptom of alcoholism is denying you have a problem.
    - But I don't drink alcohol.
    - PROOF OF DENIAL.

    I went through it all, loud and clear.

    Anyway, I agree that six in many ways seems lame. Phobics are cowardly victims, counterphobics are the overcompensating bullies. We're also known as the sheep, the company man, the spineless bureaucrat, and that neurotic guy who's always whining about stuff. The NAZIS are often associated with e6 as well. I can see why people might resist identifying as 6.

    That being said, I've never been a person who relates to positive descriptions. After all, 6's tend to gravitate to the problematic and are generally very aware of their own shortcomings. Besides, I'm a firm believer that if you're not a little uncomfortable reading your type description, then it's probably not your type. They're not supposed to be desirable profiles.
    Yeah, it should describe the things you've struggled with all your life, or the things that distinguish you from the rest. That tends to distinguish us more than our positive traits, which are often non-type specific. I disagree with some that it's necessarily a traumatic experience designed to reduce you to tears, but it should at least feel "weird" reading about your psychology on paper the first time!

    Anyway. Yeah, some 6 descriptions are, unfortunately, lame, and do not begin to cover the awesome (and evil) of which the type is capable. Also, it's funny Hitler and the Nazis are seen as 6ish...I've been reading Hitler's biography, and the dude was clearly a 4w3 (prolly 487 tritype--!).

    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    Ok. I tested as 5, 7 and 8 quite frequently. I never got six as a test result when I was taking these tests. So take that for what it's worth. I really think 6's should be divided into two types and have two separate profiles. Anyway, I felt strongly 5 or 8. Like I was perfectly halfway between these two types. Do you feel like half of two types? Have you looked into 5w6(cp)? CP6 can have a lot of "relatableness" with 4's.
    Yeah, I do feel like two types! I've considered being a 5 for a long time. I am definitely a reactive type, however, as opposed to a competency type. Cp6w5 would actually be a bit better! But for me, my core issues have really been around feeling different, feeling inferior/superior, being unable to make friends, longing for what I don't have...etc. Fives seem to lack that certain longing--they are detached from that desire.

    I will do some research and try to find some threads with good descriptions.

    The six profile is mainly a phobic profile. Which is why I did not read up on it and probably why I didn't test is a six. For some reason, the test does not do good job of differentiating six counterphobia and eight normal behavior. It may catch the emotional reactivity (4) or aggressiveness (8). Mainly because the motivation behind the behavior is different but the behavior could look exactly alike. Add the fact that CP sixes aren't aware of fear being a driving force (they may be in denial of it even when faced) and you have a recipe for enneagram confusion. I love what @Forever_Jung said, that when reading your profile you should feel discomfort.

    What is it about the four description that you relate to? Is this 100% for you?
    Thanks for your perspective!! This is actually what I've privately thought. I think if I were going to teach type 6 to a group, I would divide it into 2 (or even 3) separate profiles. It's a hard type to test for, that's for sure. You're also right that there's a major phobic bias in many descriptions, which naturally makes it difficult for a countertype to relate to. How are you supposed to see yourself in something you are designed to be in denial of???

    BTW, how would you differentiate 4ish emotionality, 6ish counterphobia, and 8ish aggression?

    As to me, again: Yeah. Just the issues I mentioned above. I also see the motivations of 3 and 5 at work within me, as well as a strong 1-connection. The 4-profiles aren't 100% me, because they draw in too much "poor hypersensitive lil me, I can't cope with life and need a savior" mentality, as well as too much prissiness. But--this is why I like tritype--every 8-fixed 4 I've spoken to has had the same difficulties in ascertaining type. The 4 descriptions are rather 9-biased, similar to 6 descriptions being phobic-biased.

    I've figured out ways the "not me" parts actually do apply to me, and it's a lot easier to make that work than it is for any other type! (I've been doing this about 14 years, fwiw).

  7. #37
    Rainy Day Woman Array MDP2525's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,131

    Default

    BTW, how would you differentiate 4ish emotionality, 6ish counterphobia, and 8ish aggression?
    @miss fortune can help with this as she is an 8 and can dinstinction between CP6 and 8 and we have talked privately about this and she had some good insight on differences.

    CP6's are good at looking at their fear and thinking its a challenge. Or being oblivious to fear but feeling compelled to overcome something. In this way, we can look bold and aggressive, in charge like an 8.

    8's are waaay more grounded than 6's though and this is important. Head vs Gut type. Both are defensive POV of the world.

    6's REACT to stimili and try to find security in *something outside ourselves* because we never learned to trust ourselves or others.

    8's (because of fear of vulnerability/rejection) learn to find it within.

    6's find it hard to trust ourselves. So we look to organizations, something bigger than us to trust in. We are outward bound. Always. We are least in touch with what WE want.

    Finding it difficult to rely on others, 8's learned to trust themselves. Inward bound.

    So, trust and vulnerability go hand in hand but 6's and 8's are flipped sides of the coin. 6's went outside for security and 8's go inward to find it.
    ~Live and learn from fools and from sages~




    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance
    Likes Cellmold, greenfairy, senza tema liked this post

  8. #38
    Rainy Day Woman Array MDP2525's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,131

    Default

    4's emotionality and 6 counterphobia differences

    4's basic underlying fear: that they have no identify or personal significance.

    CP6's do not focus on their identity like 4's. It's not a matter of authentic vs inauthentic self - rather - their fears dictate their behavior (as opposed to identity) but these can look like doppelgängers.

    Since anxiety and fear is ever present in a CP6 world (although mostly subconscious) we REACT to it. The reaction is emotional in nature. It can cause anger, and avoidance in the same way that spur's a 4 to reject an image that doesn't confirm to their pre-conceived standards of "who they are".

    Again, 4's like 8's have trouble with vulnerability but they withdraw from things that challenge their "idealized image" and generally surround themselves with reinforcements of that image.

    It is why so many 4's talk about feeling "defective" because the outside world may be in stark contrast to their inner self-image.

    Reconciling how they see themselves and how they interact with the world can be difficult but necessary to grow.

    6's motivations are entirely different.

    Individualism isn't even on their radar but their reaction to fear/anxiety can be similar to how a 4 looks in protecting their identity. Both are reactive types.

    6's want to *lessen* anxiety/fearful situations happening by heading them off at the pass. CP6's do this presumptively because they are so afraid of having to deal with fear/anxiety they not only have to be ready for "it" (phobic) they have to quell any sign of it starting!

    Think of matches and a gas can sitting on a bench.

    The phobic 6 will see these things and start looking for an extinguisher to make sure it is within reach. The smoke alarms are working. As long as they have these things checked off - they eased their anxiety/fear by preparation and it is smooth sailing.

    The CP6 will see matches and a gas can sitting next to each other and feel compelled to separate the two.

    (Just incase, because remeber when Johnny started that fire that one time and burnt his eyebrows? That was bad. That shouldn't happen again.) <---- anxiety grows!

    That CP6 doesn't even want to *deal* with the issues that *could* happen if some person came by and decided to start a fire. So let's make it so no one can just come by and do that by not leaving these things next to each other. <--- anxiety lessens

    6's can be very good troubleshooters with this recognition but can also over-engineer (unnecessary) mechanisms that waste time and effort.

    Inside a 6 is a lackadaisical, chill, 9. We integrate to 9. This is important.

    We relax and don't catastrophize. We let things play out.

    We trust ourselves and our abilities (deeper core issue of 6's) to handle things. We get a "grip" on fear.
    ~Live and learn from fools and from sages~




    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance
    Likes thoughtlost liked this post

  9. #39
    Senior(ita) Member Array Cloudpatrol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    2,250

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MDP2525 View Post
    I really think 6's should be divided into two types and have two separate profiles. Anyway, I felt strongly 5 or 8. Like I was perfectly halfway between these two types.

    CP6 can have a lot of "relatableness" with 4's.

    What a great thread! I hadn't seen it before. Very helpful perspectives. I agree that there should be clear descriptor's for both. Phobic 6's and CP 6's are ENTIRELY different in my experience

    I don't relate at all to Phobic 6's but I do see elements of 'same' between CP 6 and 4

    This vid really helped me in narrowing down a 6 in my life as it describes the manifestations of both:



    @Forever_Jung

    They seem naive to me. To me the 9's approach to life is like taking a nap on a battlefield. 7's remind me of the hyperactive toddler that chases their ball out into the middle of a busy intersection. And when I dive into traffic and save them, they just giggle at me for being so worked up.
    What do you recommend a 7 or 9 do in these situations to reassure the 6 that despite being easygoing, a capable and mindful attitude IS still present? What would be effective to say?
    Likes MDP2525 liked this post

  10. #40
    Rainy Day Woman Array MDP2525's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,131

    Default

    @Cloudpatrol

    As a 4, can you give some insight as to how you see CP6's in relation to your 4ness?
    ~Live and learn from fools and from sages~




    Shameless Self-Promotion:MDP2525's Den and the Start of Motorcycle Maintenance

Page 4 of 12 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. [INTJ] Ask an INTJ
    By logan235711 in forum The NT Rationale (ENTP, INTP, ENTJ, INTJ)
    Replies: 870
    Last Post: 05-22-2015, 05:04 AM
  2. Ask Me a Question
    By reason in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 113
    Last Post: 01-30-2009, 12:47 PM
  3. [ISTJ] Ask the ISTJ
    By RansomedbyFire in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 74
    Last Post: 10-18-2008, 02:01 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •