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  1. #21
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    an SP who has given up on everything in life can be pretty pathetic... I think you're underestimating here. I'm a repeat offender for drinking and driving, not anything more creative, but I should have been punished more harshly because I did that shit for YEARS before getting caught. Of course once I was caught I was completely desperate to get out of jail... that place fucked with my head... something about being locked in just flipped a switch in my brain and made me feel downright despondent.
    I guess I'm saying that an SP who's given up on themselves can be pretty selfish about their behavior in a pretty antisocial manner
    once again, this is textbook 7w8/8w7 (the Sp was probably one of the reasons you didn't get caught Self Preservation 7w8s and 8w7s are generally more strategic)
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  2. #22
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    once again, this is textbook 7w8/8w7 (the Sp was probably one of the reasons you didn't get caught Self Preservation 7w8s and 8w7s are generally more strategic)
    my subconscious is now strategic?

    to clarify, I drove blacked out for years... you'd probably have to be either law enforcement or an alcoholic to fully understand the implications of that though
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  3. #23
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    my subconscious is now strategic?
    to clarify, I drove blacked out for years... you'd probably have to be either law enforcement or an alcoholic to fully understand the implications of that though
    feel free to elaborate. I find stories like this fascinating (only if you're comfortable of course. it's not my place to pry if you'd rather not)
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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  4. #24
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    feel free to elaborate. I find stories like this fascinating (only if you're comfortable of course. it's not my place to pry if you'd rather not)
    a time period of which one has no memory... I had many occasions on which I woke up on my couch with my keys in my pocket when I last remembered being in a bar or at a party and I had no fucking clue how I'd gotten home except that I must have driven because I didn't know anyone there and my car was outside... it's kind of a creepy feeling. I went for years just reading the news to make sure I hadn't hit anyone on the way home, but somehow it never occurred to me to modify my behavior. Or maybe it did and it seemed too hard... one way or another, I didn't change things until it was going to cost me a few things that I wasn't willing to lose

    Of course I remember driving home drunk on plenty of occasions as well... or to taco bell... we're talking 60+ mile drives in which I was still so wasted when I got back into town that I had to remind myself that I should move the steering wheel so that I wouldn't be driving on the sidewalk anymore. I was an idiot

    So yeah, I didn't exactly make it un-obvious... I wasn't in a state to do that. I just got lucky for long enough that I thought that I was invincible and that's a dangerous thing...

    and that, you may frame as what happens when an 8w7 sp goes wrong
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  5. #25
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    @Stansmith

    If that was the case, I must be one of the VERY lucky ones.

    I think it all deals with upbringing, which is one of the most important factors next to environment for any enneatype. I think type 6's can be prone to get into "bad" groups if he/she wasn't nudged into one direction or another by a person while young.

    When I was little, I was taught to "not get into trouble." I was taught what my informal name meant and why my family chose it for me. Somehow, that name has a strong influence on me (even more so than my proper name.) How I can describe is like how some Christian families ask their children to choose a passage from the bible and to keep that passage as they grow up, that is how powerful my informal name is.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chana View Post
    Thank you so much for teaching me notype.

    Anyway, I'll just add to the chorus that I don't think crimes are type-related. I'd look more closely at the motivations behind the crimes than the crimes themselves. When you get into huge society-wide crimes like the Holocaust, you're looking at all society being involved at some level, hence, all types are involved. (That, and there's real evidence to suggest Hitler was not a 6 at all.)

    That being said, I wouldn't take offense (nor would I be particularly surprised) to discover that triple reactives (468 or any combination herein) are overrepresented among the prison population. Apparently others see us as violent, anti-social, and criminally insane. The Fauvres themselves have even pegged us among the "most difficult tritypes".

    I've been felony- and misdemeanor-free for the last 30 years, though, so that's basically just a wry remark.

    Not type related.

  7. #27
    Stansmith
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    Like I said, I think an e6 in a bad situation or enviroment is more likely to succumb to it while making excuses for themselves. The unhealthy 6 mentality is "poor old me, I have problems, I'm gonna dropout and go join a gang since they're nice to me". 7s and 8s are at least more glamorous:

    7 - "lol, I'm gonna join a gang and f-ck sh-t up"

    8 - "I'm gonna run this city in 10 years"

    With criminal 6s I see more cowardice and wannabe-ness, while with 7-8 criminals there's more confident ambition and choice. The 6 doesn't really wanna be in that situation, but he does it anyway to prove he's a sadist, while the 7 and 8 examples are just legitimate sadists that genuinely enjoy what they're doing. There's no poser-ness.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stansmith View Post
    Like I said, I think an e6 in a bad situation or enviroment is more likely to succumb to it while making excuses for themselves. The unhealthy 6 mentality is "poor old me, I have problems, I'm gonna dropout and go join a gang since they're nice to me". 7s and 8s are at least more glamorous:

    7 - "lol, I'm gonna join a gang and f-ck sh-t up"

    8 - "I'm gonna run this city in 10 years"

    With criminal 6s I see more cowardice and wannabe-ness, while with 7-8 criminals there's more confident ambition and choice. The 6 doesn't really wanna be in that situation, but he does it anyway to prove he's a sadist, while the 7 and 8 examples are just legitimate sadists that genuinely enjoy what they're doing. There's no poser-ness.
    Maybe. I hate to reinforce internet notions that 6s are a bunch of posers, though. Especially since I've met plenty of posers of every type. Hell, my entire class in high school was filled with them.

    I think all types tend not to take personal responsibility at unhealthy levels, we just all do it differently. How would you imagine other types might behave in a gang-situation? (Serious question to you--it'd be interesting to explore how each type might be criminalistic).

  9. #29
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    if - as i've seen suggested many times before - 6s are the most common, then people in general are more likely to be 6, meaning that crime not being type-related would suggest that yes - criminals are more likely to be 6. if that isn't the case that 6s are as common in prison as they are outside of it, wouldn't it suggest that crime is type related and that other types are more likely to commit a crime (& get caught) then 6s?

    anyway, if you agree that people fit into the enneagram in the first place, then it would influence core motivations & fears in life.... from there, it's not a big leap to think 8s might have less self control if challenged to a bar fight out of fear of appearing weak, or that 7s are more likely to experiment with drugs out of fear of missing out, or that 2s are more likely to stalk & harass in response to rejection.

  10. #30
    Stansmith
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanjuro View Post
    Maybe. I hate to reinforce internet notions that 6s are a bunch of posers, though. Especially since I've met plenty of posers of every type. Hell, my entire class in high school was filled with them.

    I think all types tend not to take personal responsibility at unhealthy levels, we just all do it differently. How would you imagine other types might behave in a gang-situation? (Serious question to you--it'd be interesting to explore how each type might be criminalistic).
    e1 - "I'm gonna make sure they do things the right way"

    e2 - "I'll get back at them"

    e3 - "there's lots of money to be made doing this if done right"

    e4 - "I'm worthless anyway"

    e5 - probably wouldn't do it

    e6 - "these are the people I was meant to be with, f-ck everybody"

    e7 - "It'll be fun"

    e8 - "I'll run this city soon enough"

    e9 - "It's family tradition"

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