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  1. #11
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    I realized the girl in my book is a 4. Its my destiny!

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    Every girl I've ever been with has been a 4.

    I've been with 2's and 6's. Their emotion isn't intense enough. It isn't enough. I'm left unsatisfied.

    Every time a relationship was ALMOST within grasp. Then I reach out and try to grab it and poof, they're gone.

    Its been this way my whole life. It can make an ESTP begin to hate women.

    I also feel like they're the only type that satisfies me, they quench my thirst.

    Suggestions?
    You need an INFJ 4, maybe an ENFP 4. I don't know if you have read about matches between MBTI but Conflicting and Super-ego pairs are extremely drawn to eachother when the Enneagram is matched up also. I am not just reading this and then repeating it; I didn't pay any attention to this stuff until I was off the charts pulled into these two people like never before and they were to me too, that I was so fascinated I had to find out what was causing this spark and sure enough this is why. So now I know I can only date someone who has one of the first two types as Eight, then preferable Three or Four and Five or Seven for the fear type, plus ESTP or ISTJ. And until a Four feels such a chemistry with someone and they are ready enough to be greatful for someone, they are going to play the self-absorbed push pull games. Don't believe what is said online about us that we tend to do that. The only reason why Fours have a reputation to do that is because the American society is so numb from getting into relationships too fast and going from one partner to the next that alot of people are incapable of doing good with something when it comes along. The only difference is that we do not need somebody to sooth a fear like a Six would and we don't feel we need to stay to please others or be proper like Ones or Twos. We need passion, which despite what a lot of people think takes a lot of purity to be ready for. dohttp://www.socionics.com/rel/rel.htm

  3. #13
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    She sounds like an unhealthy 4 and 7.
    @Southern Kross I have never been scared of intimacy with an Eight... The only person I have been scared of intimacy with was a Three, because of their hot shot nature. But when he warmed me up good, I was pretty comfortable opening up to him. Just saying, I don't think as a Four that that is quite accurate although I have read that about us.

    I don't think that anybody is so scared of intimacy that they are willing to drop somebody they are crazy about for it. They would rather lie and keep them. Those books are silly how it says stuff like that. Don't ever believe someone if they say that is why they are dumping you.

  4. #14
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newbyagain View Post
    She sounds like an unhealthy 4 and 7.
    Southern Kross I have never been scared of intimacy with an Eight... The only person I have been scared of intimacy with was a Three, because of their hot shot nature. But when he warmed me up good, I was pretty comfortable opening up to him. Just saying, I don't think as a Four that that is quite accurate although I have read that about us.

    I don't think that anybody is so scared of intimacy that they are willing to drop somebody they are crazy about for it. They would rather lie and keep them. Those books are silly how it says stuff like that. Don't ever believe someone if they say that is why they are dumping you.
    Are you really a 4? You don't sound like one.

    4s aren't necessarily afraid of intimacy per se. They're afraid of their flaws being exposed and will often avoid/push away people that threaten to find them out. They're also protective of their soft under belly (especially 4w5s), which often makes them slow to properly open up to others.

    4s are characterised by insecurity in their sense of self; and insecure people typically have trouble with intimacy and openness.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  5. #15
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    I'm going to agree with Southern Kross, but I also think what she describes is more like us 5-wingers. Not wanting to be engulfed by someone else is 5ish, and that makes us harder to crack open to begin with. There's a bravado here that's possibly 3ish.... Maybe she's a Fe type too (likely).

    I'd boil it down to her just liking attention from you, but ultimately you're missing "something", so that's why she's resisting more. The more unhealthy/immature a 4 is, the more they'll focus on what's missing. w5s deal with this by avoiding real relationships in favor of fantasy/sabotaging their own attractiveness, and but w3s probably try to fake it more, at least for awhile. Both probably play "hard to get" to test people.
    Yeah, I suppose my description is more w5 leaning. 4w3s have the same traits but bury it a lot more and can hide behind outward confidence. That confidence is fragile and often breaks down, revealing a more insecure side - which give the appearance of a lot more contradictory push/pull nature. This description came to mind:

    4w3s are marked by multiple dichotomies due to types 3 and 4 being opposites in so many ways: inferior/superior, being/becoming, self-conscious/confident, putting themselves down/glorifying themselves, withdrawn/assertive, emotional/flatlined, reactive/cool-headed, mired in the past/focused on moving forward, awkward/poised, fragile/resilient, easily discouraged/do whatever it takes, rejecting the game/conquering the game.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    Are you really a 4? You don't sound like one.

    4s aren't necessarily afraid of intimacy per se. They're afraid of their flaws being exposed and will often avoid/push away people that threaten to find them out. They're also withdrawn and protective of their soft under belly (especially 4w5s), which often makes them slow to open up to others.

    4s are characterised by insecurity in their sense of self; and insecure people typically have trouble with intimacy and openness.
    Hmmm... will in that case, I do sort of limit how much I expose, but I don't think that is an intimacy issues... I don't push anyone away, I just keep them at a nice medium distance. Every 4 I have ever seen do the push pull thing were the immature ones, who would start doing the "grass is greener on the other side" thing, and also I believe they do it because they crave intimacy so much that they do get too close (maybe that is the regressing to Two) and it ruins the desire. Plus, I don't mean to be so argumentative, just stating something I notice a lot, Threes are seen as confidence kings and they are probably the worst when it comes to intimacy. I mean I don't think anybody REALLY knows any Three. Haha

    Oh, sorry, I see. I misread your post some, but you get what I'm saying.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    4s aren't necessarily afraid of intimacy per se. They're afraid of their flaws being exposed and will often avoid/push away people that threaten to find them out. They're also protective of their soft under belly (especially 4w5s), which often makes them slow to properly open up to others.

    4s are characterised by insecurity in their sense of self; and insecure people typically have trouble with intimacy and openness.
    Stop reading my mind!
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    appreciates being appreciated, conflicted over conflicts, afraid of being afraid, bad at being bad, predictably unpredictable, consistently inconsistent, remarkably unremarkable...

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  8. #18
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    So many good points have been made, but in the end I really think the bolded is the bottom line:

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    The more unhealthy/immature a 4 is, the more they'll focus on what's missing. w5s deal with this by avoiding real relationships in favor of fantasy/sabotaging their own attractiveness, and but w3s probably try to fake it more, at least for awhile. Both probably play "hard to get" to test people.

    However, as 4s, we often experience this as not feeling ideal enough ourselves. We don't want to burden someone with ourselves (we want the savior, but then feel too bad to be saved). I think we probably invented the "it's not you, it's me" phrase, only we really mean it.

    -------
    EDIT

    Oh yeah...making it work...
    Well, it's not going to work with someone that unstable. I think 4s have to get to a point where they feel they have something to give. They don't need a savior, because they saved themselves. When you realize you can be flawed AND have significance as a 4, then you allow others the same too, so when they fail to fit a fantasy ideal, it's okay.
    In truth, if you try to be her "savior", you will cripple her (by forstalling the emotional growth she needs to make) and she'll probably eventually reject you anyway. That happened to me in my late teens, at first I was so happy because he "made everything better", until I realized he was a flawed human just like me.

    Once 4's realize that, we either unhealthily move onto the next "perfect" guy, or we wake up and realize how screwed up it is to expect anyone (other than ourselves) to complete us. I did the latter and once I reconciled my flaws and found worth within myself, I didn't need a man to be perfect.

    In short, a romantic relationship with an emotionally unhealthy 4 is not going to work. We need to work ourselves out before we can ever succesfully contribute to a relationship. I really think that's true of all people, relationships always work best when two whole, healthy people are contributing (but specifically with 4's because we're so freaking intense).

    Solution: Let this girl sort her stuff out and find someone who already has.
    Find my Enneagram writing here. Also, I'd love for you to take my six question Enneagram surveyEnneagram survey!✨

  9. #19
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    If they love you, they just need to be reminded from time to time, "I really love you too" and that will keep them buoyant.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJWakt View Post
    If they love you, they just need to be reminded from time to time, "I really love you too" and that will keep them buoyant.
    QFT!
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