[Type 4] Type 4's Who Aren't Over-Sensitive Wusses

[Cloud of Thunder]

I'm sure I'm not the only person here who's frustrated with the view of Type 4 being weak little weeping willows, or impossible divas. Can anyone name some 4s who are actually strong, assertive, and heroic? Someone you know personally or a famous person, alive or dead, or even a fictional example. Stating their wing/stacking would be nice also.

 

[Lady_X]

Crickets chirping

Hehe haha sorry man this creature does not exist!

 

[acronach]

dude, there's steriotypes about every type, and once you get past those you get diverse and interesting people. no offense but get over it.

 

[OrangeAppled]

What's your idea of "strong, assertive & heroic"? I think that's the issue. Tons of famous artists, poets, musicians, writers, etc, have been 4s, and such people are not known for being weak, passive or lacking in courage. However, they may be known for being emotional & elitist too....

4s are often "champion of the underdogs", associated with being NF also, and that's certainly heroic. 4s are also associated with Romanticism, which is not the sappy, sentimental romantic ideas of modern times, but rather having & acting on strong, passionate, & spontaneous feelings, even if they defy convention.

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

What's your idea of "strong, assertive & heroic"? I think that's the issue. Tons of famous artists, poets, musicians, writers, etc, have been 4s, and such people are not known for being weak, passive or lacking in courage. However, they may be known for being emotional & elitist too....

4s are often "champion of the underdogs", associated with being NF also, and that's certainly heroic. 4s are also associated with Romanticism, which is not the sappy, sentimental romantic ideas of modern times, but rather having & acting on strong, passionate, & spontaneous feelings, even if they defy convention.

Primarily someone who takes control and responsibility over his/her life and doesn't waste time wallowing in useless melancholy.

Basically someone who has integrated to 1.

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

I'll add one: Cate Blanchett.

 

[Elfa]

I'm sure I'm not the only person here who's frustrated with the view of Type 4 being weak little weeping willows, or impossible divas. Can anyone name some 4s who are actually strong, assertive, and heroic? Someone you know personally or a famous person, alive or dead, or even a fictional example. Stating their wing/stacking would be nice also.

Isn't Johnny Depp a 4? He doesn't seem over-sensitive and seems strong.

But for me, I'm a 4, I'm very sensitive and cry a lot. But I can be brave when I defend something I believe to be true or someone who I really care about (and I've done it!).

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

Yeah, Johnny Depp is cool. A bit too devil-may-care for my tastes, though.

 

[acronach]

Primarily someone who takes control and responsibility over his/her life and doesn't waste time wallowing in useless melancholy.

Basically someone who has integrated to 1.

makes more sense. I havent actually looked this up but I think Thomas Jefferson sounds like a 4w5, i could be wrong though

 

[skylights]

I have two friends close enough for me to know for certain they are both 4s.

The first is self-typed as an ENFP 4w3, probably sx/so. I actually had a bit of a falling out with her and don't speak with her anymore, but I have to give it to her that she is quite assertive. She has emotional issues and was depressed for a few years while I knew her, but she's also outspoken, engaging, warm, welcoming, dramatic, and doting. She struggled with traditional school, even though she is very intelligent, but now is in beauty school and is thriving. She is bisexual and very forthright with and assertive of queer culture and rights as well.

The second is, as typed by me, probably 4w5 sx/sp. For a long time I thought she was INFP, but she may be ISFP, because, come to think of it, her art really sings of Ni. We are good friends, though she has recently moved far away to live with her significant other while he finishes graduate school. She has always been very quirky and a little isolated, in the sense that she always will prioritize her own needs and values over whatever is going on in the external world. However, she is an avid artist, and over the years I have watched her improve from odd but creative doodles to stunning, sometimes bizarre works. She uses a lot of archetype and symbology in her art, and she frequently depicts herself in various "transformative" poses. You can tell she struggles with deep emotion like any 4 but she's pretty cool in the way she spills it into her art. She's always been pretty assertive about her ideas and she's strong in her identity.

I wouldn't call either of them particularly "heroic", but to be honest, I don't think that's really so much of a 4 gift. I think that's more something you find in 2s, 8s, 1s. Self-actualized 4s more seem like true individualists, recreating themselves again and again, and being proud of who they are. Their gift to the world is so much in their immediate acceptance of value in everything that people can be and become.

 

[Burger King]

Someone I know personally:
I had a friend in high school who was an ISFP 4w3, most likely so/sx. He was very "light" in that he seemed kind of scattered and airy in his presence. He would present a favorable image to the public, someone who was likable, outgoing, and stylish. However, around me, he would start to leak out and reveal his insecurities. He was riddled with shame, very focused on his deficiencies, and was very envious. Much of his concerns were around recognition and appearance. He would make snarky remarks on others style, taking pride in that others would steal his style, etc. Sure he was sensitive, but I would not call him a wuss. He was very assertive and quite intelligent (had a ridiculous talent for chemistry). Last I heard, he joined the marines.

For fiction:
I was reading some stuff recently on the Avengers and came across some conversation of Loki possibly being an E4. This based on the recent movies of course. This would be quite the coincidence seeing as I picked my username on a whim based on the norse mythology lol. Anyhow, based on the movie, I can see why people would type him as such, specifically 4w3 w/ a 6 head fix. The man was very envious, shame ridden, hated goodness, etc. Could also be an E3. Definitely in the image triad.

 

[The Great One]

I'm sure that I can find a type 4 that isn't a sensitive wuss, right after I find an 8 w 7 who isn't power hungry.

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

I'm specifically look for 4w3s. Like Patrick Stewart. He's got a set of balls.

 

[Darya]

I am 4w3. 4s are not wuess. In fact, they have a great amount of inner strenght... Although they feel the pain much deeper than others, they dont complian, rather they tend to deal with emotions by avoiding interactions with others... Read in a great Enneagram book, "Awarenss" that 4's see things deeply ,like their eyes have no eyelid..

 

[Cloud of Thunder]

Perhaps Al Pacino...

 

[Elfboy]

Perhaps Al Pacino...

EIGHT!

 

[Elfboy]

Maria Callas: INFJ 4w3 Sx/Sp
she was a strong, fiery diva and would probably fuck you up if you stepped to her. she also rose out of poverty and became a world class singer despite having what many considered an "ugly" voice.

 

[Burger King]

Late Edit: The friend I mentioned in an earlier post could've been a ISFP sx 6w7 (w/ a 4 heart fix) instead, now that I really think about it. :/

 

[The Great One]

I think Patrick Stewart, and ENTJ 4w3 is a good example of a type 4 who is not a wuss.

 

[Reverie]

Fours
Diane Arbus, Charles Baudelaire, Ingmar Bergman, Bjork, Cate Blanchett, Kate Bush, Nicolas Cage, Maria Callas, Albert Camus, Prince Charles, Eric Clapton, Cheryl Crow, James Dean, Johnny Depp, Neil Diamond, Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Bob Dylan, William Faulkner, Hermann Hesse, Michael Jackson, Jewel, Angelina Jolie, Janis Joplin, Jack Kerouac,Sarah MacLachlan, John Malkovich, Marilyn Manson, Michaelangelo, Claude Monet, Jim Morrison, Alanis Morrisette, Morrissey, Liam Neeson, Stevie Nicks, Anais Nin, Nick Nolte, Gary Oldman, Laurence Olivier, Edith Piaf, Edgar Allen Poe, Natalie Portman, Prince, Anne Rice, Alan Rickman, Arthur Rimbaud, Winona Ryder, Dusty Springfield, August Strindberg, Vincent Van Gogh, Orson Welles, Oscar Wilde, Gene Wilder, Tennessee Williams, Kate Winslet, Virginia Woolf.
http://pstypes.blogspot.fi/2009/03/famous-enneagram-types.html

Well there seems to be quite a few just on this list.