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Thread: Myths about 3s

  1. #1
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Default Myths about 3s

    1) the 3's actions revolve around other people's opinions
    nope. the core focus of a 3 is external validation. the opinions of others are only one such form. other 3s look for other forms of validation, such as reaching a financial goal, or making a scientific discovery.

    2) 3s love to brag
    sometimes sexual 3s like to brag overtly, but overall, 3s tend to be more socially prudent. after all, what effect would bragging have on their image? probably not a good one

    3) 3s are sensitive and their egos are easily offended
    no again. 3s are a forward looking type. they're much more focused on their goals and ambitions than they are on you.

    4) 3s are very conscientious in a similar way to 1s
    no. type 3 and type 1 are miles apart internally. the 3s motivation is selfish. they are the bird of paradise dancing for a mate, the alpha wolf seeking to prove his dominance over the pack or the little kid trying to max out his score on a video game. they are somewhat perfectionist, but overall the 3 is more concerned with
    - how do I get it done
    - how do I get it done fast
    - how do I do it in a sexy way
    the 1's focus is more lateral, scanning their environment for mistakes, imperfections and sinful conduct; the 3 on the other hand has tunnel vision. if most people are human beings, 3s are human doing and what they are doing and the future success/fame/glory etc that the said project will bring them.

    5) 3s have a tendency to become histrionic
    no, this is actually more of a 7 thing. again, histrionic displays would only serve to hurt their image and avert focus from goals. 3 is in the controlled/competency triad along with 1 and 5 and generally do not act impulsively/chaotically the way a less socially aware type might.

    PS: I have no intention of this thread turning out like the last one I made on a similar subject. if you have issues with my posting style, think I'm stereotyping, etc. let's handle it like mature adults, via private message. other than that, enjoy and feel free to add or voice your disagreements

    specifically, I'd like to hear from some 3s
    @2XtremeENFP
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    Last edited by Patches; 07-06-2012 at 05:07 AM.
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  2. #2
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    Nah. I think it sounds pretty good.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Cloud of Thunder's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's about right. Maybe you could clear up the real differences between 3w2s and 3w4s.

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    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloud of Thunder View Post
    Yeah, that's about right. Maybe you could clear up the real differences between 3w2s and 3w4s.
    off the top of my head
    3w2s are more expansive. they show their feelings more openly and tend to "market themselves" more. the 3w4 is more vulnerable, bearing a hidden, emotionally delicate 4 side. because of this, the 3w4 is more private, guarded and aloof, preferring to maintain a distant, professional image so as not to reveal this sensitive, inner 4 side or let it get in the way of their work. on the inside though, the 3w4 is actually more emotional than the 3w2 and harbors deeper passions and sexuality.
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  5. #5
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    I have been summoned. Doin' my civic duty

    I'll chime in with my thoughts, from my own perspective. *cracks knuckles*

    In summation: I strive to be valuable and worthwhile. That can be taken too far, with the ego hinging upon being or feeling accomplished. Sometimes, this means wanting to see myself 'reflected' out there in the world--that the world is a mirror, and what I see in it looks good.

    If I were less healthy, I'd feel value only if I'm perceived to exceed societal standards and I'd delude myself into believing that others' perception is me.

    I've identified mostly with 3, 6, and 1. So, take this for what it is

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    1) the 3's actions revolve around other people's opinions
    nope. the core focus of a 3 is external validation. the opinions of others are only one such form. other 3s look for other forms of validation, such as reaching a financial goal, or making a scientific discovery.
    This. While I'm actually pretty agreeable, I don't 'people-please' all the time--I subconsciously focus on what's deemed to be important, what would make me stand out, what would make me feel capable and worthwhile. Any sort of goal or accomplishment can fuel that--though a good title, plenty of bullet points on a resume, and a perception that I'm charming and personal all feel pretty good.

    Our global marketplace is competitive as hell; not drowning sometimes feels hard enough--one can imagine how hard it feels to thrive. I realize that being on the absolute top isn't possible and that my ego shouldn't hinge on it--but, well, we all backslide sometimes.

    I strive to be worthwhile (out and in), to be relevant, and to make an impact. Much of that is driven by attention and validation, but, for me, I do want to feel like I've done a good job, which takes some internal validation. That, in turn, was driven by depressive episodes that forced me to face reality, to refrain from deluding myself. I've been driven to doubt and existential crises during my worst moments (which is why I've typed as 6 and still identify with it to some extent), but I've seized them as opportunities for perspective and true growth.

    Some make the mistake of brushing off that need for internal validation and instead identify solely with external standards. To the extent that I'm focused on internal validation, I might differ from the stereotype.

    Whatever. It's all about feeling as worthwhile as possible.

    2) 3s love to brag
    sometimes sexual 3s like to brag overtly, but overall, 3s tend to be more socially prudent. after all, what effect would bragging have on their image? probably not a good one
    Yeah, especially the italicized. Less mature people seem to think that strutting about and bragging will make others think of them as worthwhile, but in reality it doesn't impress anyone (and also it's not the right thing to do).

    It turns out that people value humility--and also humility is a good value to have. I prefer to try to demonstrate my character. Sometimes I slip up and let things roll out naturally (but usually subtly), or stick around the office just a few minutes after everyone else has left to give them the impression that, really, I am working (they might not think that I'm working hard enough otherwise!).

    Although, I'm excellent at fine-tuning my message for the environment. In an initial introduction, if I want a psychological edge, I label myself as a psychological researcher (which is true); if I want a more intelligent edge, I label myself an engineer or graduate student (which is also true); and so on. I only care about this if an edge is important or helps with my goals, though--often, it does matter; sometimes, it doesn't matter.

    3) 3s are sensitive and their egos are easily offended
    no again. 3s are a forward looking type. they're much more focused on their goals and ambitions than they are on you.
    I can be sensitive, though more along the lines of, "Oh, shit; better not make any mistakes." Some might lie to themselves and spin all of their failures and criticisms directed toward them as "minor successes," but I legitimately try to pick out what these failures mean and how I can fare better next time. A necessary part of that process is internalizing these failures, which might bruise the ego a bit at first. If I don't feel perfect (though not in the 1 sense), then what am I?

    Of course, I was very sensitive during my depressive episodes and took failures personally--not so much anymore. I can see the silver lining in virtually any situation, and I feel virtually no anxiety under even the worst circumstances. I use that mindset to help myself and others.

    4) 3s are very conscientious in a similar way to 1s
    no. type 3 and type 1 are miles apart internally. the 3s motivation is selfish. they are the bird of paradise dancing for a mate, the alpha wolf seeking to prove his dominance over the pack or the little kid trying to max out his score on a video game. they are somewhat perfectionist, but overall the 3 is more concerned with
    - how do I get it done
    - how do I get it done fast
    - how do I do it in a sexy way
    the 1's focus is more lateral, scanning their environment for mistakes, imperfections and sinful conduct; the 3 on the other hand has tunnel vision. if most people are human beings, 3s are human doing and what they are doing and the future success/fame/glory etc that the said project will bring them.
    I can be pretty conscientious; in order to feel worthwhile, I want to feel as though I'm making an impact, which takes training, discipline, goal-orientation, adaptability to the changing world around us, and overall being as excellent as I can be. Being 'better than others' is one gauge of whether one's making an impact, but it's not the best or healthiest one.

    5) 3s have a tendency to become histrionic
    no, this is actually more of a 7 thing. again, histrionic displays would only serve to hurt their image and avert focus from goals. 3 is in the controlled/competency triad along with 1 and 5 and generally do not act impulsively/chaotically the way a less socially aware type might.
    I'm controlled and planned as hell; there's not much that I do impulsively. Virtually everything that I do is for multiple reasons--that it's rewarding, that it's the right thing to do, and that it makes me feel worthwhile.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    I am going to chime in here because even though I am still confused about my E-type, I think there is a good argument to be made for being a 3. People who know me IRL and are somewhat familiar with e-type say 3, not 6. I've also had quite a few PM's saying 3. Here is my take:

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    1) the 3's actions revolve around other people's opinions
    nope. the core focus of a 3 is external validation. the opinions of others are only one such form. other 3s look for other forms of validation, such as reaching a financial goal, or making a scientific discovery.
    Fine line. The answer to this lies in level of health, "At their best, very healthy Threes transcend their desire to be affirmed by others and accept themselves as they are." Healthy 3's become inner-directed, they follow their hearts and are not swayed by the opinions of others. Average and even unhealthy Threes also do not care so much about being liked by everyone.. they are focused and very specific in who they seek validation from, even though they enjoy admiration from anyone.. if they don't hold you in high regard and you have a shitty opinion of them, water off a ducks back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    2) 3s love to brag
    sometimes sexual 3s like to brag overtly, but overall, 3s tend to be more socially prudent. after all, what effect would bragging have on their image? probably not a good one
    Agree. Average and healthy Threes are perceptive enough to get this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    3) 3s are sensitive and their egos are easily offended
    Level of health.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    4) 3s are very conscientious in a similar way to 1s
    I don't know enough about 1's to offer anything on this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    5) 3s have a tendency to become histrionic
    no, this is actually more of a 7 thing. again, histrionic displays would only serve to hurt their image and avert focus from goals. 3 is in the controlled/competency triad along with 1 and 5 and generally do not act impulsively/chaotically the way a less socially aware type might.
    Agree. Threes are far more likely to have issues with hostility and narcissism.

    Because level of health will change the way a Three processes and behaves so much I'd really avoid absolutes in this Umbrella. Regardless of health, you might be a Three IF:

    - You were heavily influenced and conflicted by your relationship with your mother figure and regardless of how you've interpreted this (negatively/positively) you recall intense desire to please this person in childhood. Even if you have overcome the need to please this person now you still find yourself thinking about them and their conditions quite a bit, how it affected you developmentally and shaped your identity.

    - You spend quite a bit of time constructing an idealized image. If you are healthy you will work relentlessly to merge this ideal with reality, if you are unhealthy you will fear that the great gap of image and reality could be found out.

    - You believe that your health and self-esteem will increase through achievement and you tend to define achievement through the views of those you greatly admire.

    - You are extremely perceptive of others reactions to you but may not be aware of how fine-tuned this is because it operates as a backdrop, like the 6's anxiety.

    - Actualizing potential is everything to you, and you have a good grasp on your own potential. As a kid you likely took the motto "You can be anything you dream" to heart.

    - You tend to see your worth in what you can do, not who you are. Your concept of self is shaky in this respect because most of your energy focuses on what you are doing or will do.

    - You might find intimate relationships scary as hell, sometimes fearing that after the dazzle and image wears off your partner will be disappointed. If you take the risk you will usually find out you were very wrong, especially if you can find a partner more developed (inwardly) than you.

    The biggest mistake I see made (imo) is trying to type someone by what what they do or like or even how they behave in some regards (I'm not saying your doing this Elfboy, now I'm just rambling) It is never the object, it is always the relation to the object. So you can say that a Three likes goals, discoveries, etc.. but then so does an 8, 7, 5, etc.. It is never the what and always the why (says the inferior sensor lol) The what will shift and change depending on infinite factors but the why sets the pattern or fixation.
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    The biggest mistake I see made (imo) is trying to type someone by what what they do or like or even how they behave in some regards (I'm not saying your doing this Elfboy, now I'm just rambling) It is never the object, it is always the relation to the object. So you can say that a Three likes goals, discoveries, etc.. but then so does an 8, 7, 5, etc.. It is never the what and always the why (says the inferior sensor lol) The what will shift and change depending on infinite factors but the why sets the pattern or fixation.
    This is an awesome point, and what I struggled with... for a long time I mistook myself as a maybe-3 because I fit so many of the supposed "aspects" of 3s. But my relation to the object, like you explain, is totally different - my motivations are a 6's motivations. Not a 3's. Even though they end up manifesting rather similarly to the way most 3s' do.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    I am going to chime in here because even though I am still confused about my E-type, I think there is a good argument to be made for being a 3. People who know me IRL and are somewhat familiar with e-type say 3, not 6. I've also had quite a few PM's saying 3.
    Haha, same here, all around--tossup between 3 and 6, with IRL folks describing me as 3. I wonder what that says about us.

    I also think that your list is pretty spot-on.

    What's most true for me is this:
    - You spend quite a bit of time constructing an idealized image. If you are healthy you will work relentlessly to merge this ideal with reality, if you are unhealthy you will fear that the great gap of image and reality could be found out.
    Yeah, I want an ideal; but I want to be that ideal. I construct the bar and then aim for it. That can be unhealthy if it leads to disappointment (which it can, at times. for me), but insanely useful if it's channeled properly--more about becoming "the absolute best you that you can be."

    The biggest mistake I see made (imo) is trying to type someone by what what they do or like or even how they behave in some regards
    This sentiment needs to be clubbed over people's heads, several times, until they bleed. Type's all about the core, with several possible manifestations of that core.

    I know others whose narcissism has manifested in them thinking that they're right about everything, all the time; firmly believing that all problems reside with other people; denying the fact that they're putting up a front; and seeking out friends who validate their way of thinking (e.g. "your ex? that bitch slut was just a bitch, man! bro!") and ignoring actual valid criticism. If I ever had those tendencies, I'm over them now.

    For the record, "inner narcissist" keeps coming up for me. Less thinking about actually being above other people, more about wanting achievement, wanting some validation, wanting the best, and, until I got over it, some fear of rejection of my core. I've tended to reject my past because I don't like it; not so much anymore. The thought of not being in control and just drowning in the sea that is other people is kinda scary, but not enough for me to step on others' toes, to cheat, etc.

  9. #9
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    @Huxley3112
    a few points I believe you were off on
    - even unhealthy 3s are not very sensitive, they just tend to become more Machiavellian and manipulative
    - 3s are not likely to have issues with hostility (except from maybe an 8 or cp6 fix)
    - 3s actions can revolve around others, but the thing that all 3s have in common is that they revolve around something external that they are comparing themselves with. even in unhealthy 3s, this isn't always people.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    You and I will just have to agree to disagree on this.

    Hostility:

    "Like the other personality types of this Center, Threes have a problem with hostility which manifests itself as vindictive malice toward anyone who they believe threatens their self image. While Twos and Fours are indirectly hostile, average to unhealthy Threes are more openly hostile in a wide variety of ways, from arrogantly distancing themselves, to snide humor at others’ expense, to sarcastic putdowns, to sabotaging and betraying people. Hostility serves Threes in two ways: first it compensates for their own feelings of inadequacy, and second, it keeps away people who, for one reason or another, undermine their fragile self-esteem. In this latter regard, less healthy Threes may even be hostile to people who they admire or to whom they are attracted."

    Sensitivity:
    "Like ONES and TWOS, THREES report being sensitive and susceptible to criticism and rejection. They feel hurt when they are not paid attention to or don’t receive recognition."

    (This is why I said that sensitivity is largely based on health for 3.) I think manipulation and Machiavellian are manifestations of sensitivity. Even when 3's become extremely healthy, they are still highly sensitive to others conditions because when the 3 is "real" at its highest levels of health they identify deeply with others.

    The "something external they compare themselves with" is to gain admiration and recognition in the eyes of people unless they are healthy and follow their own hearts. Your looking at what their doing and not why. It always leads back to recognition from people. The fixation is that all their projects and performance is done to get admiration (from people) and it is only when threes allow themselves to fail (through bankruptcy, divorce, illness, etc) that their image is shattered and their real self emerges.
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

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