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  1. #31
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Fi and Te are two sides of the same coin. Both are related to the gut instinct too. So yeah, there is definitely a connection.

    It's tough to understand what comes first...the ennneagram motivation or the cognitive functions. At least in the form of a model or a pattern than fits most people. If one is really serious about self-discovery and self-understanding one can easily see the correlations in him/herself I think. At least that has been my experience.

    There is also something to be said about enneagram 9 and Fi and 8 and Te. Seeing how 9 and 8 are close to each other and are seemingly paradoxical, yet intimately related, it makes sense the whole thing is connected in some form.

    8 is also the stereotype of the adult impulse and 9 of the divine child impulse.

    EDIT : "Divine" child in the sense of not being tainted by worldly affairs. Still submerged in the oceanic view Freud talks about. Which explains the 9 tendency to daydream and often feel disconnected from their body energy.

  2. #32
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moiety View Post
    Fi and Te are two sides of the same coin. Both are related to the gut instinct too. So yeah, there is definitely a connection.
    No. Fi is about individual values and Te is used as the means to an end.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Exactly, two sides of the same coin.

    Te is about objectifying criteria and Fi is subjective criteria.

    A Te-dominant is good at implementing but it has to be fueled by some subjective criteria (Si or Ni/ESTJ or ENTJ).
    A Fi-dominant is good at evaluation but it has to have an outward movement of expression (Se or Ne).


    Two sides of the same coin are by definition in opposition to each other. What I'm saying is that the coin is the same.

  4. #34
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    8 would seem to best fit ETJ types, who have inferior Fi (which can be very "projective"). So that's probably where such an association would come from.
    APS Profile: Inclusion: e/w=1/6 (Supine) |Control: e/w=7/3 (Choleric) |Affection: e/w=1/9 (Supine)
    Ti 54.3 | Ne 47.3 | Si 37.8 | Fe 17.7 | Te 22.5 | Ni 13.4 | Se 18.9 | Fi 27.9

    Temperament (APS) from scratch -- MBTI Type from scratch
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  5. #35
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    ^were I come from, if you are a FP and you are a man there's a good chance you are also an 8. I think 8 = Te is an oversimplification that doesn't explain much.It's like saying Pe-dominants are 7s by default. There seem to be some statistical tendencies but there's a whole nother ball game at play too.

    8s assert their presence. Te can be a way of doing it, but it's certainly not the only one.

  6. #36
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric B View Post
    8 would seem to best fit ETJ types, who have inferior Fi (which can be very "projective"). So that's probably where such an association would come from.
    Yes.

  7. #37
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    No. Fi is about individual values and Te is used as the means to an end.
    I would say that one informs the other. How would you determine what the end should be if you don't value one thing over another? That is how I seem to work, when, if, I use Te.
    Your kisses, sweeter than honey. But guess what, so is my money.

  8. #38
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    I would say that one informs the other. How would you determine what the end should be if you don't value one thing over another? That is how I seem to work, when, if, I use Te.
    If I recall my function theory correctly, dom and inferior are combatants.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    I would say that one informs the other. How would you determine what the end should be if you don't value one thing over another? That is how I seem to work, when, if, I use Te.
    You wouldn't. Without Si an ESTJ doesn't know what to do with his Te. The same applies to an ENTJ without his Ni.

    Te Orders and Fi eValueates. One implies the other. You can't order without making an evaluation and you can't evaluate without establishing an order. They are just two different approaches. A right brain and a left brain approach. Non-Linear vs linear. Holistic vs atomistic.

  10. #40
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moiety View Post
    I think 8 = Te is an oversimplification that doesn't explain much.
    Agreed. There's another way to look at it:

    For instance, associated with zone 8, as 'prototypical', is the 'extraverted thinking' pair (ESTJ, ENTJ). Both types have 'thinking' (T) as the dominant function. They are the only two 'extraverted thinking' types amongst the 16. But it is not dominant extraverted 'thinking' that they share with the other members of the zone 8 family, but issues associated with underdeveloped feeling.

    Now, some ESTPs and ENTPs may also test as 8s, although they do not have feeling as their fourth function. Nevertheless, we hypothesize, feeling will be underdeveloped in these particular individuals and it is this (and related issues) that they share with the others in zone 8
    Just because a function like Fi is in the Aux position of an EXFP doesn't mean it's developed. Function orders are mere guidelines for what may, or may not, occur. Type development is not carved in stone. That means an EXFP could share the same issue as an ETJ and ETP 8 - underdeveloped feeling. (Which is not to be confused with emotion.)

    Source:
    http://tap3x.net/EMBTI/page3.html

    ------------------------------------------------------

    Jung saw the Dom and Inferior functions developing in a compensatory manner, not combative. Furthermore, Dario Nardi proposed that each of the cognitive processes can be used with its opposite in a tandem relationship. To me, it's perfectly natural to envision the cog processes used in such a manner.


    Engage Processes in Tandem for Powerful Results


    Source:
    http://www.cognitiveprocesses.com/8keys.html

    Scoll down the page to find the tandem descriptions.
    It's a good read.

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