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  1. #51
    Senior Member VagrantFarce's Avatar
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    It seems that the 5's isolation comes from their fixation, which is collecting knowledge, which comes from their fear of being overwhelmed by the world. I fear not being good enough and making mistakes, but that doesn't cause me to collect knowledge.
    What does it cause you to do?

    I may be a recluse, but in my isolation I'm not really collecting information (except typology stuff, but I'm not sure that counts :P)
    Why?

    You don't have to reading a science book to be collecting knowledge, y'know. And "collecting knowledge" doesn't mean memorising facts, either - its all about attaining some sort of understanding.
    Hello

  2. #52
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VagrantFarce View Post
    What does it cause you to do?

    I may be a recluse, but in my isolation I'm not really collecting information (except typology stuff, but I'm not sure that counts :P)
    Why?

    You don't have to reading a science book to be collecting knowledge, y'know. And "collecting knowledge" doesn't mean memorising facts, either - its all about attaining some sort of understanding.
    It causes me to avoid taking risks and not say anything if there's a chance I could be wrong and look like an idiot. I don't think it's really what causes me to retreat into isolation, though. I isolate myself so that I can get away from social obligations and not have to do things I don't really want to do, and also because I'm more comfortable alone where I can be myself and do whatever I want without being judged. I feel like my friends would think I was weird if they knew that I spend much of my day foruming, and that I listen to weird music instead of the popular stuff. So to be myself without being judged, I like to be alone.

    The reason typology doesn't count is because I've only been into it for the past few months. Before that, there wasn't really any kind of knowledge I was collecting. Those were the days when I would just sit and daydream and listen to music in my free time. Occasionally I would try to learn Japanese, but mostly through anime. :P And somewhere along the line, I seem to have lost my motivation...

  3. #53
    Ruler of the Stars Asterion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    It causes me to avoid taking risks and not say anything if there's a chance I could be wrong and look like an idiot. I don't think it's really what causes me to retreat into isolation, though. I isolate myself so that I can get away from social obligations and not have to do things I don't really want to do, and also because I'm more comfortable alone where I can be myself and do whatever I want without being judged. I feel like my friends would think I was weird if they knew that I spend much of my day foruming, and that I listen to weird music instead of the popular stuff. So to be myself without being judged, I like to be alone.

    The reason typology doesn't count is because I've only been into it for the past few months. Before that, there wasn't really any kind of knowledge I was collecting. Those were the days when I would just sit and daydream and listen to music in my free time. Occasionally I would try to learn Japanese, but mostly through anime. :P And somewhere along the line, I seem to have lost my motivation...
    That kind of reminds me of my astrophysics tutorials, the tutor asks a question that everyone knows the answer to, but nobody says anything out of that fear. I forced myself to answer all questions once, and one correct answer would lead to further questioning until the tutor found something that I didn't know, it's a complete nightmare, so now I stay quiet even if I know the answer, lol.

    If you listen to different music, you just introduce it to other people, no? I love going through heaps and heaps of albums finding new music that I like and sharing it with people.

    Anyway, that sounds quite much like 5, you don't want to put yourself out there and expend all of your energy because you fear that you will loose what you know and love, that they will take away your foruming and weird music taste with their judgement. Maybe I'm spinning your words too much though, but that's what I think it might be. What the enneagram writings tell you though is that you will gain energy from other people and that the fear of loosing all of that effort and energy is invalid, unless your friends are assholes and they intend to suck you dry, but that's not what you're telling us is it.

    I don't think 9s care about that kind of effort/energy so much, they move towards others, assimilate them and thrive off of their energy to the point where they loose themselves and their own identity.
    5 3 9

  4. #54
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    I found this thread on the Enneagram Institute forum that gives reasons each type might have for being a loner: (http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/fo...TOPIC_ID=26182)

    Originally posted by JoL
    9: To prevent loss of sense of self
    That's interesting. Because of the 9 tendency to merge and lose themselves around others.

    I can see how that's the case with me. Like I'm not really "myself" when I'm around others. I'm too much in the background. When I'm completely alone, I'm in the foreground of my own life and consciousness.

    Maybe similar to the 5. The 5 needs alone time to "recharge energy" and 9 needs alone time to regain their sense of self.

    It's strange that this is giving me another angle with which to view the "loss of self" and merging into others that is talked about for 9s.

    The sense of self is easily dispersed and merged with the environment, but in isolation is re-collects and condenses back into a solid form, rather than the gaseous/etheric background merging.
    (posted by eidbuser)

    I can very much relate to withdrawing to preserve my sense of self. I conform too much around others, so I can only really be myself when I'm alone. Of course, I also need to recharge like a 5 would, but I think introverts in general can relate to that.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    I can very much relate to withdrawing to preserve my sense of self. I conform too much around others, so I can only really be myself when I'm alone. Of course, I also need to recharge like a 5 would, but I think introverts in general can relate to that.
    I withdraw to preserve my sense of self, too, but not because I conform too much but because it gets old feeling so different than everyone all the time. When I'm alone it's totally fine being me.

    Fives do not conform.

    I really wish you would face the fact and accept you are a nine. What do you have against it? Nines are very cool... (although the nine is so strong in me maybe I'm being a total hypocrite here.)

  6. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    I can very much relate to withdrawing to preserve my sense of self. I conform too much around others, so I can only really be myself when I'm alone. Of course, I also need to recharge like a 5 would, but I think introverts in general can relate to that.
    Here are all of them...
    1. The lessen the pain of the inability to socially adapt
    2. Wounded pride
    3. To admit defeat
    4: To protect the rawness
    5: To prevent being overrun
    6: To grow less dependent
    7: To avoid the negative emotions of others
    8: To prevent loss of strength
    9: To prevent loss of sense of self


    I relate to 8 more, I withdraw to prevent a loss of strength. But self is mixed in with that. But it is the 8 description I perceive more. I also relate to 4, To protect the rawness. I just like the sound of that one. To protect the rawness.

  7. #57
    Senior Member Moiety's Avatar
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    if there is one thing I've learned about enneagram is that it's powerful IF you don't take it at face value. I mistyped as many things other than 9 because I couldn't see myself in "always accommodating others" and stuff like that.

    The map is not the territory.

    Only by getting in touch with what you TRULY really want for yourself and others, can you start getting an idea of what your enneatype is. Any strongfelt emotion is a good pointer.

    I think one of the best things you can do is by looking at your holy idea and trying to find out what it is. Not what other people say it is, but what it is really. What is PEACE/LOVE really all about? Is APATHY or SLOTH peace? Is withdrawing from others LOVE?

    Are any of the romanticized IDEAS we have ABOUT concepts like love or peace any true? Is love a romantic, sentimalistic, sappy thing? Or is it something different? Is peace a room full of people all agreeing to the same thing with complete lack of conflict or dynamic? Is sitting around all day the answer to either of those things? Or anything else for that matter? Wouldn't it be nice to find out for a change?

  8. #58
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Have you ever made a "Type Me" video? Do that and let us see you, that would be a better gauge than all of this guessing.
    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
    Eleanor Roosevelt


    "When people see some things as beautiful,
    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
    Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

  9. #59
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by wolfy View Post
    I just like the sound of that one. To protect the rawness.
    I like the sound of it too. But what the hell does it mean?

    So you don't get dulled by convention maybe? I can see that.

  10. #60
    Senior Member Silveresque's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I withdraw to preserve my sense of self, too, but not because I conform too much but because it gets old feeling so different than everyone all the time. When I'm alone it's totally fine being me.

    Fives do not conform.

    I really wish you would face the fact and accept you are a nine. What do you have against it? Nines are very cool... (although the nine is so strong in me maybe I'm being a total hypocrite here.)
    To be honest, I would rather be a 9 than a 5. I just want to know that I'm a 9 before I go changing my type.

    Quote Originally Posted by Moiety View Post
    if there is one thing I've learned about enneagram is that it's powerful IF you don't take it at face value. I mistyped as many things other than 9 because I couldn't see myself in "always accommodating others" and stuff like that.

    The map is not the territory.

    Only by getting in touch with what you TRULY really want for yourself and others, can you start getting an idea of what your enneatype is. Any strongfelt emotion is a good pointer.

    I think one of the best things you can do is by looking at your holy idea and trying to find out what it is. Not what other people say it is, but what it is really. What is PEACE/LOVE really all about? Is APATHY or SLOTH peace? Is withdrawing from others LOVE?

    Are any of the romanticized IDEAS we have ABOUT concepts like love or peace any true? Is love a romantic, sentimalistic, sappy thing? Or is it something different? Is peace a room full of people all agreeing to the same thing with complete lack of conflict or dynamic? Is sitting around all day the answer to either of those things? Or anything else for that matter? Wouldn't it be nice to find out for a change?
    But I thought 9's fixation of indolence comes from the loss of holy love? In other words, if I'm an average 9, would I really be able to relate to holy love if I've supposedly lost it? When I read the description, it sounds good, but I'm not sure how much I can really relate to it, since I don't normally think about love much. Then again, I don't even understand 5's holy idea. When I read it it doesn't make sense to me, but maybe that particular description is just confusing.

    Anyways, good idea. Time to start thinking outside the box and figure out what my holy idea is.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Have you ever made a "Type Me" video? Do that and let us see you, that would be a better gauge than all of this guessing.
    I've considered making a "Type Me" video. But I keep putting it off and getting distracted by other things. That, and I'm very shy and it sounds scary.

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