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  1. #1
    Junior Member Nymma's Avatar
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    Default Fours with balanced wings

    OK, so I'm considering the possibility of being a 4 with balanced wings. The problem is, there's zero information about enneatypes with balanced wings.

    I want to know:

    1)How do the 4wX differ from 4w5s and 4w3s?

    2)How much influence will the wings have on the type?

    3) If you're a 4wX, please tell me what is/are your goals in life, what affects you, what drives you, how much importance do you put on recognition, why do you withdraw from the world/how much withdrawing time do you need and anything else that might be insightful.

    4w5s and 4w3s are also welcome to bring peices of their psyche to light in this thread.

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    It'd certainly help them to glide without veering to the left or to the right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymma View Post
    OK, so I'm considering the possibility of being a 4 with balanced wings. The problem is, there's zero information about enneatypes with balanced wings.
    Actually, there is information concenring the inlfuence of the wings (although this is basically it)

    4w3
    Fours with a 3 wing can sometimes seem like Sevens. May be outgoing, have a sense of humor and style. Prize being both creative and effective in the world. Both intuitive and ambitious; may have good imaginations, often talented. Some are colorful, fancy dressers, make a distinct impression. Self-knowledge combines well with social and organizational skills. When more entranced, often have a public/private split. Could conceal feelings in public then go home to loneliness. Or they could enjoy their work and be dissatisfied in love. Tendency towards melodrama and flamboyance; true feelings can often be hidden. Competitive, sneaky, aware of how they look. Some have bad taste. May be fickle in love, drawn to romantic images that they have projected onto others. Could have a dull spouse, then fantasize about glamorous strangers. Achievements can be tainted by jealousy, revenge, or a desire to prove the crowd wrong.
    4w5
    Healthy side of this wing brings a withdrawn, complex creativity. May be somewhat intellectual but have exceptional depth of feeling and insight. Very much their own person; original and idiosyncratic. Have a spiritual and aesthetic openness. Will find multiple levels of meaning to most events. May have a strong need and ability to pour themselves into artistic creations. Loners; can seem enigmatic and hard to read. Externally reserved and internally resonant. When they open up it can be sudden and total. When entranced or defensive, Fours with a 5 wing can easily feel alienated and depressed. Many have a sense of not belonging, of being from another planet. Can get lost in their own process, drown in their own ocean. Whiny - tend to ruminate and relive past experience. Prone to the emotion of shame. Air of sullen, withdrawn disappointment. May live within a private mythology of pain and loss. Can get deeply morbid and fall in love with death.
    If you're a 4wX, please tell me what is/are your goals in life, what affects you, what drives you, how much importance do you put on recognition, why do you withdraw from the world/how much withdrawing time do you need and anything else that might be insightful.
    Well, my ultimate goal in life is to better the world and its inhabitants in a grand manner and mark my image in the history books for doing so. Granted though that makes more 1w2 then so 4w5, but that is primarily why 4 is last in my tri-type (it's still important to me though). What I worry about sometimes is that my achievments, my existence, could potentially go forgotten once I die, and that I would have lived the life of a nobody; accomplishing nothing without any memory of me to remain. I feel as though life would be worthless if I cannot become something of a great individual in the world, thus I aspire to greatness and grand recognition; to become a unique somebody. What makes me a 5 rather than a 3, is that I draw little influence from those of the external world; I feel that living up to the expectations of others is phony and inauthentic. Rather I derive my own sense of what I want to be; I always think and evnision what I could become in life and create my own sense of destiny. I'm also far more introverted and lost in my head like a 5 as opposed to the outgoing and energetic nature of a 3.

    I hope that helps.

  4. #4
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    "Balanced" wings generally means a person doesn't have a strong wing or one at all. They'll seem more like a "pure" type. Enneagram is kind of a spectrum...the wings allow types to blend into the next in varying degrees. Generally, a wing is a secondary emotional motivation that can be nearly as strong as the main one, or not very strong at all, depending on the individual. If a person can't discern a second motivation at all & doesn't strongly identify with a wing, then they may not really have a wing.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

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    Especially if there isn't anyone around versed in enneagram to evaluate the situation.

    thinking of you

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    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    From the http://www.enneagraminstitute.com:

    There is disagreement among the various traditions of the Enneagram about whether individuals have one or two wings. Strictly speaking, everyone has two wings—in the restricted sense that both of the types adjacent to your basic type are operative in your personality since each person possesses the potentials of all nine types. However, this is not what is usually meant by "having two wings," and proponents of the so-called two-wing theory believe that both wings operate more or less equally in everyone's personality. (For example, they believe that a Nine would have roughly equal amounts of his or her Eight and One wings.)

    Observation of people leads us to conclude that while the two-wing theory applies to some individuals, most people have a dominant wing.

    One other observation about wings is worth mentioning. In the course of teaching the Enneagram in workshops and Trainings, many people in the latter half of their lives have reported the development of their so-called "second wing." And in individuals who have been pursuing psychological and/or spiritual work, we have seen evidence that this is true.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe
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  7. #7
    Junior Member Nymma's Avatar
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    OrangeAppled and Savage Idealist: thank you for the information.

    Except for the outgoing, organized and social part, I relate to the 4w3 description. And the 4w5 one really really resonate with me.

    I don't care so much for shining for others, but I need to shine for myself, if you know what I mean. I need my existence to have eternal meaning, and for the meaning to be...uncomparable. I am my own judge, I set my own standards, which are, well, impossible to reach. I am not a "doing" person, though. I prefer to dream about it. But I need to create in order to be happy and satisfied, so...I have to seek undying uniqueness and authenticity, have to express myself and my perspectives through writing, and deliver the meaning I find to the world. I have a love and hate relationship with recongnition. I am stuck right now. I am an endless seeker, always looking for ways to express myself, on the lookout for how I could find things I lack. I see myself in what you have said about your goals in life, Savage Idealist.

    Hmm..but what if I have two very very stong wings? Perhaps I should have used the term"double wings" instead of balanced wings? I feel like I am mainly a Four, then nearly equally a Five, and then, almost as much a Three as a Five. Is it normal to have two extremly strong wings at 19 years old? I certainly haven't reached the"latter half of my life" yet. I think I am going to side with the two-wings beleivers...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymma View Post
    OrangeAppled and Savage Idealist: thank you for the information.

    Except for the outgoing, organized and social part, I relate to the 4w3 description. And the 4w5 one really really resonate with me.

    I don't care so much for shining for others, but I need to shine for myself, if you know what I mean. I need my existence to have eternal meaning, and for the meaning to be...uncomparable. I am my own judge, I set my own standards, which are, well, impossible to reach. I am not a "doing" person, though. I prefer to dream about it. But I need to create in order to be happy and satisfied, so...I have to seek undying uniqueness and authenticity, have to express myself and my perspectives through writing, and deliver the meaning I find to the world. I have a love and hate relationship with recongnition. I am stuck right now. I am an endless seeker, always looking for ways to express myself, on the lookout for how I could find things I lack. I see myself in what you have said about your goals in life, Savage Idealist.

    Hmm..but what if I have two very very stong wings? Perhaps I should have used the term"double wings" instead of balanced wings? I feel like I am mainly a Four, then nearly equally a Five, and then, almost as much a Three as a Five. Is it normal to have two extremly strong wings at 19 years old? I certainly haven't reached the"latter half of my life" yet. I think I am going to side with the two-wings beleivers...
    Sounds more like 4w5 more so than 4w3, although it is entirely possible that both your wing types are fairly strong, or that in terms of the tr-type, that 5 is one of your main types; being a 5w4 > 4w3 could give one the illusion that they may be 4w5, when in actuality it's just the influence of their 5 enneagram. Age my play a role as well, as most people still develop at least until their eraly to mid twenties or so.

    Also, I actually feel kinda honored in a way, that you share similar life goals as I do

  9. #9
    Junior Member Nymma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage Idealist View Post
    Sounds more like 4w5 more so than 4w3, although it is entirely possible that both your wing types are fairly strong, or that in terms of the tr-type, that 5 is one of your main types; being a 5w4 > 4w3 could give one the illusion that they may be 4w5, when in actuality it's just the influence of their 5 enneagram. Age my play a role as well, as most people still develop at least until their eraly to mid twenties or so.

    Also, I actually feel kinda honored in a way, that you share similar life goals as I do
    Re: goals--aww

    5w4 4w3...hmm, I have actually never thought of that option. I was going for a 4w5 7w6 1w9 tritype, but I suppose 4w3 5w4 1w9 or even 5w4 4w3 1w9 would be possible too. I had the greatest trouble deciding if my Head fix was a Seven or a Five... How can you tell the difference between a Seven integrated to Five and a Five disintegrated to Seven? And from a One disintegrated to four an a Four integrated to One? I have lots and lots of "One traits", more than I see in fellow Fours, so I was wondering...And while I'm asking the 47 comprehension questions, do you know something helpful about distinguishing a Five from a Four? Particularly between 4w5 and 5w4. Because I feel like both enneatypes fit me like a glove.

    Thanks a lot for all your help so far--you're a really helpful poster

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    Member Catharsis's Avatar
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    Fours base their identity on what differentiates them from others, which is simultaneously their source of their shame and justification of their existence. They wear their uniqueness with pride buit secretly long for the component they believe is missing in them but others possess. They hold an almost aggressive stance against anything "normal" or "mundane".

    Fives feel as if the world demands too much, and their response is to withdraw and hoard knowledge in order to prepare for anything that might be dangerous to them. This can lead to useless specialization in areas that are highly impractical and doesn't really help them function in the real world. They don't deal with emotion publicly, but in solitude.

    Fours are in the reactive triad (together with types 6 and 8), thus they want an emotional response from others when they are upset about something. Fives are in the competency triad (including types 1 and 3) and strive to approach problem solving with a logical and impersonal attitude.

    Fours are histrionic and dramatic, Fives schizoid and detached.
    INFP 5w4 Sx/So

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