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Thread: Phobic 6s

  1. #1
    Lay the coin on my tongue SilkRoad's Avatar
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    Default Phobic 6s

    There are a few other people on TypeC who identify as 6s, though not as many as there should be, I suspect. But most who do seem to identify as counterphobic. Anyone else out there see themselves as a phobic 6?

    I think whether you're mainly counterphobic or phobic you're likely to have aspects of both. I identify most with the description of 6 sp/sx that I read on Enneagram Underground, which includes the following:

    "Their intimates are very important. Their issues with security are focused on their loved ones; their anxiety is closely tied to the pulse and feedback of the people closest to them. They are less outwardly fearful than the self-pres/social. While mainly phobic, their counterphobic nature shows in their sense of fun. They are drawn to intensity, and are likely to overcome fear in order to engage in adventures."

    Certainly sounds a lot like me - I am definitely anxious but I generally look calm and non-fearful (those who know me better know more about my fears and anxieties), and I know I have a good sense of fun and adventure, which others also comment on.
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    No other phobic 6s? Really?! C'mon, own up!
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    Klingon Warrior Princess Patches's Avatar
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    I identify primarily as a phobic 6. But I also think it's a bit situational - There certainly are times when a more counter-phobic nature comes out. But I'm definitely more of a phobic 6.
    “Everybody has a secret world inside of them. All of the people of the world, I mean everybody. No matter how dull and boring they are on the outside, inside
    them they've all got unimaginable, magnificent, wonderful, stupid, amazing worlds. Not just one world. Hundreds of them. Thousands maybe.” -Neil Gaiman

    ~

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    Yay!

    I knew there were a few others out there. I agree that "situational" has a lot to do with it. I think Speed Gavroche, who identifies as counter-phobic 6, said something on another thread about how you might be a 6 if in a situation where everyone else is calm and laid back you're freaking out, and where everyone else is nervous and scared you're calm, confident, courageous and collected. I TOTALLY identified with that.

    Do you have an idea what your instinctual stacking is? Any comments about your phobic or counter-phobic moments? I'm all ears
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    Klingon Warrior Princess Patches's Avatar
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    I believe I am sp/sx as well. Also 6w5.

    I think my most clear examples of phobic vs counterphobic were when I was a kid, and how I dealt with my teachers as authority. With 90% of my teachers, I was a dream to have in class. Typical phobic in that I very much trusted them and liked them. But there were a few teachers that I was VERY abrasive with, usually because something they did made no sense. One teacher in particular used to have this public ranking system, where she had a 'clothes line' string, and each student had a little paper t-shirt with their name on it... And every time we took a test, she would pin the clothes up in order from highest to lowest scores. Well, that was all well and good for those of us who were on top, but the kids who were on the bottom would get REALLY upset about having it publicly displayed that they were on the bottom.

    I constantly publicly questioned her - not only about the clothes line, but every decision she made. When she was out of the room I would remove the T-shirts from the line. I started a petition protesting the display of the tshirt ranks, got the whole class to sign it, and took it to the school principal. The teacher would yell at me, and I would smile at her while she was yelling just to piss her off, because she always got quite angry when I did that. She also would make me sit in the corner facing the wall as punishment, and I would just sit there humming and smiling. I eventually got moved out of her classroom. I didn't find out until I was older, but apparently there was a big meeting with the teacher, my parents, the school psychologist, and the principal in which the teacher claimed that I was giving her panic attacks which she had to seek therapy/medication for. That blows my mind.

    But like I said, with 90% of the teachers... I was a little dream.

    I can't think of any major counterphobic examples recently. Mostly because lately the only authority I've dealt with is professors, and being abrasive with them is never a good idea. But I mostly like/trust all of them.
    “Everybody has a secret world inside of them. All of the people of the world, I mean everybody. No matter how dull and boring they are on the outside, inside
    them they've all got unimaginable, magnificent, wonderful, stupid, amazing worlds. Not just one world. Hundreds of them. Thousands maybe.” -Neil Gaiman

    ~

  6. #6
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    i very much swing between phobic and counter, i really couldn't identify myself as one or the other more. with people who make me feel safe and appreciated, i swing phobic, and with people who make me feel uncomfortable and used, i swing counter. i swing situationally as well... when the other person is making me feel safe and appreciated, i swing phobic, and when they are making me feel uncomfortable and used, i swing counter.

    in general i probably come to things with a more phobic outlook, but i have some of those typical cp self-protection habits like keeping mace and a heavy flashlight in my car, want to get licensed to own a handgun, use security systems and alarms, definitely lock things tight, etc. plus i am rather adventurous and a bit of a sensation-seeker... c:

    i also empathize with being on edge in situations where others are calm (sometimes even ordering food at the deli makes me a little nervous, in an odd way that i try to ignore), while i'm calm in crises. i think the former situation definitely has to do with "performance" - having one chance to get it right in front of others (given, if i stumble in my words, i can always correct myself, but there is still that layer of hyper-consciousness). crises are easy though. while everyone else is panicking, it suddenly seems like the way becomes clear. people aren't judging anymore. there's just something that needs to be done and me to do it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Patches
    I think my most clear examples of phobic vs counterphobic were when I was a kid, and how I dealt with my teachers as authority. With 90% of my teachers, I was a dream to have in class. Typical phobic in that I very much trusted them and liked them. But there were a few teachers that I was VERY abrasive with, usually because something they did made no sense.
    myself as well.

    i am having this problem with my boss at work right now. in general, i am a very good employee. i like knowing what i am supposed to do, and then doing it well. the problem currently is that what i am supposed to do keeps changing, with new things being suddenly added and taken away, my schedule constantly being changed when it is not supposed to be, and my boss cutting into my work by deciding to take on certain steps in whatever i am working on. all of this makes me extremely uncomfortable. i feel like it's my right to have static duties, a solid schedule, and steady tasks, because that is what was presented to me upon hire.

    a few nights ago, for example, it was looking like i would be able to leave work a little early, until my boss dumped 3 completely new tasks on me, speaking of them as if i'd always been supposed to do them, yet no one ever told me. i don't understand: if i've always been supposed to do them, why did no one tell me earlier? i was trained informally because it was a busy timespan, which has been used as explanation for why i was never provided with all the information or tools i needed. i'm supposed to have received a toolset; i never got one. i'm supposed to have been given a checklist; i only got it upon pestering a retired worker a month into my employment. often, when i asked a question, i would be told there was no time and we would get to it later. there was never time, though. i've had to figure most things out for myself. which is fine, but then don't get upset with me when i take a longer time to complete a task, or when i mess it up on my first try, or when you discover 3 weeks later that i'm doing some small detail wrong.

    plus - why wasn't i told about those extra tasks at the beginning of my shift, so i could adjust things accordingly? why is my schedule changed 2 days before i am supposed to work? i can hardly make plans as it is. why can't i have my own tasks to work on? i have no sense of pride in my work because my boss is constantly sweeping tasks out from under my feet - which pisses me off in particular because she takes it at the pleasant parts of the task... i do all the real legwork and then she gets the credit for finishing it up. so, as you can imagine, i am a bit of a fireball to her at work. i really don't want it to be this way. it gives me endless mental strife.

    tl;dr i just want to be happy and productive, but i need to have something consistent i can trust.

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    interesting...i'm just a six wing and i relate a lot to all of that.
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    I might be? since I don't really have problems with authority, or at least I wouldn't act out or say anything. I play well with others, lol.

    Not entirely sure how to tell, actually. How do you know? I didn't see anything mentioning either one in the enneagram site I explored.
    -end of thread-

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patches View Post
    I constantly publicly questioned her - not only about the clothes line, but every decision she made. When she was out of the room I would remove the T-shirts from the line. I started a petition protesting the display of the tshirt ranks, got the whole class to sign it, and took it to the school principal. The teacher would yell at me, and I would smile at her while she was yelling just to piss her off, because she always got quite angry when I did that. She also would make me sit in the corner facing the wall as punishment, and I would just sit there humming and smiling. I eventually got moved out of her classroom. I didn't find out until I was older, but apparently there was a big meeting with the teacher, my parents, the school psychologist, and the principal in which the teacher claimed that I was giving her panic attacks which she had to seek therapy/medication for. That blows my mind.
    It's funny, I thought at first I really couldn't relate to your example but on reflection I was kind of like this too, but to less of an extreme Mostly I was a delightful teacher's pet, well, not a suckup but I almost always did well, participated, was enthusiastic, etc etc. (In classes that I hated like math, I was more likely to just lie low). But there were a few teachers, just a few, who I got into arguments with and could be quite cheeky to on a regular basis, either because it seemed like the best way to interact with them or because I genuinely disliked them and thought they were jerks or abusing their authority in some way. I think when it did happen it shocked everyone because I was generally such a good student and so compliant. Kind of like people being shocked when they see me blunt, angry or confrontational now, because I'm usually so "laid back"

    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    i also empathize with being on edge in situations where others are calm (sometimes even ordering food at the deli makes me a little nervous, in an odd way that i try to ignore), while i'm calm in crises. i think the former situation definitely has to do with "performance" - having one chance to get it right in front of others (given, if i stumble in my words, i can always correct myself, but there is still that layer of hyper-consciousness). crises are easy though. while everyone else is panicking, it suddenly seems like the way becomes clear. people aren't judging anymore. there's just something that needs to be done and me to do it.
    Skylights, I didn't relate to all of your comments but the above, DEFINITELY. I can get freaked out and self conscious by things that should be routine and hardly bother anyone else. I was like this as a child too, hated making a fool of myself in social situations, talking on the phone, stuff like that and often assumed that I would. By contrast, if confronted with a tricky or pressurized situation when traveling alone or something like that, I can be so calm and cool and just do what needs to be done, even if difficult. Also when handling difficult people in a professional or private situation, people will be blown away by how cool I am and knowing the right things to do and say. In a travel situation, I'm actually more likely to become visibly anxious if I'm in a group and a difficult situation comes up. I'll feel like I don't know what to do and I want someone else to take all responsibility. Not always, but a lot of the time. Although I'm a good "team player" and work and interact well with friends and colleagues, I often feel more confident when left to my own devices, in some ways. In a group, I want someone else to take the lead and be strong and decisive. Group settings can somehow make me less confident and more insecure-seeming.

    Quote Originally Posted by Randomnity View Post
    I might be? since I don't really have problems with authority, or at least I wouldn't act out or say anything. I play well with others, lol.

    Not entirely sure how to tell, actually. How do you know? I didn't see anything mentioning either one in the enneagram site I explored.
    It's dealt with in more depth on some sites and in some books I've looked at. Some of them go so far as to refer to them almost as two separate types, phobic 6 and counterphobic 6. I think that's a bit too far as my impression is that people swing more one way than the other, but have aspects of both. It does help to illustrate how widely different 6s can be. I really like the Enneagram Underground website. It goes into phobic and counterphobic a bit though not in huge depth. I think it discusses a bit about which you are more likely to be dependent on your instinctual stackings. It looks like an sx-first 6 is more likely to be counterphobic, and sp-first is more likely to be phobic - not sure about so-first.

    The idea is that phobic 6s are more visibly timid and anxious, seeking security etc. Counterphobic 6s also feel anxious and uncertain but counteract it more by running toward the danger and taking it on in what could even seem a reckless way. If you're ISTP you're more likely to be counterphobic.

    I certainly see aspects of both in myself. It just depends on the situation. I'm more cautious and anxious and look before you leap so I judge myself to be more phobic. But I can also be very experimental and adventurous. I think it's just that I need to feel "safe" in some way (eg. a familiar environment, or if an unfamiliar environment, then a friend or friends who I feel safe with) before I get into the adventurous experimentalism. I am really almost incapable of leaping before looking. I think an INFJ 6 is much more likely to be phobic.
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